Where did you stay when first moving to Germany from abroad?

38 posts in this topic

1 hour ago, jauburn said:

I'd have a normal job, so insurance would be part of the deal.

 

You wouldn't be eligible for public health insurance in Germany since you are over 55 unless you've had public health insurance in the EU for a minimum of 24 months within the last 5 years.

 

1 hour ago, jauburn said:

 

I would also be newly retired from the U.S. govt. and could, if I wanted, just keep the FEHB (Blue Cross/Blue Shield), which I understand can be used overseas.

 

Although your insurance might be willing to cover you here, it wouldn't meet the minimum requirements in order to meet the mandatory health insurance requirements.  Without sufficient health insurance you are not eligible for a residence permit.

 

Contact @Starshollow for a quote for private health insurance. 

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1 hour ago, engelchen said:

 

You wouldn't be eligible for public health insurance in Germany since you are over 55 unless you've had public health insurance in the EU for a minimum of 24 months within the last 5 years.

 

 

Although your insurance might be willing to cover you here, it wouldn't meet the minimum requirements in order to meet the mandatory health insurance requirements.  Without sufficient health insurance you are not eligible for a residence permit.

 

Contact @Starshollow for a quote for private health insurance. 

 

Well, this is a new wrinkle I had not anticipated. I will talk to the employer about it. Hmm, if I had to go private, that might be another point in the minus column about whether to come back at all.

 

Thanks.

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5 hours ago, jauburn said:

 

Well, this is a new wrinkle I had not anticipated. I will talk to the employer about it.

 

Eligibility for public health insurance is set out in SGB V (see §6 Nr. 3a for further info) and your employer can't do anything about it. You need to speak with an insurance broker specialised in foreigners. 

 

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2 hours ago, engelchen said:

 

Eligibility for public health insurance is set out in SGB V (see §6 Nr. 3a for further info) and your employer can't do anything about it. You need to speak with an insurance broker specialised in foreigners. 

 

 

That links appears to be broken: 

Not Found

The requested URL was not found on this server.

 

Got it: https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/sgb_5/__6.html

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20 hours ago, jauburn said:

Last time I was in Germany, I had either Barmer or AOK. I think it was Barmer. I also have 5 full years in the German social security system, if that means anything. (I was an English teacher in several German universities and ultimately a German high school in Berlin.)

 

This is absolutely CRUCIAL to your re-entry into "gesetzliche Krankenversicherung" when you are over 55. 

I was in the same position upon my return from the US (after only 13 years there). Over 55, taking on a new job, and former member of DAK - they took us back into DAK. 

 

Being over 55 means you won't get into GKV even if your job pays less than whatever threshold there is currently for public insurance - unless you've been a member of public insurance in Germany before (no matter how long ago).

 

The GKV that you were a member of 30 years ago will have to take you back in (which is really highly recommended). If you think it was Barmer, talk to them first. 

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6 hours ago, karin_brenig said:

 

This is absolutely CRUCIAL to your re-entry into "gesetzliche Krankenversicherung" when you are over 55. 

I was in the same position upon my return from the US (after only 13 years there). Over 55, taking on a new job, and former member of DAK - they took us back into DAK. 

 

Being over 55 means you won't get into GKV even if your job pays less than whatever threshold there is currently for public insurance - unless you've been a member of public insurance in Germany before (no matter how long ago).

 

The GKV that you were a member of 30 years ago will have to take you back in (which is really highly recommended). If you think it was Barmer, talk to them first. 

 

Have to admit I'm quite confused at this point. It would seem from the poster above that I am uninsurable in the public system because I meet two conditions: (1) over 55 and (2) not insured in an EU state within the past 2 years. I would also not meet the income threshold for private insurance, so that would seem to leave me with no option but to stay here! I can do that, but how odd.

 

I was never privately insured in Germany (was always told about the restrictions on getting into the public system if I opted for private). I checked on this last night, and indeed I was with Barmer for at least 5 years from 1987-1992. You're saying they would be required to let me return, and the other poster seems to be saying they would not take me.

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6 hours ago, karin_brenig said:

This is absolutely CRUCIAL to your re-entry into "gesetzliche Krankenversicherung" when you are over 55. 

I was in the same position upon my return from the US (after only 13 years there). Over 55, taking on a new job, and former member of DAK - they took us back into DAK. 

 

The GKV that you were a member of 30 years ago will have to take you back in (which is really highly recommended). If you think it was Barmer, talk to them first. 

I could be way off here, but is this something to do with being a returning German citizen, who previously had GKS here?   But not applicable for a non-citizen?

