German forum about plant engineering for home: heating system, solar energy, etc ?

131 posts in this topic

One thing I might consider doing if the greenies get crazy is getting a mini/multi split system like this guy: 

 

 

If I were to install it, I'd do it at the same time while installing external wall insulation, then you could tuck in the tubes/wiring in between the insulation before putting the facade on.

 

The costs of these systems look much cheaper than a heat pump with radiators or floor heating.

 

An article on the same guy:

https://efahrer-chip-de.translate.goog/news/genialer-hack-junger-ingenieur-bastelt-sich-waermepumpe-aus-klimaanlage_106898?_x_tr_sl=en&_x_tr_tl=ru&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp

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11 hours ago, wien4ever said:

The costs of these systems look much cheaper than a heat pump with radiators or floor heating.

That´s standard in Cyprus, where I live. You simply use your aircon for heating. Only few houses have additional heating.

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17 hours ago, wien4ever said:

One thing I might consider doing if the greenies get crazy is getting a mini/multi split system like this guy: 

 

 

If I were to install it, I'd do it at the same time while installing external wall insulation, then you could tuck in the tubes/wiring in between the insulation before putting the facade on.

 

The costs of these systems look much cheaper than a heat pump with radiators or floor heating.

 

An article on the same guy:

https://efahrer-chip-de.translate.goog/news/genialer-hack-junger-ingenieur-bastelt-sich-waermepumpe-aus-klimaanlage_106898?_x_tr_sl=en&_x_tr_tl=ru&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp

 

This is really echt krass...geil...mega geil...in fact.

This guy is mega cool.

Could really be part of a solution for us.

Muchos Gracias!

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We have one of those for air conditioning. Have used the heater to knock the chill off while the radiators pick up if we have been away.

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On 09/04/2022, 13:19:26, kiplette said:

 

Our old street has it fitted now. My neighbour said he'd been quoted 10 000 € to connect his house to the pipe in the street, and that running costs would be about 400 more per year than he currently pays - sorry I can't remember what fuel he currently uses. As far as he knows, no-one is going for it.

 

Also, what kind of crap are they burning at the Fernwärme, and how 'green' is it? These are questions none of us feels we have answers to. It all feels a bit slippery and 'need to know' which is unhelpful in this instance.

 

Interestingly I found the district heating figures for my district (I am too far away to be connected), but actual figures, but from 2016, so add on somewhat for inflation, anyone's guess as of todays money:

 

Connection cost up to 15Kw - 7900 Euros.

Subsidy for connection 4200 Euros (so a discount on the above figure)

Distance > 15m, 200Euros/meter for piping.

Restoration of pavement etc 215/m2

 

Unit price 90.2c / MwH, which is presumably 9c/KWh. Makes it (now) cheaper than gas, but 50% more expensive than my 2017 solar PV installation.

However, annual connection charge is 530 Euros/year, so some three times the cost of the gas connection.

Thus at 16,500KwH, that's 2356 Euros gas + 171 Connection = ~2500 Euros.

District Heating 0.9c x 16500 Kwh = 1485 + 530 Connection = ~2000 Euros.

So it would take in the order of 8+ years to repay the installation costs, based on 2022 gas figures, and 2016 heat plant figures.

 

Plant is a CHP, rather than a Geo-Thermal plant. So I am guessing it needs it's own fuel source, probably gas :(

Hmm, maybe that 9c/Kwh is, at best, hopeful come this winter.

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On 17/04/2022, 12:38:39, Aussiedog said:

 

This is really echt krass...geil...mega geil...in fact.

This guy is mega cool.

Could really be part of a solution for us.

Muchos Gracias!

 

Just watched this. If air-conditioning based heating is as efficient as an air source heat pump, just drop a few cheap units around the house. Much less disruptive than ripping out radiators. When it's warm enough in the room, the gas/oil burner doesn't run because the thermostat doesn't demand heat. Plus in the hot summer days we seem to be getting in recent years, its can be cool inside!

 

Found this one:

https://geizhals.de/mitsubishi-srk20zsx-w-src20zsx-w-a2539705.html?hloc=de

https://geizhals.de/toshiba-shorai-edge-set-ras-b07j2kvsg-e-ras-07j2avsg-e-a2728657.html?hloc=de

 

The A+++ ones seemed to be quite expensive.

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16 hours ago, scook17 said:

 

Just watched this. If air-conditioning based heating is as efficient as an air source heat pump, just drop a few cheap units around the house. Much less disruptive than ripping out radiators. When it's warm enough in the room, the gas/oil burner doesn't run because the thermostat doesn't demand heat. Plus in the hot summer days we seem to be getting in recent years, its can be cool inside!

 

Found this one:

https://geizhals.de/mitsubishi-srk20zsx-w-src20zsx-w-a2539705.html?hloc=de

https://geizhals.de/toshiba-shorai-edge-set-ras-b07j2kvsg-e-ras-07j2avsg-e-a2728657.html?hloc=de

 

The A+++ ones seemed to be quite expensive.

Aircons ARE heat pumps and they work well and efficient as heatings as long as the outside temperature doesn't drop too much (if it does, efficiency drops). However, they don't provide for the same level of comfort as radiators. Radiant heat just feels nicer than convection heat. Speaking from experience. 

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I use AC for heating in Portugal. A cheap 24.000 BTU, 500€ AC keeps my entire house warm. Why? Because outside temperature never drops below +5C.

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