Perpetual complaints about Germany

58 posts in this topic

 

but it's the last place I'd go for nightlife etc.

Eh? I've lived in London, love it and hate it. Would never live there again tho. To claim it's the last place you'd go for nightlife is bizarre in the extreme. It's very possibly the best city in the world (or at least one of the best) for nightlife. There is something to do 24/7 and for all tastes.

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I've found London quite the opposite really - It's the kind of city which is such a big name and gets so much fanfare that it can get away with practically anything. It's not only insanely overpriced, but surprisingly tame, with the majority of places closing so early it's laughable- even Dallas stays open later, and that's really sad. I dread to think what people from Barcelona think of London "nightlife". And then if you do try to stay out past midnight, you have the Third World train system to contend with, which also closes too early and strands you (and costs more than anywhere else on earth). London has some good museums and cultural attractions, as every big city does, but it's the last place I'd go for nightlife etc. Premium prices, poor quality.

yeah true about prices, was in Brixton Ghetto and rum and coke still expensive (4 pound 50p) even more ridiculously priced in central London. Bars and Clubs are more like European times now tho, staying open til 5 in the morn...although sad state of affairs since people falling out of alcohol establishments even more shitfaced than before...(in spain people dont go out til after midnight, but us brits go in for the long haul and slog it out all night and morning) ;)

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@chilekitty,

 

As for Spain, yeah it sounds sophisticated going out late but I remember speaking to someone Spanish in the UK and they said they liked going out earlier and coming home earlier (it was Opp North so a 3 am curfew!) - it meant they were fit for the next day...so as I like to say there are pros and cons for everything...

 

Says stanford who was clubbing until 8.30 in Munich on Saturday!!!

 

PS. Woz in Palma the other week and it did piss me off that all clubs finished at 6 on the dot...forcing club freaks to go to a far away (outside the city in the industrial areas - same use to happen in Barca) for after hour!!! Na ja you can't have everything...

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Hey Ulysses

 

What you on about ' go back to England and register with the BNP'

 

Do me a favour read what I say and dont come up with such banal comments.

 

Why dont you try and make a contribution to the thred insted slaging me off.

 

I understand some people like Germany and some do not.

 

i dont have a problem with that why should you

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it's the last place I'd go for nightlife

I think you went to the wrong places :) I had a wonderful time when I lived in London, Superman impressions notwithstanding. I wouldn't want to do it again - I'm older now and London is a dirty, noisy, busy city. Besides, I couldn't afford the place I lived in :)

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I understand some people like Germany and some do not. i dont have a problem with that why should you

Because you go out of your way to slag Germany and the Germans and rub your opinions under the noses of people who were generally very patient with your posts - not only on this thread but on others. Your attitude is fundamentally bellicose and antagonistic so don't be surprised if someone matches your aggression.

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Johnny N, I have never come across German managers that shout at their staff. Quite the contrary. May I ask what line of business you are in?

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I am not talking about German managers shouting at their staff. They dont very often.

 

Its about the senior managers at results and planning meetings, i have never seen anything like it. If someone makes a suggestion it is met with a very unpleasant attitude. So from what I can see they just let the top man go on and on and they say nothing. Of course I do say something as I work in germany, france and GB as a logistics consultant. I have the wider picture and try to get them to see that there are other ways of working. It is not easy in france but in Germany wow. I am based in germany and the problems realy stem from the culture. In the uk we have less supervision and staff are expected to work on their own initative, but not here. no one wants to take any resonsibility and spend all their time passing the buck and aviod being blamed for anything.

 

i am writing many reports on this problem as international companies just cannot understand how Germany works. i keep telling them they have believed all the hype about efficentcy etc. I think they are now believing me.

 

If you note there are very few non german/ germanic companies that succeed in Germany.

 

You can see the economic results from france and germany they are not doing as well as they should be but do not want to face up the the realities.

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@Johny Norfolk,

 

Interesting points you make about cultural differences and business.

 

When I worked in Finance...it was agreed in our international department that the French were the most difficult. Once we'd (the expats from all over Europe) got use to the Vier Augen process i.e. every process (I mean nearly every process) had to be signed of by a colleague, most things worked relatively okay.

