Need help with 3 way dispute with landlord

14 posts in this topic

Warning: This is a long post.

 

I need your advise for the following dispute.

 

I signed an apartment rental contract (full furnishing including kitchen, lights etc) in 2019 which was sub-leased. During signing the contract, The main renter from whom I sub-leased informed me that the cellar will be cleaned and handed over to me in a weeks time. This turned into months and i started to get really annoyed as I needed the space to keep kid stroller, my apartment was in 4th floor and the size was 48m2 only.

 

I consulted with tenant association and reduced 10% of the rent after 3 months. The main renter had his things in the cellar but insisted that I should pay the full rent. Meanwhile, the actual landlord who owns the property came in between and informed me that I am living here without obtaining a sub-leasing consent from him. So he sent the main renter a termination notice.

 

Meanwhile main renter sent me court notice for rent reduction, I also used the same lawyer to respond to the rent deduction claim i made for the cellar since I dont speak German and this lawyer was speaking a bit English.

 

Long story short, the lawyer lost the case in-spite of me providing a 40 page Emails as evidence for the rent reduction.

 

Since this was annoying and bothering I decided to move to a new apartment which was vacant 1 floor below (The actual landlord owns the entire building). Since I moved there, the actual landlord threatened and got the keys for the sub-leased apartment (which was the main reason for losing the case) without paying anything (there was 1 month contract left). Now since I lost the case, I also paid for all the furniture, kitchen items etc in court settlement.

 

I need the furniture for my own use which the actual landlord is denying to handover. I know this must be confusing to read. What can I do in this situation?

 

I have lived in several countries and  his is the first time I have such a bitter experience renting an apartment.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, fraufruit said:

Join your local Meitverien.

 

Sounds like she did already:

9 hours ago, Thia said:

I consulted with tenant association

 

To me (being a layman) it looks like you have a claim for damage compensation against your first (sub-)landlord. It might help to have any proof about what he had verbally promised. What was agreed between you and him is irrelevant for your contract with the owner. You can´t base any claim against him on what a third party had agreed on with you (if that´s what the court case was about, which is unclear to me).

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, jeba said:

 

Sounds like she did already:

 

To me (being a layman) it looks like you have a claim for damage compensation against your first (sub-)landlord. It might help to have any proof about what he had verbally promised. What was agreed between you and him is irrelevant for your contract with the owner. You can´t base any claim against him on what a third party had agreed on with you (if that´s what the court case was about, which is unclear to me).

Yes I am already a member also I am a 'HE' :)

I have all the email communication proof which I submitted to lawyer. But he still screwed up.

 

I dont know what the courts said. I was informed by the lawyer that they went for settlement. I have paid 3000 Euros in total which includes all the furniture which I rented from main-tenant. The actual landlord has rented it with the furniture. I am trying to get those atleast.

 

Is there any lawyer I can contact whether I can reopen the case. I am 100% sure I was not represented correctly.

 

I cannot go to local Meitverien because I dont speak German language and its by telephone consultation only.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Here you´ll find a list of lawyers residing in Jena and specialised in renting law. You´d have to ask them individually whether they have command of English.https://www.bea-brak.de/bravsearch/result.brak

Be aware that there is a deadline by which you have to object (I think 4 weeks after the ruling)

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Off topic:

 

14 hours ago, Thia said:

 I am a 'HE' :)

 

 

there goes the Left again, muddying the language with pronoun fussiness  :)

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Thia said:

Yes I am already a member also I am a 'HE' :)

I have all the email communication proof which I submitted to lawyer. But he still screwed up.

 

I dont know what the courts said. I was informed by the lawyer that they went for settlement. I have paid 3000 Euros in total which includes all the furniture which I rented from main-tenant. The actual landlord has rented it with the furniture. I am trying to get those atleast.

 

Is there any lawyer I can contact whether I can reopen the case. I am 100% sure I was not represented correctly.

 

I cannot go to local Meitverien because I dont speak German language and its by telephone consultation only.

 

 

The local Mieterverein usually speaks English. Have they told you specifically they cannot? 

 

This is a big problem if the main tenant did not agree to the subletting. I suggest you contact a lawyer who can speak English right away. Or join the Mieterverein ASAP. 

 

I’m not a lawyer. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, McDee said:

He's a member of the Mieterverein!!!!!!

 

Yes, he stated that, but then he says he cannot go to them. So he’s a member, but he can’t use their services. Basically a non-member now 😄

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, DoubleDTown said:

Off topic:

 

 

there goes the Left again, muddying the language with pronoun fussiness  :)

 

more like the preconceived notion that (almost certainly) a majority of us have, which assumes that a person living in a smallish apartment with a child and stroller must be a woman.

 

No accusations here, I fell into it too.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/19/2021, 3:36:24, klingklang77 said:

 

Yes, he stated that, but then he says he cannot go to them. So he’s a member, but he can’t use their services. Basically a non-member now 😄

Yes, that is the case. No one speaks English in my local Mieterverein. Life is getting extremely difficult with the housing issue. I have to bother some one to be a translator which I dont want to do and it is the main reason I took a private lawyer. But this lawyer conspired with the Landlord and lost the case! atleast thats what I feel.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Thia said:

 I have to bother some one to be a translator which I dont want to do and it is the main reason I took a private lawyer. But this lawyer conspired with the Landlord and lost the case! atleast thats what I feel.

That´s quite a wild allegation, especially as you admit not even knowing the reason for the ruling. I´d at least try to get it translated (google translate might help for a start or you may post an anonymised version here) and then decide whether it´s worth appealing. I could think of other reasons than your lawyer betraying you. E.g. that emails weren´t admitted as evidence since they don´t meet form requirements (see e.g. https://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/topic/285487-german-businesses-not-responding-to-email/?do=findComment&comment=2970160).

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, Thia said:

Yes, that is the case. No one speaks English in my local Mieterverein. Life is getting extremely difficult with the housing issue. I have to bother some one to be a translator which I dont want to do and it is the main reason I took a private lawyer. But this lawyer conspired with the Landlord and lost the case! atleast thats what I feel.

 

That’s a big statement. Maybe I’m missing something here. Did you use the same lawyer as the main renter to get your rent reduction? If that’s the case, that was a bad idea. You should have gotten your own lawyer. 

 

Also the apartment wasn’t legally sublet. That is a big thing. 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/21/2021, 11:46:29, klingklang77 said:

 

That’s a big statement. Maybe I’m missing something here. Did you use the same lawyer as the main renter to get your rent reduction? If that’s the case, that was a bad idea. You should have gotten your own lawyer. 

 

Also the apartment wasn’t legally sublet. That is a big thing. 

Yeah I know its a big statement. Thats how I feel. But anyways, since this is taking too much energy I have decided to put this behind.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now