Siezen or Duzen?

[Fietsrad 385]

One of the things I remember from starting to learn German is the Sie/Du dichotomy, trying to figure which form is appropriate in which situation. If in doubt, one was advised to use Sie.

 

What can one do if one is inappropriately Duzed?

 

Has the situation changed since the school books were written, 1969?

Or am I getting older?😉

[BobbyDigital 694]

Wait, as a non-German, you are offended if someone Dus you? The "rules" have not changed, although in small-town Bavaria it's normal to du people.

[toBnruG 1,152]

I would file a police report. Deformation of character, public humiliation, slander... the possibilities are endless.

[BobbyDigital 694]

True, this is definitely a Beleidigung!

[karin_brenig 680]

simple, if you think you are being "inapropriately" addressed with a "Du", tell them in a professional/courteous way - something like "Entschuldigung, ich würde es bevorzugen, wenn wir beim Sie bleiben. Vielen Dank."

Or, if you are in an argumentative situation/mood, you could say "hä ? sind wir zusammen auf der Schulbank rumgerutscht, oder was ? Für Dich bin ich immer noch Sie."

 

Outside the context of social media, fitness center, or Stammtisch/Verein the rule is still "Sie" for everybody, unless otherwise negotiated.

[karin_brenig 680]

38 minutes ago, BobbyDigital said:

Wait, as a non-German, you are offended if someone Dus you? The "rules" have not changed, although in small-town Bavaria it's normal to du people.

 

Using "Du" without prior negotiation creates a "hierarchie". The one being addressed as "Du" is perceived as being of "lesser" status/value. So, depending on the situation/context, it could be a deliberate offense (if the one using the unwanted Du has a certain minimum grasp of German language and culture).

[fraufruit 41,924]

2 hours ago, Fietsrad said:

What can one do if one is inappropriately Duzed?

 

File it away under "small stuff" and have a nice day.

[karin_brenig 680]

6 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

 

File it away under "small stuff" and have a nice day.

 

whether that is "small stuff" depends on the situation - in my opinion.

 

I remember when my boss said things like "Karin, mach' mir mal Kaffee und dann beeil' Dich mit den Lochaufträgen von Firma XYZ, die sind schon überfällig". It took me all my courage (and half a year of feeling offended and degraded) before I dared to reply to that with "also, Harald, wenn ich Dir jetzt erst noch Kaffee machen soll werden die Lochaufträge von Firma XYZ nie fertig."

[BethAnnBitt 2,904]

1 hour ago, karin_brenig said:

whether that is "small stuff" depends on the situation - in my opinion.

 

I remember when my boss said things like "Karin, mach' mir mal Kaffee und dann beeil' Dich mit den Lochaufträgen von Firma XYZ, die sind schon überfällig". It took me all my courage (and half a year of feeling offended and degraded) before I dared to reply to that with "also, Harald, wenn ich Dir jetzt erst noch Kaffee machen soll werden die Lochaufträge von Firma XYZ nie fertig."

Unfortunately most women of a certain age can relate to such a situation in the office.   But IMO the boss was gonna bully you whether “Sie” or “du” was used, and the real moral of the story is that you learned to stand your ground, which is a cross cultural issue, which is why some of us see it as “small stuff”.  Obviously the wiring on how to offend/be offended can vary tremendously btwn cultures.  I’m glad you learned how to fire back at the jerk.  

[BobbyDigital 694]

4 hours ago, karin_brenig said:

 

Using "Du" without prior negotiation creates a "hierarchie". The one being addressed as "Du" is perceived as being of "lesser" status/value. So, depending on the situation/context, it could be a deliberate offense (if the one using the unwanted Du has a certain minimum grasp of German language and culture).

I don't need it explained to me what the differences are, I've finally figured it out after 14 years of being here. (/s)

 

My point is that the OP hasn't grown up like this (feeling the need to be addressed as higher than someone else)- so why is this bothering them.

[BobbyDigital 694]

Meanwhile the rest of the world just live like savages because we address everyone as "you" and have no other way of determining respect for others.

[snowingagain 5,184]

14 minutes ago, BobbyDigital said:

Meanwhile the rest of the world just live like savages because we address everyone as "you" and have no other way of determining respect for others.

 

Hardly the rest of the world.  

