Habeck claims anyone could quite easily use 10% less energy

306 posts in this topic

9 minutes ago, mtbiking said:

This has the potential to get ugly (also for electrical car owners).

 

I'll let you know when we have to pay € 180 to charge our car.

 

B)

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2 hours ago, fraufruit said:

 

I'll let you know when we have to pay € 180 to charge our car.

 

B)


I hope it won’t happen - but I’m having a bit of trouble distinguishing between fearmongering and objective reporting about energy prices at the moment, which I need to be able to do in order for example to decide whether to order an expensive albeit quick to deliver photovoltaic system.

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No-one knows. Heat pumps are flavor of the month at the minute, but they cost a lot and are unsuitable for many dwellings. I do not quite understand how they work, so I would not get one.

 

Best to save/not use as much as possible, perhaps you can buy warm clothes cheap now, in summer?

 

I bet many people could save more than 10%😉

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It doesn't seem likely energy prices will be falling any time soon and those that are able to generate their own are going to be laughing. €30K is a lot to spend but presumably your children will get that €30K (and more) back when they sell your house after your dead.

 

Here I have all heating and electricity included in the Warmmiete and the Vermieterin has just put the rent up by €50pm because of all this. I've no idea whether that's reasonable or not.

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1 hour ago, fraufruit said:

I would say do it if you can afford it. Good for your wallet in the end and good for the environment.


Afford it is no problem, it’s just goes against my general principles of not spending (substantial)  money in anything that’s not publicly traded nor can be rented. But I think that in this case I’m opening an exception.

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12 minutes ago, Dembo said:

It doesn't seem likely energy prices will be falling any time soon and those that are able to generate their own are going to be laughing. €30K is a lot to spend but presumably your children will get that €30K (and more) back when they sell your house after your dead.

 

Here I have all heating and electricity included in the Warmmiete and the Vermieterin has just put the rent up by €50pm because of all this. I've no idea whether that's reasonable or not.

 

nahh, in 30 years I’m counting to be very much alive and the system is worth basically €0. Regarding your second point, and you can trust me on this, if you heat with gas €50pm is probably less than it should be so very reasonable and you may be facing a backpayment.

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3 hours ago, Fietsrad said:

I am already quite parsimonious with energy. In winter I go for a walk before bedtime to get a bit tired and save using the heating. Oftentimes I see, through windows without curtains or shutters, people inside wearing t-shirts! They could put jerseys on and save 11%.

 

As for nuclear, the waste has to be stored for very many years, hundreds or thousands. The chance of a katastrophe may be small but it might be a very big katastrophe.

A Greek neighbour's grandson on Crete, married, one small child, small house, I guess with a washing machine and probably having to use their air conditioner because of the heat, has just got his quarterly electricity bill: 2,500 euros. Average wage on Crete: 900 euros a month.

 

I guess we ain't seen nothing yet.  It'll definitely lead to even more small businesses, tavernas etc, going broke.

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42 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

 

Then they have to wash/dry them. B)

Just read some more tips for saving energy: wash less, and at lower temperatures. The jersey could soon be like a sheepskin with a particular odor😉

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2 hours ago, fraufruit said:

 

Then they have to wash/dry them. B)


I just leave the dirty clothes in the machine room and they magically appear washed and folded on my bed :P

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9 hours ago, Dembo said:

Here I have all heating and electricity included in the Warmmiete and the Vermieterin has just put the rent up by €50pm because of all this. I've no idea whether that's reasonable or not.

If the house is heated by gas, it is. My son´s landlord increased the utility flat rate by € 90 (from €70 to €160, for a 54 sqm flat).

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A split aircon can also be used for heating. That´s how a lot of houses are heated here in Cyprus. As long as the outside temperature isn´t loo tow (say below -5°C) that´s very economical. Aircons are heat pumps, after all. You can buy an aircon sufficient to heat a large room for about € 600 (plus labour for installing it). Last winter, I have hardly used my central heating (which runs on oil).

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2 hours ago, jeba said:

If the house is heated by gas, it is. My son´s landlord increased the utility flat rate by € 90 (from €70 to €160, for a 54 sqm flat).

 

It's underfloor heating, which presumably comes from a (ground sourced) heat pump that heats the whole building. So it should be pretty efficient, but obviously uses electricity as do I and that is getting more expensive too.There are no individual meters, so there's no way of knowing who uses what.

 

This means i have no incentive to save energy, but the landlord does. Which is good; there must be a lot of people renting freezing, badly insulated Wohnungen where the landlord won't improve the building, becuase why should he?, and the tenant is stuck with high bills. 

 

 

 

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18 hours ago, Tap said:

 

That's my opinion too.  They were coping with Chernobyl, it was very old technology and measures were being taken to avoid something like that happening again.  But once Fukushima happened, the outcry was huge and the government here desperately wanted to hold onto power.  Agreeing to shut down all the nuclear power stations in Germany was a popular decision.  Unfortunately, we may all be paying a price for that now.

Fukoshima was as old as Chernobyl and the Japanese Yakuza had prevented maintenance for years, to keep profits high.

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Heat pump: typically German: complicated, smells of work😉

 

The chance of a nuclear katastrophe might be very small, but the katastrophe might be very big, no-one knows. Better to use other sources and to save, save, save.

..

Why do we talk about 'saving' as if we were storing money in a Sparschwein/piggy bank? "Using less" might be a better phrase.

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On 15/08/2022, 08:49:22, SunshineMarty said:

True, if you are going to do it then there should have been a better strategy. Just shows how bad the original decision was. All implications should have been considered

 

Reminds me of a saying I heard the other day which went something like

"If you are in a dark room and you can only see by the light of a candle, you'd best make absolutely sure the light switch works before you blow out the candle".

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On 16/08/2022, 07:19:37, Dembo said:

It's underfloor heating, which presumably comes from a (ground sourced) heat pump that heats the whole building. So it should be pretty efficient, but obviously uses electricity as do I and that is getting more expensive too.There are no individual meters, so there's no way of knowing who uses what.

 

This means i have no incentive to save energy, but the landlord does. Which is good; there must be a lot of people renting freezing, badly insulated Wohnungen where the landlord won't improve the building, becuase why should he?, and the tenant is stuck with high bills. 

 

In the UK every rental property need and energy certificate (EPC). Every 5 years or so they require an increasing standard in order to be able to rent the property through a rental agency, which is how most UK property is rented. So if the landlord doesn't improve the energy standard, basically they can't rent it out.

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On 8/15/2022, 4:17:15, mtbiking said:

a 12 kWp photovoltaic system + battery at their place for €30,000

 

In 2019 we installed 9kWp, ohne Aku, for ca 13k (including MwSt, which we got back). So 30k for 12kWp + Akku seems overpriced. And they keep telling us PV is getting cheaper, so the system now should cost less than in 2019, not more.

After analyzing 1yr of our own data on a daily basis, collecting a bunch of Akku quotations, and assuming 3% electricity inflation, it turned out Akku costed at the time TEN TIMES what they would have saved us on electricity bill. Not 10% or 100% more, rather 1000% more. Maybe 3% electricity inflation was optimistic, but still...

We don't have WP, but the PV, with or without Akku, are not very useful in feeding the WP: during Nov 2021-Feb 2022 we consumed 4950 kWh of gas, whereas our PV of 7000 kWh/yr in these coldest 4 months fed to the grid only 325 kWh.

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