Making a last will and testament

72 posts in this topic

and on that note, if you have not had "the talk" with your parents or loved ones, please do. It is so much easier and less painful to ask them what they would like to have happpen...before it happens.

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I totally agree, Tor..no one wants to really die tomorrow ( because mostly we have plans for Mondays! :) )..but..shit happens. Talking about this this very weekend with my partner. " So what should we do with you? ". Me " Burn me ".. " Yep, that´s common these days but who pays?"...´nuff said! Get the stuff written down and make sure someone knows where to find your list of what-to-do-if! (Including insurances, friends to contact, stuff to cancel ).

 

This is all the more important if you´re living in another country to the rest of the family and/or official institutions (eg Finanzamt et al)

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A lot of people think that making a will is just asking for death. Well, I made my will at the end of 1999 and I'm still ali

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Costs for a notarial will (notarielles Testament) which is prepared and sworn to in front of a Notary depend on what you're worth, e.g.

5.000,- € 42,- €

20.000,- € 72,- €

50.000,- € 132,- €

100.000,- € 207,- €

...

 

What's to stop someone just lying. For example, they write a will by hand that says they want to leave everything to blah blah blah, and the notary asks "what are you worth", and knowing the above in advance, you say that currently you'd guess about 4.900 euros. Then a year later when you mysteriously die, leaving 5 million in cash and 4 million in property, that original notar isn't around to witness your evil plan. Surely you don't have to state in your testament how much each person is getting from the will, because it would need to be regularly updated to remain accurate.

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Haven't seen a word related to a single like me: Not married, no partner, but an Ausländer with one child (30) living somewhere else in Germany and have assets (except property) both here and in the U.S..

 

My daughter is named beneficiary on my German and U.S. bank accounts...does this make any difference or do my assets automatically go to her anyway?

 

Thanks all.

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I have a slightly different question. I (British) and my wife (German) are currently domiciled in the UK but are returning to Germany this summer.

 

If I make a will whilst still here in the UK (in English, witnessed by a soliitor) - is there any reason why I would have to make a new one (in German) later in the year? Or - as with other documents - should I have the English will officially translated into German & stamped?

 

Perhaps someone has concrete experience of such a situation and can advise.

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Given that a UK will can by typed (whilst a German one must be hand-written) the above is an interesting question.

My understanding is that a will in Germany can be written in any language(?)

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Artikel 26 EGBGB

Verfügungen von Todes wegen

 

(1) Eine letztwillige Verfügung ist, auch wenn sie von mehreren Personen in derselben Urkunde errichtet wird, hinsichtlich ihrer Form gültig, wenn diese den Formerfordernissen entspricht

 

1. des Rechts eines Staates, dem der Erblasser ungeachtet des Artikels 5 Abs. 1 im Zeitpunkt, in dem er letztwillig verfügt hat, oder im Zeitpunkt seines Todes angehörte,

2. des Rechts des Ortes, an dem der Erblasser letztwillig verfügt hat,

3. des Rechts eines Ortes, an dem der Erblasser im Zeitpunkt, in dem er letztwillig verfügt hat, oder im Zeitpunkt seines Todes seinen Wohnsitz oder gewöhnlichen Aufenthalt hatte,

4. des Rechts des Ortes, an dem sich unbewegliches Vermögen befindet, soweit es sich um dieses handelt, oder

5. des Rechts, das auf die Rechtsnachfolge von Todes wegen anzuwenden ist oder im Zeitpunkt der Verfügung anzuwenden wäre.

Ob der Erblasser an einem bestimmten Ort einen Wohnsitz hatte, regelt das an diesem Ort geltende Recht.

 

(2) Absatz 1 ist auch auf letztwillige Verfügungen anzuwenden, durch die eine frühere letztwillige Verfügung widerrufen wird. Der Widerruf ist hinsichtlich seiner Form auch dann gültig, wenn diese einer der Rechtsordnungen entspricht, nach denen die widerrufene letztwillige Verfügung gemäß Absatz 1 gültig war.

