Germany to lead the way in cervical cancer vaccine

116 posts in this topic

On 12/5/2018, 8:56:13, swimmer said:

 

And also some oral cancers are HPV-related (irrespective of gender).   Cases of that are increasing.     The interview in which Michael Douglas linked his to oral sex made global headlines.

 

I had a friend in university once who was afflicted with something that caused her voice to slowly go from kinda scratchy and hoarse to eventually gone completely. At first she didn't know why, which is naturally scary, but at some point she simply said she'd explain it later and didn't want to give details. Fair enough.

 

In the end it turned out to be HPV on her vocal chords and other parts of her throat! This required many laser sessions to blast them off bit by bit, during which she wasn't to talk as part of recuperation. (At the time it wasn't clear how her voice would or would not be permanently altered... She's OK now). We don't have to wonder too much how they got there or why she'd want to keep it secret... 

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have been told I have to go to the EU human rights court as JA orders have more power than German law so there is no legal recourse in Germany. JA is not helpful to say the least. If any TTer has experience with the EU court (the one that tries to mitigate some of the JA damage) please PM me.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

54 minutes ago, sonazeit said:

I have been told I have to go to the EU human rights court as JA orders have more power than German law so there is no legal recourse in Germany.

 

Told by whom?!?!?!

 

You need to exhaust ALL local legal options before any European court will consider your case. Since you don't seem to have filed any law suits, there is nothing they can do.

 

Furthermore, it seems that the German court has ruled in favour of vaccinations: 

 

https://www.lto.de/recht/nachrichten/n/bgh-xiizb157-16-eltern-kind-impfung-streit-bedeutung/

 

Quote

 

JA is not helpful to say the least. If any TTer has experience with the EU court (the one that tries to mitigate some of the JA damage) please PM me.

 

Panda already told you how and where to start.

 

 

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, engelchen said:

 

 

Told by whom?!?!?!

 

You need to exhaust ALL local legal options before any European court will consider your case. Since you don't seem to have filed any law suits, there is nothing they can do.

 

I don't think sonazeit is interested in facts. I also don't think that this is really about the vaccination or the daughter.

 

Otherwise she could just ask the pediatrician if he (or she) doesn't make an appointment on Saturdays in a situation like the one here (allegedly). Or she could look for a pediatrician who has a Sprechstunde on Saturdays. There are at least two in Hamburg (one of them, Dr. Said in Blankenese offering only private consultations on Saturdays, but it can hardly fail if the vaccination is so urgently necessary).  

 

But that would probably be too easy, too little drama ... 

 

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, sonazeit said:

JA is not helpful to say the least.

 

1 hour ago, sonazeit said:

the JA damage

 

Sounds like somebody has already had a few run-ins with the JA.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No vaccination/sexual health advocacy group is going to interfere in a custody argument.

JA orders don't override a law. As the vaccination is not mandatory however, a custody agreement might; though if push comes to shove a court would likely side with the vaccinating parent.

I'm not so keen on the vaccinating on the sly approach, as the other parent would argue that you cannot be trusted to stick to a custody agreement and this might backfire.

I still wonder about the "physically blocked from seeing a doctor" - do not have unsupervised custody ? What happens in a emergency ? Who would take her to A&E ?

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 17/12/2018, 18:03:16, sonazeit said:

 He actually sat in the day care of the school every single day months on end to block my Mum and me form getting her her routine dental cleaning, and such normal stuff.

You mean I he blocked you from accessing your daughter outside what was agreed in the custody arrangement ? Because if you had custody (and could prove it) the school would have handed her over to you from day care. 

 

This does not make sense.

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It does if he has a restraining order against her. We've already established that she has weekend visitation and apparently has the kid for Christmas this year. Dad is the one with main custody, and, it sounds like maybe a restraining order against the mom ("against" the two of them parenting at the same time, physically "blocking" just by sitting there etc).

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/18/2018, 11:31:26, fraufruit said:

 

Sounds like somebody has already had a few run-ins with the JA.

