President Joseph R Biden Jr. 46th President of the United States

205 posts in this topic

48 minutes ago, Keleth said:

Seriously,instead of looking up Churchill on wiki actually do some research into the Dardanelles expedition.

Didn't we technically lose at Gallipoli?

It's been a while since I read anything about it (school), but I remember a few of the higherups were either demoted or even had their careers ended afterwards (wasn't Churchill demoted?).

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2 hours ago, Keleth said:

Seriously,instead of looking up Churchill on wiki actually do some research into the Dardanelles expedition.

I did, it was a complete fiasco, to the point he got demoted and given a small task during the remaining of the war.

 

2 hours ago, Keleth said:

He was exactly what Britain needed at the time.

He was a politician who knew how to lift the spirits of the public,he was not some great military mind.

He didn`t trust his Generals and often meddled which is quite good in this respect as many of them wanted to fight the war the same way they fought WWI.

At the start of WW2 he was again appointed First Lord of the Admiralty, where he commanded, together with the French, the stupid "phoney war". If they had done a real invasion, there wouldn't have been a WW2.

Funny how you can bash a current politician for being positive when things are going wrong (Trump vs Covid) and at the same time praise Churchill for doing the same.

 

Even more interesting is that just after the war he lost the elections! How can a winning government lose elections? Perhaps at the time he was not well seen and today we just praise him for being a good speaker and being on the winning side.

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1 hour ago, cb6dba said:

Didn't we technically lose at Gallipoli?

It's been a while since I read anything about it (school), but I remember a few of the higherups were either demoted or even had their careers ended afterwards (wasn't Churchill demoted?).

Yes, he got demoted. The most interesting point was the arrogance of the leadership, who thought the Turkish were too dumb to put up an intelligent fight. Guess what? They were smart enough to the point that the British navy was rendered useless for the rest of the fight. There are many interesting details, from night time mine layering, to low profile artillery positions.

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4 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

Even more interesting is that just after the war he lost the elections! How can a winning government lose elections? Perhaps at the time he was not well seen and today we just praise him for being a good speaker and being on the winning side.

From what I remember (could be wrong) Churchill was a bit of a warmonger.

At the end of WWI he wanted to take on the Bolsheviks and at the end of WWII he wanted to push the Russians back.  As I say, this is from memory and I'd have to check it when I am back on a PC/laptop.

 

I think that was why he was cut loose, they didn't want another conflict.

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, keith2011 said:

 

 

I believe you may find that your opinions are not shared by many in countries that did not remain neutral in WW2.

Like India?

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I like Eric Bogle's The Band played Waltzing Matilda which describes the Gallipoli disaster in song.

 

Countless, mostly ANZAC lives lost to hubris.

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9 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

Funny how you can bash a current politician for being positive when things are going wrong (Trump vs Covid) and at the same time praise Churchill for doing the same.

That`s what history does for winners.

IF Covid had been wiped out due to vaccinations before the US election then views on Trump and Covid would be completely different.Churchill redeemed himself,Trump never did.

7 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

Yes, he got demoted.

Now please explain how he got demoted ?

He did not get militarily demoted which you`re making it sound like,he lost the admiralty because it was a condition of the forming of a coalition govt.

14 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

Even more interesting is that just after the war he lost the elections! How can a winning government lose elections?

Because after a war the last thing the people wanted was the Conservatives in power and chose a Labour Govt that promised social reform.

You also forget to mention that he won the election in 1951.

 

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25 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

If they had done a real invasion, there wouldn't have been a WW2.

 

I don`t think history has looked kindly on the phoney war but to make such a massive statement you need to back it up.

Even after the war only 2 German generals said that the Allies might have won if they had struck quickly and decisively with massive forces.

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11 minutes ago, Keleth said:

Now please explain how he got demoted ?

He did not get militarily demoted which you`re making it sound like,he lost the admiralty because it was a condition of the forming of a coalition govt.

He was Admiralty twice and failed miserably twice. On WW1 he was the one who proposed that campaign and eventually was demoted because of that failure.

 

11 minutes ago, Keleth said:

Because after a war the last thing the people wanted was the Conservatives in power and chose a Labour Govt that promised social reform.

You also forget to mention that he won the election in 1951.

And why is that a valid reason?

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19 hours ago, jeba said:

Well, you can´t have your cake and eat it.

Well,you seem quite happy for them to steal someone elses cake and eat it.

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11 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

And why is that a valid reason?

Read the manifestos of both parties and you`ll understand why labour won.

After a global war why on earth would you vote for a party that forecasted only gloom and doom for the post war years.

Plus the conservatives believed that the popularity of Churchill would be enough to win not realising that after a war people would want something of substance.

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I have never read the manifestos from that time..

My mum ( working class Labour supporter ) visited me about 20 years ago in Hamburg and met my still partner Nicole. We visited German friends, who offered her Sir Winston Churchill tea ( unheard of in the UK? But around in Germany ).

My mum: “ That fucking warring bastard. Don’t want his tea.”

True story...🙏🏻

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1 hour ago, murphaph said:

Like India?

Maybe not, I have never been there but try Norway, Denmark and more than a few Poles.

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3 hours ago, cb6dba said:

Didn't we technically lose at Gallipoli?

Yes it was a failed attempt to make a decissive attack on the Otoman Empire and like many such WW1 battles the loss of life was horendous. It like other such battles suffered from poor communications and mobility and pitted men with only a riffle against machine guns and artillery, the generlals and leaders got the blame but they just did not have the technology to counter a dug in defense, the whole of WW1 was a European  wide disaster!

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Thinking back!

 

 

Ah well, the cats are fighting outside right now...we (all species ) are just not good at peace...😢

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I suppose we are way off topic here

 

But I much prefer 2 tribes ... probably my favorite from that band. I think Relax was the biggest number from them, but again not my cup of tea

 

no biggie

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( At the risk of being off topic..😂 .. love is never off topic.. it is the only topic that counts in life..👍🏼.. ouch )..

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