BREXIT positives and negatives

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I saw a segment yesterday from the Calais coast. The reporter was showing all of the large dunes up and down the coast. He said that is where the immigrants hide during the day. The smugglers bury boats in the sand and give them a way point. They go out in the dark and pump up the boats and head off across the channel. The reporter also said, "See those dunes over there? There could be 25 people hiding behind them that I can't see."

 

Drones. Why don't they patrol the coast with drones in order to find the people before they go in the water?

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On 26/11/2021, 16:37:48, dstanners said:

In his letter to Macron (shared with everyone via the well known diplomatic channel of Twitter) BJ was implying that there was an understanding that ALL of the immigrants (I think he was using the expression "victims of human trafficking") would be returned to France. I can't imagine anything like that was actually agreed.

Of course, after shouting about wanting to be in control of its own borders, getting that control, then immediately asking someone else to do it for him sounds a bit daft.

 

 

We know that Boris is under the influence of the last person that he spoke to - sounds a bit like another blond-haired (former) leader. There are some in the party calling for an Australian / Tony Abbot approach, but France is not Indonesia and France will also shortly have the presidency of the UK's biggest trading partner; so mentioning returning people back to France is maybe because some of the more militant Tory MPs (I'm thinking along the lines of Cash, Redwood, Francois) have been suggesting it. I can well imagine the reception of the last 1922 committee meeting that Boris attended being similar to that scene in Phoenix Nights where Tim Healey gets on stage and starts singing a song titled "send the buggers back" (before a panicked Brian Potter throws them out of the Phoenix Club).

 

It would be some kind of poetic justice if the biggest failure of Brexit, maybe the one that ends up really driving it home to the people who voted for it and currently have their heads in the sand, is the "take back control of our own borders" part which was has been so often repeated between 2016 and today. 

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On 26/11/2021, 14:59:16, fraufruit said:

I saw a segment yesterday from the Calais coast. The reporter was showing all of the large dunes up and down the coast. He said that is where the immigrants hide during the day. The smugglers bury boats in the sand and give them a way point. They go out in the dark and pump up the boats and head off across the channel. The reporter also said, "See those dunes over there? There could be 25 people hiding behind them that I can't see."

 

Drones. Why don't they patrol the coast with drones in order to find the people before they go in the water?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-59419963

I read this today. Basically, human misery mixed with greed.

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On 11/26/2021, 2:59:16, fraufruit said:

Drones. Why don't they patrol the coast with drones in order to find the people before they go in the water?

It might be because they are not actually breaking the law. You can't arrest people for what you think they might do. Another thing  worth considering is how many people in the dunes are there for other reasons, they're not all trying to get across.

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On 11/26/2021, 12:10:22, Wulfrun said:

Channel migrants: Macron rounds on Johnson in boat crossings row

Emmanuel Macron has reacted angrily to Boris Johnson's public call for France to take back migrants who reach the UK.

The French President accused the UK prime minister of not being "serious" by making the call on Twitter, after the deaths of 27 people on Wednesday.

And his spokesman accused Mr Johnson of "double talk" for saying something different to Mr Macron privately.

The diplomatic row erupted after France withdrew a summit invitation to Home Secretary Priti Patel.

Belgium, France, the Netherlands, Germany and the European Commission are due to attend Sunday's talks.

 

As one of the French ministers said, the UK left the Dublin convention behind when they walked out of the EU.  The Dublin Convention ruled that refugees had to seek asylum in the first country they arrived at.  The UK is now seen as a Third Country where there are no established rules about accepting back refugees, yet Johnson seems to expect some special favours. And the French are taking the view that nobody can be forced to stay in a particular country. .

 

Its just underlines that this Go it Alone insular policy  doesn't work in the real world. 

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7 minutes ago, alexunterwegs said:

Its just underlines that this Go it Alone insular policy  doesn't work in the real world. 

You could argue it does because the rest of Europe are turning their backs on the UK thereby forcing the UK to follow its go it alone policy. Clueless BoJo and Co still haven't worked out that they out of their depth and have no real bargaining power.

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24 minutes ago, French bean said:

It might be because they are not actually breaking the law. You can't arrest people for what you think they might do. Another thing  worth considering is how many people in the dunes are there for other reasons, they're not all trying to get across.

 

I was wondering about this breaking the law part - in principle are they doing anything illegal under French law? It seemed more like it was a case of Britain trying to effectively have it's border on the French coastline.

 

Totally accept that stuffing lots of people in to a rickety boat is dangerous let alone making the crossing like that, so you can argue there is a duty of care aspect to stopping a boat in that state from launching, but doing something dangerous doesn't automatically mean that you are breaking the law of the land. 