 

(3) Die Vorschriften, welche die für letztwillige Verfügungen zugelassenen Formen mit Beziehung auf das Alter, die Staatsangehörigkeit oder andere persönliche Eigenschaften des Erblassers beschränken, werden als zur Form gehörend angesehen. Das gleiche gilt für Eigenschaften, welche die für die Gültigkeit einer letztwilligen Verfügung erforderlichen Zeugen besitzen müssen.

 

(4) Die Absätze 1 bis 3 gelten für andere Verfügungen von Todes wegen entsprechend.

 

(5) Im übrigen unterliegen die Gültigkeit der Errichtung einer Verfügung von Todes wegen und die Bindung an sie dem Recht, das im Zeitpunkt der Verfügung auf die Rechtsnachfolge von Todes wegen anzuwenden wäre. Die einmal erlangte Testierfähigkeit wird durch Erwerb oder Verlust der Rechtsstellung als Deutscher nicht beeinträchtigt.

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@ Bob Loblaw re Post #30

 

I'm sure you meant well but, since you've been a TTer for nearly 8 years, you should know better than to post your entire text in German. Seeing as how the entire EGBG is available in translation anyway I think it would have just made it simpler for everybody with an interest in it to have quoted it in English.

 

 

Art. 26

Dispositions mortis causa (wills)

(1) A testamentary disposition, also when it is made by several persons in the same document, is valid as regards form if its form complies with the formal requirements

1. of the law of the country of which the testator, without regard to article 5 subarticle 1, was a national at the time when he made the testamentary disposition or at the time of his death,

2. of the law of the place where the testator made the testamentary disposition,

3. of the law of the place where the testator had his domicile or habitual residence either at the time when he made the testamentary disposition, or at the time of his death,

4. so far as immovables are concerned, of the law of the place where they are situated, or

5. of the law which governs the succession or would govern at the time when the disposition was made.

The determination of whether or not the testator had his domicile in a particular place is governed by the law of that place.

(2) Subarticle 1 is also applicable to testamentary dispositions revoking an earlier testamentary disposition. The revocation is also valid as regards form if it complies with any one of the laws according to the terms of which, under subarticle 1, the testamentary disposition that has been revoked was valid.

(3) Any provision of law which limits the permitted forms of testamentary dispositions by reference to the age, nationality or other personal conditions of the testator, shall be deemed to pertain to matters of form. The same rule shall apply to the qualifications that must be possessed by witnesses required for the validity of a testamentary disposition.

(4) Subarticles 1 to 3 shall apply mutatis mutandis to other dispositions mortis causa.

(5) Otherwise the validity of a disposition mortis causa and its binding force are governed by the law which would have been applicable to the succession at the time the disposition was made. The testamentary capacity, once it has been acquired, shall not be adversely affected by the acquisition or loss of legal status as a German.

Source: Introductory Act to the German Civil Code (EGBGB)

 

2B

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In so many words - a valid will typed up in English conforming to UK law has validity in Germany.

 

Thanks

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On 9/9/2010, 1:00:50, pike said:

 

Costs for a notarial will (notarielles Testament) which is prepared and sworn to in front of a Notary depend on what you're worth, e.g.

5.000,- € 42,- €

20.000,- € 72,- €

50.000,- € 132,- €

100.000,- € 207,- €

...

The cost doubles for joint wills, and 25% is added on for the certification.

 

How is one's worth actually ascertained?  What evidence does a Notar require when a will is made? In our situation, my husband and I share a mortgaged house in Germany (50/50 Grundbuch).  How is the property worth calculated at this point in time?  I think I saw an unanswered question in this thread about what's to stop anyone omitting assets or lying? We want to do everything properly though.  We currently have hand written wills though wish to formalize particularly as we have a child (my daughter, husband's step daughter) and the fact that my husband's family (mother, sister) would undoubtedly contest anything other than a rock solid will.

 

I had read though can't find the reference, that there is the notarielles will (NW) based on worth but also another form of will which can be lodged somewhere formal that costs a fraction of the NW.  Can anyone point me in the right direction for that option?

 

As I have a mortgaged property in the UK solely in my name, bought before my marriage, do I have to make a separate UK will for that plus any other remaining UK assets? 

