Real estate ownership transfer (Eigentumsumschreibung)

[Korla 14]

Hello everyone,

I hope you've been all doing well. My GF and I have been in the process of buying a house this year. We're very close to finally move in but 

there are still some open topics. The real-estate agent and the seller have been generally supportive and reasonable. Nevertheless, I am a man of "trust but verify" motto. 

We bought the house in summer but the formal owner stays there till the end of the year. This has been known from the beginning and the deadline is a part of the contract. We agreed

that the previous owner will pay us a rent as soon as we pay for the house. This is about ~3 months transition period. In typical examples online the process is 

1. you pay for the house,

2. you become the Besitzer,

3. you get the key (Schlüsselübergabe),

4. the process at Grundbuchamt runs in parallel,

5. You become the Eigentümer when all changes in the Grundbuch have been finished.

 

In our case it is different and I am confused.

 

We get the key when the guy moves out in next few days. It is perfectly understandable. We bought the house in summer, he wanted some transition period and it makes not sense to handover a house with all the furniture, etc. 

 

 

Here are the questions:

* We've already received a bill for the Eigentumsumschreibung from Landesjustizkasse Bamberg. It is practically a fee for changes in the Grundbuch. It is already the second bill. The first one was for Auflassungsvormerkung. 

-> Is this the only confirmation that we are officially owners (Eigentümer)? I would expect something more than a bill. Like a mail from the notary saying so.****

-> Who ideally notifies us and how we find out that the lengthy process of Eigentumsumschreibung is finally over? Could it be that some mail has been lost? This year has been overwhelming for nearly everyone and it would not surprise me.

 

A less important question

-> Do one need to send the Schlüsselübergabeprotokoll to the Notary? If so, what are to consequences?

 

**** I am amazed that important mail in Germany goes without any tracking (ohne Einschreiben).

 

PS: Guys, I know that you're not lawyers. I just seek for additional experience and maybe ideas where and what to ask. 

 

Happy holidays, 

Korla

 

[LeonG 13,581]

Looking at my paperwork for when I bought my house, it was the Notar who mailed me an Eintragungsbekanntmachung from Amtsgericht including a thing from the Grundbuch.  The letter seems to be addressed to me but seems to have been sent to my Notar unless he picked it up in person and he has then sent it to me along with some other documents.  This is dated a few days after I received a bill from the Amtsgericht.  Does that help?

 

In your shoes, I would just phone the Notars office and ask.  I was in contact with mine periodically because he had me withhold the last bit of payment until some event in particular had taken place and I had the previous owner complaining a lot and wanting his money.

 

[jeba 3,584]

9 hours ago, Korla said:

Is this the only confirmation that we are officially owners (Eigentümer)?

No, you´ll get a copy of an excerpt from the land register ("Grundbuch"). At least in Bavaria this will be sent to you by the local court the Grundbuchamt belongs to. Might be different in other states (no idea).

[pappnase 1,552]

40 minutes ago, jeba said:

you´ll get a copy of an excerpt from the land register

Exactly this, but only after you paid the bill for making the change.

 

[SpiderPig 9,729]

If there is a Mortgage involved, does the bank not get the info first?     I cant recall..    Mustn't forget to take my amnesia tablet!!!  

[Korla 14]

18 hours ago, LeonG said:

Looking at my paperwork for when I bought my house, it was the Notar who mailed me an Eintragungsbekanntmachung from Amtsgericht including a thing from the Grundbuch.  The letter seems to be addressed to me but seems to have been sent to my Notar unless he picked it up in person and he has then sent it to me along with some other documents.  This is dated a few days after I received a bill from the Amtsgericht.  Does that help?

 

In your shoes, I would just phone the Notars office and ask.  I was in contact with mine periodically because he had me withhold the last bit of payment until some event in particular had taken place and I had the previous owner complaining a lot and wanting his money.

 

 

Thank you Leon. It does help. I've just checked the bill for the "Auflassungsvormerkung". It was issued on 21.09.2020. The notary sent out a letter for "Kaufpreisfälligkeit" on 18.9.2020 with the updated "Grundbuch" (Abdruck vom 17.9.2020, Geändert am 14.09.2020).

 

This means:

1. Auflassungsvormerkung on 14.9.
2. The notary requested a new printout on 17.9.
3. The notary sends me the update and the green light for the payment on 18.9.
4. Justizkasse Bamberg issues the invoice for changes few days after the change on 21.9.

I continued googling and it seems that the right keywords are "Eintragungsnachricht", "Eigentumsnachweis" or "Eintragungsbekanntmachung" (as you noted). This is something I should receive (or should have received).

My GF made me thinking that we received the bill for "Eigentumsumschreibung" from Landesjustizkasse at the beginning of the process. The "Auflassungsvormerkung" typically takes just a couple of days. The "Eigentumsumschreibung" takes up to several months and the system may request the payment in different order than I noted above. 

 

If this is not much hassle for you - could you please check if you received the bill for the "Eigentumsumschreibung" before or after the "Eintragungsbekanntmachung"?

 

For sure I will check with the notary but I am afraid that they are all out of the office. The situation makes me nervous for one single reason - Wohngebäudeversicherung...

 

PS: Is your avatar a selfie from a speeding ticket? :-)

 

9 hours ago, jeba said:

No, you´ll get a copy of an excerpt from the land register ("Grundbuch"). At least in Bavaria this will be sent to you by the local court the Grundbuchamt belongs to. Might be different in other states (no idea).

 

9 hours ago, pappnase said:

Exactly this, but only after you paid the bill for making the change.

 

Thank you guys too. Yes, this is in Bavaria. 