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Quote

I would also not meet the income threshold for private insurance

 

Since you are not eligible for public health insurance, the income threshold is irrelevant and you are allowed to obtain private German health insurance. Whether it makes sense to move to Germany at your age for less than 70k a year is something you need to determine for yourself.

 

Quote

I was never privately insured in Germany (was always told about the restrictions on getting into the public system if I opted for private). I checked on this last night, and indeed I was with Barmer for at least 5 years from 1987-1992. You're saying they would be required to let me return?

 

No, since you are a foreigner who requires sufficient funds to receive a residence permit, Barmer is not allowed to take you back (see §5 Abs 13 Nr. 11).

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38 minutes ago, jauburn said:

 

I was never privately insured in Germany (was always told about the restrictions on getting into the public system if I opted for private). I checked on this last night, and indeed I was with Barmer for at least 5 years from 1987-1992. You're saying they would be required to let me return, and the other poster seems to be saying they would not take me.

On 5.9.2021, 12:55:07, jauburn said:

 

 

I speak from personal experience (recently returned to Germany after 13 years in the US). Yes, the last insurance company that you were a member of in Germany before leaving the country is the one that has to (by law) take you back in upon your return. Don't worry too much about other people's hearsay, their situation may be different. You were never a member of any PKV in Germany, you get back into GKV.

 

Read this website, it may help you understand 

https://www.krankenkassen.de/incoming/leben/rueckkehr/

 

or this one, with lots of "legal speak" in it

https://www.vdek.com/vertragspartner/mitgliedschaftsrecht_beitragsrecht/versicherungspflicht.html

 

Even if you already have a job offer, or are negotiating one, you need to join that GKV before you start working. You'll pay the minimum premium for yourself until your employer starts paying half of it.

 

If you are a German citizen and don't have a job lined up, or think it will take you a long time to find one, you still need to join GKV first, right after Anmeldung. Then go to Arbeitsamt and register as "arbeitsuchend". Arbeitsamt will then help pay your GKV.

 

 

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21 minutes ago, snowingagain said:

I could be way off here, but is this something to do with being a returning German citizen, who previously had GKS here?   But not applicable for a non-citizen?

my husband is a US-citizen, only US-citizen - and over 55 too. His GKV took him back - because they have to.

 

Any person living in Germany has to have health insurance. The rules for which one you can get (public or private) are the same for all nationalities.

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20 minutes ago, jauburn said:

Well, this seems pretty clear-cut to me. 

 

Too bad that you're neither German nor married to one.

 

As I already advised you, you need an insurance broker specialised in foreigners (and definitely not a clueless German who can't even understand German laws). 

 

Please update your thread after Barmer confirms what I've told you.

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38 minutes ago, jauburn said:

Well, this seems pretty clear-cut to me. 

If I recall correctly, @BethAnnBitt had a similarly difficult situation regarding health insurance that was resolved.  Maybe Beth Ann can give you some advice? 

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Many things are Auslegungsangelegenheiten, open to interpretation of the laws/rules*. Try asking for several opinions.

 

* citizenship law, for example, seems to be interpreted in different ways by various States.

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When i came here was also a question as to wether i could qualify to get the public insurance option as i was 57  but since first time in germany i was able to. My insurance broker contacted sbk and did a preenrollment before i took the job. I receved a written confirmation from sbk confirming this.  Once we got here i just needed to send my address and photos. I would not have accepted the job without it due to private insurance cost. Maybe you can do this on your own through the krankenkase if your deutsche is good enough. I thought at the time i was told if i previously had public i could get back in even is not a citizen or resident but not sure on this as i did not apply so paid little attention to the info

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1 hour ago, john g. said:

 

not really... this article is for people who have never been insured in Germany before, or have only had private health insurance before.

 

btw - national origin (or whether or not your spouse is German) is relevant for how you get your residence permit (family sponsored, job related, or for study/training/education purpose) it is not relevant for your health insurance. All legal residents of Germany have to have health insurance. The rules for which one (public or private) are the same for everybody, even returning Germans. 

 

OP was insured in public health insurance previously and is now coming back to work in Germany again.  

He gets back into public insurance (with the same insurance company that he left 30 years ago) if he takes on a (non-freelance) job as an employee and makes less than 64350 € Brutto annually. Even being over 55. 

 

You might want to read the first paragraph of the page that I linked earlier:

  • Wer früher in Deutschland gelebt hat und dort in einer gesetzlichen Krankenkasse versichert war, kehrt auch in die gesetzliche Krankenversicherung zurück. Dafür sollte man sich an die gesetzliche Krankenkasse wenden, bei der man zuletzt in Deutschland versichert war.
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