[maxie 602]

51 minutes ago, BobbyDigital said:

My point is that the OP hasn't grown up like this (feeling the need to be addressed as higher than someone else)- so why is this bothering them.

 

If the person is using Du as a power play or as a way to make a point, the OP is better off knowing his or her intentions. It all depends on the context and the setting as well as the speakers. 

 

49 minutes ago, BobbyDigital said:

Meanwhile the rest of the world just live like savages because we address everyone as "you" and have no other way of determining respect for others.

Ever heard of French? 

[BobbyDigital 694]

43 minutes ago, snowingagain said:

 

Hardly the rest of the world.  

 

7 minutes ago, maxie said:

 

Ever heard of French? 

 

OK OK, this is a forum for English speakers, so I'll rephrase- the English speaking world, at least, live like savages because we cannot show respect to others...

I have heard of French, I have no idea if there is a Sie and du in French (why would I?)

Sure, if the person means it to be demeaning (again- as you and you are the same to me, it wouldn't really bother me if they dued me)- but OP phrased it as a general question.

[JG52 1,018]

2 hours ago, BobbyDigital said:

Meanwhile the rest of the world just live like savages because we address everyone as "you" and have no other way of determining respect for others.

 

Au contraire, those who address me bow politely and say "your highness".  At least that's what I think they are mumbling.

 

1 hour ago, BobbyDigital said:

I have heard of French, I have no idea if there is a Sie and du in French (why would I?)

 

It is a rather obscure language and not spoken in polite settings; however, French does have the formal "vous" and informal "tu".

 

[JG52 1,018]

9 hours ago, Fietsrad said:

One of the things I remember from starting to learn German is the Sie/Du dichotomy, trying to figure which form is appropriate in which situation. If in doubt, one was advised to use Sie.

 

When I first met my future inlaws, I used "Sie" exclusively in my broken German because I could conjugate the verbs easier.  When they insisted I use "du", I was again a fish out of water.

[Dembo 493]

Being geduzt could be seen as a compliment. I'd be quite insulted if in an informal environment somebody used du with a few people and then turned to me and said Sie. It kind of says "you're not welcome. You're not our friend". etc.

 

Everybody talks about du vs Sie and forgets ihr. I find that harder: to my English brain it makes no sense to use different words for talking to 1 person or to 2.

[BethAnnBitt 2,904]

4 minutes ago, Dembo said:

Being geduzt could be seen as a compliment. I'd be quite insulted if in an informal environment somebody used du with a few people and then turned to me and said Sie. It kind of says "you're not welcome. You're not our friend". etc.

I hear you.  At the school I work for I am on “du” terms with the principal cuz we know each other from when she lived in the US.  With everyone else she’s “Sie”.  When she offered me the job I asked her if I should use “Sie” at work with her.  😂  She said for me not to worry about it and no one would care, and she was right.  Was weird for me initially but I got used to it.  She treats every employee very respectfully anyway.

 

[john g. 37,680]

I had a ohkne call ftom an insurance company re a client a couple  of days ago. Ut started with " hellio Jihn. My name is..." He adjed me if I wished to soeak jn German ir English abd I told him German was fine by me.

So he started agwin " hello, Herr Gunn! Sie haben bei uns bla bla@...

 

He is German but told me he gad wirked for an expat insurance clmpsny in Taiwan before!

 

[Dembo 493]

20 minutes ago, BethAnnBitt said:

I hear you.  At the school I work for I am on “du” terms with the principal cuz we know each other from when she lived in the US.  With everyone else she’s “Sie”.  When she offered me the job I asked her if I should use “Sie” at work with her.  😂  She said for me not to worry about it and no one would care, and she was right.  Was weird for me initially but I got used to it.  She treats every employee very respectfully anyway.

 

 

I imagined that sort of scenario when I came to Germany - i.e. that I'd use Sie with the boss at work to show respect but could duzen outside of work. But my employer has a policy of everyone using du so I haven't actually experienced the awkwardness very much. 

 

It's interesting that a lot of companies are now advertising using du. When I was looking for a new phone provider I think it was Vodafone and T-Mobile that use du, and O2 still used Sie. Near here that was an advertising board for Rewe with "Ihr Markt" and over the road at the bio-supermarket it was "dein Markt". I'm sure Sie's days are numbered; another 10-20 years and hardly anyone will be using it.