 

8 hours ago, SpiderPig said:

If there is a Mortgage involved, does the bank not get the info first?     I cant recall..    Mustn't forget to take my amnesia tablet!!!  

Nah, I think the bank is quite useless here.

 

Thank you everyone for reading my complicated posts and helping!

 

[LeonG 13,581]

6 hours ago, Korla said:

Thank you Leon. It does help. I've just checked the bill for the "Auflassungsvormerkung". It was issued on 21.09.2020. The notary sent out a letter for "Kaufpreisfälligkeit" on 18.9.2020 with the updated "Grundbuch" (Abdruck vom 17.9.2020, Geändert am 14.09.2020).

 

This means:

1. Auflassungsvormerkung on 14.9.
2. The notary requested a new printout on 17.9.
3. The notary sends me the update and the green light for the payment on 18.9.
4. Justizkasse Bamberg issues the invoice for changes few days after the change on 21.9.

I continued googling and it seems that the right keywords are "Eintragungsnachricht", "Eigentumsnachweis" or "Eintragungsbekanntmachung" (as you noted). This is something I should receive (or should have received).

My GF made me thinking that we received the bill for "Eigentumsumschreibung" from Landesjustizkasse at the beginning of the process. The "Auflassungsvormerkung" typically takes just a couple of days. The "Eigentumsumschreibung" takes up to several months and the system may request the payment in different order than I noted above. 

 

If this is not much hassle for you - could you please check if you received the bill for the "Eigentumsumschreibung" before or after the "Eintragungsbekanntmachung"?

 

For sure I will check with the notary but I am afraid that they are all out of the office. The situation makes me nervous for one single reason - Wohngebäudeversicherung...

 

PS: Is your avatar a selfie from a speeding ticket? :-)

 

I have a "Kostenrechnung in der Grundbuchsache" dated 17.02.2015 and then an "Eintragungsbekanntmachung from Amtsgericht" for the Auflassungsvormerkung dated 18.02.2015 and this is sent to me from the Notar on 19.02.2015.  

 

I have another "Kostenrechnung in der Grundbuchsache" dated 25.02.2015 and a letter from the Notar from 02.03.2015 telling me to pay the former owner.  On 3.03.2015 an Eintragungsbekanntmachung from Amtsgericht for my mortgage to have entered the Grundbuch, sent to me from the Notar on 5.03.2015.

 

I have a Besitzübergabeprotokoll from 28.02.2015.

 

On 20.03.2015 I have a letter from the Notar telling me that they have requested the Eigentumsumschreibung in Grundbuch. On 26.03.2015 there is a "Kostenrechnung in der Grundbuchsache" again.  Eintragungsbekanntmachung for this dated on 27.03.2015 sent to me with a letter from the Notar dated 30.03.2015

 

P.S: My Avatar is indeed a selfie from a speeding ticket.  I figured I paid for it, might as well use it for something.

 

[jeba 3,584]

16 hours ago, Korla said:

The situation makes me nervous for one single reason - Wohngebäudeversicherung...

I´d suggest to have it in place beginning with the date of "Übergang von Besitz, Nutzen, Lasten und Gefahren" (I bet that´s what your contract will say). IIRC there will be a seamless transition even if the old owner used a different company. After all, at least the fire insurance is mandatory in Bavaria so I´d expect the process will be such that there can be no gaps. I don´t recall the details but when I had sold my property last year I received a refund based on the date the insurance of the new owner kicked in without me having to tell the insurance that date.

[Korla 14]

 

20 hours ago, LeonG said:

 

I have a "Kostenrechnung in der Grundbuchsache" dated 17.02.2015 and then an "Eintragungsbekanntmachung from Amtsgericht" for the Auflassungsvormerkung dated 18.02.2015 and this is sent to me from the Notar on 19.02.2015.  

 

I have another "Kostenrechnung in der Grundbuchsache" dated 25.02.2015 and a letter from the Notar from 02.03.2015 telling me to pay the former owner.  On 3.03.2015 an Eintragungsbekanntmachung from Amtsgericht for my mortgage to have entered the Grundbuch, sent to me from the Notar on 5.03.2015.

 

I have a Besitzübergabeprotokoll from 28.02.2015.

 

On 20.03.2015 I have a letter from the Notar telling me that they have requested the Eigentumsumschreibung in Grundbuch. On 26.03.2015 there is a "Kostenrechnung in der Grundbuchsache" again.  Eintragungsbekanntmachung for this dated on 27.03.2015 sent to me with a letter from the Notar dated 30.03.2015

 

P.S: My Avatar is indeed a selfie from a speeding ticket.  I figured I paid for it, might as well use it for something.

 

This is extremely helpful. Thank you. I also love the avatar. It is the most creative&funny thing I've seen recently.

11 hours ago, jeba said:

I´d suggest to have it in place beginning with the date of "Übergang von Besitz, Nutzen, Lasten und Gefahren" (I bet that´s what your contract will say). IIRC there will be a seamless transition even if the old owner used a different company. After all, at least the fire insurance is mandatory in Bavaria so I´d expect the process will be such that there can be no gaps. I don´t recall the details but when I had sold my property last year I received a refund based on the date the insurance of the new owner kicked in without me having to tell the insurance that date.

I checked this online and the critical milestone for the insurance is the change in the Grundbuch. (Eigentümer vs Besitzer).

And you're bet is right. "Übergang von Besitz, Nutzen, Lasten und Gefahren" (I bet that´s what your contract will say)" is exactly what the contract says. I wish I was notary. I could earn money likely easier. A friend of mine told me that my contract is practically copy/paste from his contract. No wonder the office is on the most expensive street in Munich.