Lawers threatening to add me in Schufa for consumer loan debt

20 posts in this topic

So, I moved at the end of March and was a bit late in checking my mail at the old address which had a nasty suprise for me.

 

Some lawyers from Berlin are threatening to "meld" me in Schufa as owing money to their customer, Zeus Recovery Fund. Zeus Recovery Fund is a bunch of loan sharks that bought non-performing loans from Greek banks a few years ago. They claim that I had a loan with a Greek bank and it has now been acquired by Zeus Recovery Fund, therefore I owe them the money.

 

letter.png

 

The tone of the letter is ridiculous, obviously trying to scare me.

They claim "continuous efforts to contact me in both Greece and Germany which I ignored". In fact I never received any communication from the lawers, the bank or Zeus Recovery Fund to any correct address, e-mail or phone number of mine.

 

The deadline that they gave me for paying the money (that I don't owe them) is already over as I didn't check my mail until now.

 

In the next page they mention some phone numbers in Berlin and at their Greek office where I can call.

My assumption is that they have already proceded to the step of "melding" my supposed debt with Schufa. I am wondering what might come out of it given that they probably don't know any personal information of mine. Or if they do know my birthday and anything else, it was probably acquired illegally as I never had any contract with the mentioned bank.

 

I actually called the bank's customer support on Friday and if there has ever been a loan on my name there. The agent confirmed that the combination of my name and Greek tax ID doesn't bring any loan, although he wouldn't confirm if they've ever had given out a loan to somebody else with the same first and last name.

 

Given the above, do you think that I should already contact a lawyer and ask for advice?

Do you think that I should just ignore the thing for now, and then in a couple of weeks try to check my Schufa in order to figure out if any debt has been recorded?

Or do you think that I should call them on the phone numbers they provided and try to talk to them?

 

 

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If you took the loan, then pay them or make a payment plan. If you didn't took the loan  and it seems that a mistaken identity, then politely write them the letter that you are not the person who ever took a loan with the said bank. 

 

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AFAIK Schufa won´t take note before legal proceedings have been started (e.g. Mahnbescheid) successfully. I´d tell them in writing you that their claim is unfounded since you never took out a loan from the bank in question.

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My concern is that by writing a letter to them, they will then know my new address.

Writing the letter using the old address could be used against me in the future.

 

Also, why should I be polite? They weren't.

 

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1 hour ago, lewton said:

My concern is that by writing a letter to them, they will then know my new address.

 

If they start legal proceedings they will find out your registered address anyway. It´s one of the purposes of the "Meldesystem" that you can´t hide from creditors. About 35 years ago I even had to pay the cost for establishing my then current address ("Anschriftenermittlung") as I had forgotten to inform a creditor that I had moved. That was even without legal proceedings having been opened.

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SCHUFA, aka SCHUFA Holding AG, is a German company that works with German contractual partners such as banks and financial institutes. The banks report the details of their contracts with customers (using a scheme of codes) and in return are able to use the data of SCHUFA in the course of their credit application processes. Both neutral, positive and negative details are reported. As far as I understand, foreign companies do not report to SCHUFA. There is a cooperation between SCHUFA and foreign credit agencies that enables SCHUFA's contract partners to check the creditworthiness of customers in other countries (including Greece). So if you have a bad score with the Greek equivalent of SCHUFA, it could affect your chances of getting a loan or a mobile phone contract in Germany. However, this is a separate product offered by SCHUFA and does not involve the foreign banks, credit institutes, etc. making a direct report to SCHUFA.

 

This could therefore be an empty threat on the part of Zeus (bank based in Greece, debt collector in Luxembourg). Even German companies do not always communicate everything to SCHUFA that they threaten to report. I also find it fairly unserious that the letter only refers to SCHUFA rather than using the whole company name.

 

In addition, negative details regarding the non-payment of loans, contracts etc. can be reported to SCHUFA if specific conditions are met. These are set out in the German Data Protection Law (§31(2) Bundesdatenschutzgesetz). You can access the English translation via this link:

 

https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/englisch_bdsg/

 

These are the two sections most relevant to your situation in theory:

4.  for which

a)  the debtor has received at least two written reminders after the due date of the claim,

b)  at least four weeks have elapsed since the first reminder,

c)  the debtor was previously informed, at least in the first reminder, of possible consideration by a credit reporting agency and

d)  the debtor has not disputed the claim, or

5.  the contractual relationship on which the claim is based can be terminated without prior notice for payment in arrears and the debtor has been informed of possible consideration by a credit reporting agency.

