Buying property in Germany

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RAISE the rents.  The house you showed has tenants in it already.  You cannot just jack up their rents as you please.

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you dont appear to be a mathematician...

 

one third of 21k is indeed 7k... but 21K -7k still leaves 14k...   

 

You threw in the "one third" ....   

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11 minutes ago, SpiderPig said:

you dont appear to be a mathematician...

 

one third of 21k is indeed 7k... but 21K -7k still leaves 14k...   

 

You threw in the "one third" ...   

What fun.  Now we are into arguing basic math.  You truely are an exceptional troll. 

 

In your original (now so completely debunked and ridiculed that you are even denying you said it) you made the supposition that the rent went down from 900€ per month to 300€ per month.  Any grade school kid without a learning disability (and even many who do) can tell you that 300€ is one third of 900€.  Therefore when calculating the rate of reduction for the 21,000 you would also have to calculate what one third of 21,000 is, no?  Following so far?  Unfortunately I cannot use crayons here to draw you little pictures. 

 

So, now get out you little calculator.  Type in 900 divided by 3.  What did you get?  300! Yes! Good little piggy! 

 

Now type in 21000 divided by three.  What did you get? 

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41 minutes ago, BradinBayern said:

You should have kept reading your own reference.

 

Page 2: 5 Gründe dafür, dass die Immobilienblase jetzt (noch) nicht platzt ( 5 reasons that the real estate bubble is not (yet) bursting)

 

The fact is and has been that German real estate in general and Berlin in particular had been in stasis during the Wall.  Once it came down and the capital moved to Berlin, there was a real estate rush to fill the vacuum.  As a major European capital, Berlin was far less expensive than anywhere else.  It had to catch up and investors and speculators did their part to bring DL up to a competitive market price.  At the same time, german rent controls artificially held on to below-market rates.  To the everyday german watching from within, he saw prices soaring (compared to the recent past), yet to the outside world, germany was far below the EU market and needed to rise.  What you see as a "bubble" the rest of us see as "competitive".  I think there is still a considerable differential between Berlin and Paris and London and maybe Rome.  Relatively "cheap" rent cannot go on.  And won't.

 

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2 minutes ago, catjones said:

You should have kept reading your own reference.

 

Page 2: 5 Gründe dafür, dass die Immobilienblase jetzt (noch) nicht platzt ( 5 reasons that the real estate bubble is not (yet) bursting)

 

The fact is and has been that German real estate in general and Berlin in particular had been in stasis during the Wall.  Once it came down and the capital moved to Berlin, there was a real estate rush to fill the vacuum.  As a major European capital, Berlin was far less expensive than anywhere else.  It had to catch up and investors and speculators did their part to bring DL up to a competitive market price.  At the same time, german rent controls artificially held on to below-market rates.  To the everyday german watching from within, he saw prices soaring (compared to the recent past), yet to the outside world, germany was far below the EU market and needed to rise.  What you see as a "bubble" the rest of us see as "competitive".  I think there is still a considerable differential between Berlin and Paris and London and maybe Rome.  Relatively "cheap" rent cannot go on.  And won't.

 

Could’nt agree more.  I foresee  ownership concept to germans will change out of  necessity not choice as  hard earned cash will be getting almost negative interest rates in banks, some hyperinflation coming will  further devalue cash in real terms thanks to government fiscal policies of printing endless supply of more cash at that stage you got to do something and borrowing interest rates at historic lows its no brainer I am finding yields  are quite to very poor in certain areas of berlin some place are 1-2%I prefer areas like  potsdam and wider  brandenburg region where can get almost 5% yields with long term tenants.

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17 hours ago, fraufruit said:

If had that kind of money laying around right now, I would invest half of it in stock and ETF's while they are dirt cheap. If I wanted to put the rest in real estate, I would wait until that market comes down as it surely will some time in the near future.

 

If you think the bottom is in now - you haven't seen nothing yet... we got a long way to go down still, as stocks are way over valued!

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10 hours ago, catjones said:

You should have kept reading your own reference.

 

Page 2: 5 Gründe dafür, dass die Immobilienblase jetzt (noch) nicht platzt ( 5 reasons that the real estate bubble is not (yet) bursting)

 

The fact is and has been that German real estate in general and Berlin in particular had been in stasis during the Wall.  Once it came down and the capital moved to Berlin, there was a real estate rush to fill the vacuum.  As a major European capital, Berlin was far less expensive than anywhere else.  It had to catch up and investors and speculators did their part to bring DL up to a competitive market price.  At the same time, german rent controls artificially held on to below-market rates.  To the everyday german watching from within, he saw prices soaring (compared to the recent past), yet to the outside world, germany was far below the EU market and needed to rise.  What you see as a "bubble" the rest of us see as "competitive".  I think there is still a considerable differential between Berlin and Paris and London and maybe Rome.  Relatively "cheap" rent cannot go on.  And won't.

 

BOTH articles written BEFORE corona.

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So you try to bolster your point and incorrect info with old and out of date facts....

 

I know a few people that bought property at the wrong time and found they had problems when they tried to sell or couldnt afford repayments, which can be true for any loan repayment.

 

Anyway... you can come back and have the last word....   

 

At least I Own my house outright... its done nothing but increase in price...  value has easilly trippled in 6 years... 

 

Please dont come back with pathetic percentages that you found on the net... 

 

 

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1 hour ago, wien4ever said:

 

If you think the bottom is in now - you haven't seen nothing yet... we got a long way to go down still, as stocks are way over valued!

 

That's why I haven't bought anything yet.

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Bubble, or no bubble, doesn't matter to me - for real estate, in my experience, the only thing that matters is: location.

 

My advice would be: get to know the area, where you plan to invest, really well. Get a feel for the "vibes" in that location. What does your own common sense tell you about it? Would you want to live there, and why? Does it feel like there's a future there, and why? 