 

OP sounds like she‘s a worrier and has probably driven the father so mad with her constant requests for excessive health care, among other things, that even the JA doesn’t want anything to do with her. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 17/12/2018, 17:05:04, sonazeit said:

 for my daughter to get the vaccine -before- infection?

To be honest, I live in the UK, the kids are vaccinated at school at the beginning of year  8, they are 12 at that point.  Very few of them are sexually active at that point, so insisting the kid must be vaccinated age 9 for the vaccine to work seems a tad hysterical.

 

It's quite hard to dig out age related data on genital warts, but for anyone who is interested here are some number from the UK (page 125 onwards)

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/713314/2017_Table_2__Selected_STI_diagnoses___rates_by_gender__sexual_risk___age_group.pdf

 

This shows that before they hit the 15-19 age group, warts are exceedingly rare.

 

 

 

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If your children don't have any use for going to the twice yearly dental cleaning and getting the HPV vaccine then I agree,skip it. For my daughter there is no upside to further delay. Fortunately, she matches well the german healthcare guidelines and does well when they are followed so I see no reason to block her. She wants to go to the dentist cleaning, the person who does it is nice to her, it's just down the street and doesn't take long. The encouragement helps her. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, sonazeit said:

For my daughter there is no upside to further delay.

 

Presumably you can however see that fighting tooth and nail at this point is premature? This reaction is hysterical. Most German kids, like British kids, have this vaccination later.

 

You said there were occasional days when you have your daughter - just make the appointment on one of those days. 

 

If you really cannot organise that, then Panda has told you a page ago who to go to for your first legal application. Start at the bottom of the slope and work your way up. All this European Court stuff is way over the top at this point.

 

De-escalation is a better tactic in life than escalation. There will be a way to sort this. 

 

 

 

 

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, kiplette said:

All this European Court stuff is way over the top at this point.

 

 

I get the feeling that is the only option she has. The father must have sole custody, otherwise she would have just taken care of it rather than looking for loopholes. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

She has to start local I think, as others have said, and work up, even if it is pointless. The dad never even saw the kid regularly up until recently. It would be a strange twist indeed if he now has sole custody. 

 

I recommend you read through some of the previous threads of this poster in an idle moment. With a beer or two. It is a strange tale and I spare many a thought for the little girl in this family.

 

In the end you may be right. It is never entirely obvious.

 

 

4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Any TTer know of someone who can convert a visitation agreement into calendar dates for 2019? This would help me plan better. My attorney advised me to take of the whole matter to EU level with an EU-level qualified practice when I asked her if she could provide calendar dates off of it.  No one seems to be able to convert it into calendar dates other than for a few dates a year. Each person starts off very confident telling me how simple it is to convert it into calendar dates and then after seeing all the rules is no longer sure of most of the net calendar dates taking into account all the rules.

In my area routine appointments need to be booked a half year in advance and I don't want to switch her pediatrician and dentist as they are really good and know her for years and are closeby.

 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Regarding going to the local Hamburg JA to advocate for my daughter's rights,

Well, here is the current situation, JA does not advocate for children but rather the income of various taxpayer-funded vendors which get orders from the courts and the JA. Advocating for children has been replaced by grooming products - children - for the lucrative Kinderheim industry. JA works for the Auftragnehmern, one child is circled by about 6 vultures all looking to profit off of him or her.

http://jugendamt-straftaten.de/jugendamt-die-angst-vor-der-oeffentlichkeit/

https://www.abendblatt.de/hamburg/article211906129/Jugendamt-Mitarbeiter-drohen-15-Jahre-Haft-wegen-Betrugs.html

It is rampant.

 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

well then I guess you are just completely screwed, eh?

 

maybe someone like Michael Avenatti would take your case to the highest levels of government - go for it!

 

 

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I get the impression you are taking some perverse pleasure in feeling so "blocked" - like the classic psychological game of "why don't you - yes, but" (you're the "yes, but" character in this scenario) but ratcheted up to really damaging levels.

 

that is no joke.  

3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now