Section 4 is what Jeba was referring to. There are various hoops for the companies to jump through. Also, if you negative entry with SCHUFA is incorrect, you are entitled to dispute it and the code "WS" will show up on your SCHUFA record regarding the particular debt until the issue has been resolved.

 

One further point is that Alpha Bank has sold off portions of its non-performing assets in recent years (I found 2020 and 2021 via Google) but Zeus is not mentioned at all.

 

I understand your concerns about writing to Zeus and can't advise you what to do as I am not a lawyer. However, I hope the above information is useful.

     
       
       
       
     

 

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@Harders awesome answer, thanks!

 

Based on this point, I think I will write to them to say that I am disputing the claim as well as the fact that they have already tried to contact me several times in both countries.

Quote

d)  the debtor has not disputed the claim, or

 

I will also ask them to tell me the address/phone number/e-mail address to which they tried to reach me. Assuming that they are all wrong (somebody else with my name), then case closed.

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8 minutes ago, lewton said:

@Harders awesome answer, thanks!

 

Based on this point, I think I will write to them to say that I am disputing the claim as well as the fact that they have already tried to contact me several times in both countries.

 

I will also ask them to tell me the address/phone number/e-mail address to which they tried to reach me. Assuming that they are all wrong (somebody else with my name), then case closed.

 

Do you have experience dealing with paperwork in German? This might not be something you should try to do yourself.

 

Do you have legal insurance?  If not,  you might want to contact the Verbraucherzentrale

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46 minutes ago, engelchen said:

 

Do you have experience dealing with paperwork in German? This might not be something you should try to do yourself.

 

Do you have legal insurance?  If not,  you might want to contact the Verbraucherzentrale

 

Definitely advisable!

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2 hours ago, engelchen said:

 

Do you have experience dealing with paperwork in German? This might not be something you should try to do yourself.

 

Do you have legal insurance?  If not,  you might want to contact the Verbraucherzentrale

The best time have arranged legal insurance is yesterday, the next best time is ASAP.

 

@lewton - you've been here since 2014 (on TT), this has been mentioned on a lot of threads (the get insurance part), don't leave yourself open to stuff like this any more, go and get some legal insurance. It might seem that no ones it or uses it, but those that do, don't come here to tell us about it. At he very least join (as advised above) the verbraucherzentralle. 

 

 

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After reading the whole thread it's still completely unclear to me whether Lewton borrowed money from the original bank named in the dispute or not.

 

I suspect the answers to the legal questions all hinges on the answer to that.

 

What advice are we realistically supposed to give without even knowing whether or not Lewton took out the loan in question?  Did I overlook something?

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On 11/04/2021, 18:27:19, lewton said:

I actually called the bank's customer support on Friday and if there has ever been a loan on my name there. The agent confirmed that the combination of my name and Greek tax ID doesn't bring any loan,

My Bold, I interpret this as saying that Lewton did not take the loan. I think that might be what was overlooked.

 

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They have probably sent such letters to anyone with the same name as you, hoping for a bite from a guilty or nervous conscious. I would definitely look into legal advice first, but in the long run you can probably just tell them you are not the droid they are looking for (presuming you did not actually take the loan and have never had dealings with the bank, etc). 

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The Bank may say there is no loan with the Name and tax id....   But the question still remains...      

 

LEWTON...   Did you borrow money from a greek Bank and NOT repay it in full?

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On 11.4.2021, 18:27:19, lewton said:

I never had any contract with the mentioned bank.

 

From the first post.

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OK... but maybe they had a loan with a Greek bank that went bust or was bought out...    

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17 hours ago, SpiderPig said:

The Bank may say there is no loan with the Name and tax id...   But the question still remains...      

 

LEWTON...   Did you borrow money from a greek Bank and NOT repay it in full?

No I didn't!
As @pappnase pointed out, I wrote it in my first message but I see it could have been more clear.

Same for acquired banks.

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The issue has finally been resolved as they acknowledged that they are looking for someone else and have been sending this letter to anyone with my first/last name they can find.

 

However this adventure made me realize how cool it would be to have legal insurance and just make someone else take care of it. Additionally I've been warned by some of my new neighbours that a certain neighbour likes to bully people and threated legal action over any tiny thing that bothers him.

What I am trying to figure out is: if that neighbour brings any legal action against me and my boyfriend, given that we are both in the lease of the apartment, and if I have legal insurance on my name only, can I make use of it?

 

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10 hours ago, lewton said:

they acknowledged that they are looking for someone else and have been sending this letter to anyone with my first/last name they can find.

So in reality a fishing & spamming method. 

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22 hours ago, lewton said:

if I have legal insurance on my name only, can I make use of it?

Usually yes. Just don´t choose a tariff for singles and check the smallprint.

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