 

Your mileage may vary, of course. So don't say "Karin told me to buy real estate" when you realize you won't become a millionaire quickly.

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2 hours ago, SpiderPig said:

So you try to bolster your point and incorrect info with old and out of date facts...

 

I know a few people that bought property at the wrong time and found they had problems when they tried to sell or couldnt afford repayments, which can be true for any loan repayment.

 

Anyway... you can come back and have the last word...   

 

At least I Own my house outright... its done nothing but increase in price...  value has easilly trippled in 6 years... 

 

Please dont come back with pathetic percentages that you found on the net... 

 

 

I stated in my first post that the info was published before the crisis.  Of course unless you are a time traveller you cannot post facts AFTER the crisis and any articles posted during the crisis are also going to be mere speculation,  The point being that there are legitimate reasons to believe that real estate was in a bubble (and of course other reasons to believe it was not)  I think it was. That is my opinion and it is based on the interpretation of facts. Others choose to look at the same facts and interpret it differently.  That is OK.  That is WHY the same magazine published pro and contra arguments.

 

However the ball game has changed.  I think there are a number of factors at play that will impact the real estate market - including things like how people work and how they shop as well as a general downturn in the economy - that will have an impact so I wouldn't choose to invest in real estate now. 

 

The fact that you bought your house at some other time and the value has gone up is irrelevant to now. Also "value" is only on paper until you go to sell.  That is why they always mention that past performance is not indicative of future results. That does not mean that someone buying now will do as well.

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9 hours ago, wien4ever said:

 

If you think the bottom is in now - you haven't seen nothing yet... we got a long way to go down still, as stocks are way over valued!

why do you think that ?

 

which bad news factors do you see coming down the road, which will force sell offs ?

 

I would like to understand your view of the future

 

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He was sooo buisy trying to prove me wrong... or maybe he is still looking for a way to try and impress you still... 

 

He even didnt beleive me when I told him how many places I have bought in DE... 

 

 

But I suppose I can forgive him... he is after all an EV driver.. even it was the wrong car he bought...  :lol:

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I was trying to keep it realistic...

 

Before I bought my house in FFB,   I had sold my property in Heimstetten and the money was in the bank.. 

 

Now, because the house I wanted to buy was advertised "Mit abris"... then the bank wouldnt lend me money for asking price.... I then got the owner to re-writed the advert and remove the "Mit abris" part and low and behold, the bank took interest in the purchase....  ( It was at this time that the increadible Starshollow steped in to assist me)... 
At this stage, I am "homeless" for 3 months ( even though I was living in the new place with the owners concent)... 

The Properties manager fro KSKMSE came and had a brew, a chat and looked at the property...but he couldnt make a descission on a mortgage as he was tied to his rules and regs... 

At the end of the day... I simply said to my bank manager... This is a simple case of "Do I earn sufficient money to fulfill the repayments on the loan...  To which he answered yes... Then I asked him why is it the banks concern then?

 

He had no answer...   Finally, I got the money and an offer of 25K on top!!  

 

 

I kept the place for 5 yrs, renovated and sold it....   My bank manager was happy with the return and couldnt beleive that there was such a large return on the investment.. 

 

 

When I bought this property... There were no such discussions.... They knew that I could turn things around... 

 

Fortunately... I didnt need a mortgage for this place, so they couldnt jerk me around!

 

 

Are you now going to tell me that the above is aso Not true?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Not even the experts can predict what will happen during such as time as we are going through.  There is still too much we do not know.

 

I think that there is going to be a huge economic downturn.  I don't think that most people who are not working in industry realized what sort of downturn we were already in before corona.  The stock market does not always reflect reality (or does so on a delay)

 

During the Wende, East Germany and Eastern Europe emptied out as people moved into the cities, driving the prices up dramatically.  As opportunity decreases and jobs go away, so will the people.  Just as happened with Central and South Americans in the US during the last economic downturn there.  From my experience with friends and family from the East, I already saw many people returning to where they had come from because they were tired of the stress and overcrowding and living costs were much less back home (and the risk of infection a lot less outside of the city). 

 

Since about 2000, we have been talking about "New Work" with workers working from remote locations, students learning in distance learning, etc.  This never really caught on in significant numbers.  Too few bosses or universities had any real experience with distance programs before corona.  Now massive numbers of people are working and studying remotely. Companies who were set up for remote work and education that was set up for distance learning will come out of this much better than those who were not.  This will have a lasting impact on the acceptance of many aspects of "New Work" (hopefully not the "gig economy" though) and on society in general.  I see that we will really begin to see 

 

So in my opinion (and it is just my opinion before the screechy noises begin again) there are four factors:

1) Real estate is priced out of reach of the poor and middle class

2) Job opportunities dramatically decrease. Income will decrease. Rental income will decrease

3) Significant populations do not have roots in the cities

4) A greater acceptance of remote workers, distance learning etc. due to the corona crisis

 

I think these factors coming together (and the fact that I believe that real estate was in a bubble already) will mean that people will no longer be able to afford the high rents and there will be a reversal of the tendencies of the last decades. People will seek out lower cost housing in areas with overall lower living costs. 

 

Do I have statistics to back this up?  No.  Does anyone? No. 

 

OK, now let the screechy noises begin. 

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2 minutes ago, BradinBayern said:

 

 

So in my opinion (and it is just my opinion before the screechy noises begin again) there are three factors:

1) Real estate is priced out of reach of the poor and middle class

2) Job opportunities dramatically decrease. Income will decrease. Rental income will decrease

3) Significant populations do not have roots in the cities

4) A greater acceptance of remote workers, distance learning etc. due to the corona crisis

 

 

 

Proof you cant read or comprehend... 

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