 

We've had some fairly conflicting advice from lawyers so far which has meant we've pushed the issue back more and more.  Now  officially off the getroundtoit list! 

 

 

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Thank you Malt-Teaser, that is very helpful. And thank you for being my mentor today :).

 

I still can't quite grasp from googling how one's worth is calculated and what kind of evidence is necessary.  We pretty much only have our mortgaged house here in Germany. Are other assets like personal belongings relevant? Not that we have a Ming collection or anything similarly valuable.

 

From my google efforts, it sounds to me that a Notar takes off 50% of loans in calculating the Notar costs. So is that price of the house purchase minus 50% of mortgage loan? For the sake of example and round numbers...we bought our house for 300.000 with a mortgage of 200.000. Does that make our worth 200.000 (300.000 - 50% of 200.000)?

 

We are both apprehensive that without a rock solid will, our parents and step parents are highly likely, no, will make claim on our estate.  God forbid, if anything happens to us all (me, husband and kiddo), we would want to distribute to our named dearest friends and animal charity. 

 

 

 

 

 

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You're welcome.

When it comes to property I have no idea, sorry.

 

If you have any valuable collections, art ... etc then that has to be included. When I was going through the inheritance process the chappie at the Amtsgericht even asked if there were any laptops / computers ... etc involved. Also any valuable collections or pieces of art and such like. My wife didn't even have a mobile phone as she was more of a Luddite than I am :lol:

There is a limit to what is valuable, many things are just 'household items' and not really relevant although if you have things not of much value that you want to go to certain people you should say that in your will.

 

In my case just our daily crockery is all Bunslau that my wife collected because a grandmother came from that area. It's of no real value but I would like it to remain in my wife's family along with a few other things so I'll be mentioning that in my will.

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I am in the process of getting amicably divorced in the UK and once that is complete i need to make a will.

 

Having been stung by a Notary's fees here for something to do with being executor of my Father's Will (240€ to get something witnessed, my sister in the U.K. paid £16), I am wondering if I can have the Will prepared in the UK by a solicitor there and if it will be valid here if I die here. Does anyone know?

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My parents, alive, bless them, live in a property that I own. Since the funds for this property was given by them, I morally feel like it's theirs in case I die.

 

Can i write a will that explicitly lists them as the beneficiary for this property and prevent my future wife (I am still single) from successfully challenging this will.

 

In case I am survived by my parents I don't want an ambitious wife to throw them out to a street.

 

 

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On 23.10.2016, 13:26:37, Auntie Helen said:

I am in the process of getting amicably divorced in the UK and once that is complete i need to make a will.

 

Having been stung by a Notary's fees here for something to do with being executor of my Father's Will (240€ to get something witnessed, my sister in the U.K. paid £16), I am wondering if I can have the Will prepared in the UK by a solicitor there and if it will be valid here if I die here. Does anyone know?

@ Auntie Helen,please feel free to read some of the previous posts on this thread - this one, for instance:

 

On 26.4.2015, 20:54:29, john_b said:

In so many words - a valid will typed up in English conforming to UK law has validity in Germany.

 

Thanks

 

# note to self - it really is time to get your arse in gear and at least write something!

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48 minutes ago, Aihal said:

My parents, alive, bless them, live in a property that I own. Since the funds for this property were given by them, I morally feel like it's theirs in case I die.

 

Can I write a will that explicitly lists them as the beneficiaries for this property and prevent my future wife (I am still single) from successfully challenging this will?

 

A will won't help, the spouse has a legal claim to a share of at least half of what you owned when you died, should you die without a will.

If you have kids her legal share would be 50% of your assets, if you do not have kids 75%.

 

The minumum amount she then still has to get (= Pflichtteil) even if you cut her out of your will, will be half of that legal share, i.e. at least 25%/37.5% go to her.

 

If you have enough assets so that that apartment is worth less than all the Pflichtteile (kids also have Pflichtteile), then you can leave it to your parents and they will get it.

Or you could just do an Ehevertrag with her in front of a Notar when you get married, in which you exclude/reduce your wife's Pflichtteil, see the section starting with "Erbrecht" in here: http://www.notarin-jaenicke.de/leistungen/familie/ehevertrag/

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