 

I had one boss who detested the UK mentality and told me how can it be that the first queston asked by the Brits was "What are the rules" and the 2nd question being "What are the sanctions for breaking the rules" :)

 

I must say the German did get a bit nationalistic when working with the CBOT(i.e. we know business better than those stupid Amis) but other than that I did not think the cultural gap was that wide...but maybe I should be saying anything as I'm a business refugee and now camped back in the UK...

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@JN - if you don't already know his work, you might consider looking at Geert Hofstede (e.g. Cultures and Organisations: Software of the Mind)

He's done some interesting research on risk aversion, power distance etc and how they differ in various countries (including Germany, UK and France among many others) based on the different working styles of managers (he studied the different international subsidiaries of IBM).

He updated it in 2003, but the newer version will set you back 30 quid (the one I linked to is still valid and only costs around 7 quid).

There are a few generalisations in there, but on the whole it's good stuff.

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@JN - i see very similar things to what you mentioned in my german work environment.

 

@stanford - does CBOT = Chicago Board of Trade???

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"However they have accepted I was right "

 

There's the nut and a mirror of my former self. I decided a while back that I'd rather die happy than die right.

 

I haven't read this whole thread so I am not sure if the excellent health care in Germany has been mentioned. Anyone tried having "elective" surgery in the UK recently?

 

I'm just an Ami but I can't return to my country because I cannot get health insurance there because of an existing condition. Criminal, I tell ya.

 

The good news is that I love it here and, with the excellent health care, this is where I'm meant to be.

 

Happiness is a choice.

 

Frau Fruit

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I think cultural differences can be overplayed I used to work for a large American high tech company and the differences in management style between departments was quite dramatic, even if they were on the same site.

 

Also if you are in the Science or high tech sector the UK seems to be offering less and less opportunity these days.

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I find this and other threads here really interesting, considering my own love/hate/indifference relationship with germany. I just got back from four weeks in the states. My wife wants to stay there and not come back to germany, and now i’m going to quit my job here and go out and join her. While i was there, i was mostly thinking like yeah it is a lot better in america, better shops, better fresh local produce, friendlier, more relaxed, more fun etc. but then returning into berlin and riding the bus into the city from tegel, after a broken down subway in brooklyn, one outstandingly rude shopkeeper in manhattan, and a hellish jfk experience, i was like dang, this place doesn’t seem so bad after all. Its kind of clean and feels safe, and a lot of people seem pretty nice. What gets me down there is the amount of bullshit. Its hard to pinpoint bullshit, it just feels like being surrounded by an overwhelming amount of bullshit over there. Also the prospect of working my butt off with little to no vacation time, and being worried about missing time off work if i jappen to get sick seems depressing.

 

Overall i like the 9 weeks of vacation and rather relaxing pretty well paid job i have here. and especially the job security feels great here (i can’t help but feeling it might be a mistake to leave). i like the wider sidewalks, less crowded countryside, overall not as densely populated and more wilderness (although who knows how long that will last) you get in the states. And maybe there is more of a feeling of freedom and individuality in the us or the uk. Its also a bit hard to put a finger on it, but i like seeing a lot of weirdness, so a place like portland oregon is really a good place form me.

 

I think ist easy to bitch and moan about life in germany, and there’s nothing wrong with it for letting off steam. But i don’t think its so easy to really convincingly prove on a broad scale, that this place is worse than any where else. I wish i could really move around, lets see a year in portland oregon, then a year in london, then maybe rome, then sydney. If furnished apartments were like cheaper and easier to just rent by the month, and we could all just work anywhere we chose without any red tape involved, the world would be a better place. Having to pick and chose where to live and moving can really suck.

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While i was there, i was mostly thinking like yeah it is a lot better in america, better shops, better fresh local produce, friendlier, more relaxed, more fun etc.

I think it also depends where in Germany/America you are. When I was in small-town America there was nowhere to buy any "better fresh local produce". In fact, Wal-Mart plus one other bland supermarket were the only places to buy any produce at all. Here, I have a farmers market once a week and a regular market twice a week, all selling "better fresh local produce". I guess in Berlin you don't have this.

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probably berlin has some good farmers markets. a lot of german farmers markets are year round which is really great, i'm not sure quite as many are year round in the states. things being local of course depends on the climate and season too.

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that would be awful to have to shop for food at Walmart. vacuum cleaners or garbage bags maybe, but food, oh dear. one thing is weird too, if you go to the chain whole foods markets, they're pretty different on what they offer in new york, chicago and portland. new york had quite a bit of produce from oregon and california, definately not local.

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