 

Also, on a side note, @murphaph would often say in the original Brexit thread "follow the money" - the French authorities claim to have done that and have publicly said that they believe that a lot can be done within the UK regarding the trafficking gangs because of where they see the money going. I've not heard any UK politician comment on this at all, it seems that the Government are more interested in looking like they want to intercept the boats on the beaches and frame France as some kind of Belarus, rather then really want to smash the gangs that are making money from this. 

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10 minutes ago, alexunterwegs said:

Its just underlines that this Go it Alone insular policy  doesn't work in the real world. 

 

But what it does do for now is play to the base, and mean that the Conservatives can galvanise support by claiming that France wants to do them over.

 

Some of the polling of former red-wall constituencies suggests that this is one of their top issues, and if those voters are led to believe that France is aiding people to cross at the same time as the UK is paying them money to stop them, then I'd wager that a lot of those voters won't be likely to switch back to Labour. 

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15 minutes ago, Mackle said:

 

But what it does do for now is play to the base, and mean that the Conservatives can galvanise support by claiming that France wants to do them over.

 

Some of the polling of former red-wall constituencies suggests that this is one of their top issues, and if those voters are led to believe that France is aiding people to cross at the same time as the UK is paying them money to stop them, then I'd wager that a lot of those voters won't be likely to switch back to Labour. 

 

By "the real World" I mean how other countries respond to this go it alone insular policy, not the minds of some UK voters, many of whom are deluded enough to think Britain doesn't need the help of any of their neighbours or their markets. . 

 

As far as Labour is concerned, the last I heard Starner speak he seemed very timid about even mentioning the word Brexit. Yet sooner or later, they will have to face up to the common denominator causing so many of the current probems facing the UK. 

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13 hours ago, French bean said:

It might be because they are not actually breaking the law. You can't arrest people for what you think they might do. Another thing  worth considering is how many people in the dunes are there for other reasons, they're not all trying to get across.

 

I said nothing about arresting them but, to be honest, they are illegal. I meant just collect them and move them away from the shore so they won't drown.

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"Shops in the United Kingdom could run short of wine and liquor ahead of Christmas because there aren't enough drivers to make deliveries."

 

Quote

London (CNN Business) Shops in the United Kingdom could run short of wine and liquor ahead of Christmas because there aren't enough drivers to make deliveries.

 

The warning was made in a letter sent by the UK Wine and Spirit Trade Association (WTSA) to UK Transport Secretary Grant Shapps last week. It was signed by 48 members of the industry association, including champagne and cognac makers Moet Hennessy, owned by LVMH (LVMHF), and Laurent-Perrier.


"This is an urgent issue for our businesses, and it is imperative that [the UK] Government takes immediate steps to help mitigate the impact of the driver shortages crisis before the Christmas period," the letter stated.

 

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1 hour ago, Janx Spirit said:

"Shops in the United Kingdom could run short of wine and liquor ahead of Christmas because there aren't enough drivers to make deliveries."

 

 

Thought I'd post the usual standard stock photo to save anyone else bothering!

empty.jpg.fe6e3617a860a1873c793d87fb010e

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You are way behind the times:

 

"British Grocery Stores Are Stocking Empty Shelves with Cardboard Cutouts of Food"

 

Quote

...some supermarkets in England have reportedly been filling empty produce sections and bare store shelves with pictures of whatever items should've been in those spaces, while others are using their empty freezer cases to display non-food items like toys and games. 

https://www.foodandwine.com/news/tesco-cardboard-food-displays-supply-chain

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Has anyone noticed a shortage of Christmas Puddings?

 

For instance the English Shop in Köln did not have any until I saw them today - and then only 400g (no use for a family of 7 pud-eaters on the 25th).

Last year they had 800g (thats already downsized from 900g that used to be available).  An 800g pud is rather small - given it has the density of uranium...

 

If you look at Tescos or Sainsbury online there are puds there but the choice is very much reduced.

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I just ordered a 400g pud from the English Shop (Christmas with my family cancelled today du to Corona). I wanted a 100g pud as it’s just for 1 but no chance. 

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10 minutes ago, Auntie Helen said:

I just ordered a 400g pud from the English Shop (Christmas with my family cancelled today du to Corona). I wanted a 100g pud as it’s just for 1 but no chance. 

 

It is rather late for ordering British xmas stuff online however the shop in the link below has some 100g puds and at least 1 type at 908g currently showing as in stock. I have used them and they are good!

https://www.greatbritishfood.de/christmas/xmas-pudding-xmas-cake/?p=1

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