How many of you will trust Covid-19 vaccine with own lives?

How many of you will trust Covid-19 vaccine with own lives?   132 votes

  1. 1. How many of you will trust Covid-19 vaccine with own lives?

    • I will do it, this vaccine is made by doctors, and they know how is done and if is efficient.
      88
    • I will not do it, doctors got different opinions about side effects, for the moment they don't trust this vaccine, why should I do it?
      7
    • Vaccine? For Covid-19? GTFOOH! Doctors still learn the virus and you want to do a vaccine? Are you insane?
      3
    • They plan to force people to do the vaccine, in order to fly, otherwise you cannot fly or travel internationally without one.
      11
    • I am ok without one, I am still healthy, after 8-9 months of ''quarantine living'. With mask and disinfectants who needs a vaccine?
      2
    • I will do it, but in a year or so, first persons are ''lab rats'' testers. I don't trust them yet.
      19
    • I was already sick. No need for a vaccine for me.
      2

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2,105 posts in this topic

 

A good thread explaining what happened with this vaccine. TL;DR: it has some molecule that causes an autoimmune reaction similar to the reaction to antithrombotic drug Heparin. I personally had to inject heparin 2 weeks every day after the surgery, to avoid the risk of thrombosis. I had 1 in a million chance to get this autoimmune reaction, too. But the risk to get the blood clots was way, way higher. 

 

Germany did not ban or suspend heparin, but banned AstroZeneca. Antivaxxer EU fail :(

 

 

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10 minutes ago, yourkeau said:

Antivaxxer EU fail :(

 

So the EU approve and use vaccines for MMR, Polio, Tetanus, FSME, Chickenpox etc etc... but they DARE to question 1 vaccine and all of a sudden they are tarred with the dreaded Anti-vax brush. Come on ??? Really ? 

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I'm looking forward to them questioning the other vaccines.

All those 90+ year-olds who have died this last year following vaccination with the other vaccines. Nobody looking into that yet? Plenty of scope for scare-mongering there.

 

Why is the bone pointing only at AZ ?

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We all know why.  EU is being criticised, claim credit for Biontech and point fingers at Oxford.

The mess they are in is not due to vaccine suppliers.

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42 minutes ago, Jonny said:

 

So the EU approve and use vaccines for MMR, Polio, Tetanus, FSME, Chickenpox etc etc... but they DARE to question 1 vaccine and all of a sudden they are tarred with the dreaded Anti-vax brush. Come on ??? Really ? 

You know why it is so. Those vaccines were approved by experts while here it is a purely political decision to appease the antivax population (in particular, CSU and CDU voters). 

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Right. OK. So including all of the CSU and CDU voters, are you saying that millions of people in Germany are anti-vaxxers ? How many ? 25% ? 50% ?

 

So all those people who have had their MMR, Polio, Tetanus boosters etc. They're all anti vaxxers are they ?

 

They're probably all conspiracy theorists too.

 

Course they are @Yorkeau ;-)

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37 out of 17,000,000 people vaccinated with AZ had blood clots.  Blood clots happen before, during and after covid.  Tying any of these 17 cases to AZ will take time and may/may not result in an relation.  Meanwhile...

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...more than 37 died 4 weeks from now due to not being vaccinated

 

Think AZ have reported 37 in 17 million and Pfizer 25 in 11 miliion.  Hmmmm.

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I wouldn´t be surprised if it turns out that this mainly affects women of childbearing age (IF there is even a causal relationship) as those are at elevated risk for clotting anyway and at least consider administration to men and postmenopausal women to continue. You can´t keep an effective vaccine lying on the shelf while the virus is spreading unabatedly.

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19 hours ago, bennetn said:

We all know why.  EU is being criticised, claim credit for Biontech and point fingers at Oxford.

The mess they are in is not due to vaccine suppliers.

It was NOT the decision of the EU to suspend vaccination with AZ. It was the decision (national decision) of governments to suspend. In fact the EU has said again and again that the risks of blood clots is too low to warrant a suspension. I am confident that EMA will confirm this view tomorrow and vaccination will resume.

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22 hours ago, Jonny said:

Right. OK. So including all of the CSU and CDU voters, are you saying that millions of people in Germany are anti-vaxxers ? How many ? 25% ? 50% ?

 

I am not saying, this is a fact. Germany is not as bad as France, though, and German anti-vax sentiment results mostly from risk aversion rather than disbelief in science. 

 

 6051d83a41158_MW-HL701_Antiva_2019061911

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/this-is-the-most-anti-vaxxer-country-in-the-world-2019-06-19

 

Less than 70% of Germans believe that Pfizer-BioNTech is safe, only ~43% trust AstraZeneca:

https://de.statista.com/infografik/24393/umfrage-zur-einschaetzung-der-sicherheit-von-corona-impfstoffen/

 

It is safe to assume that at least 25% of German population will not take any vaccine. However, for new mutations you need 80-90% vaccination quote to get herd immunity. 

 

In Israel sceptics get vaccines as they were threatened to not to be able to enjoy life (travel abroad, eating out, gyms etc). In Germany sceptics will block any attempt to do so. 

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I have a question. If I get vaccine A now, must I get my booster shot from vaccine A or can I then get vaccine B or C? Will I be married to the first one I get?

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21 minutes ago, yourkeau said:

It is safe to assume that at least 25% of German population will not take any vaccine. However, for new mutations you need 80-90% vaccination quote to get herd immunity. 

 

In Israel sceptics get vaccines as they were threatened to not to be able to enjoy life (travel abroad, eating out, gyms etc). In Germany sceptics will block any attempt to do so. 

 

I don't agree. I think the secret right now is the government saying the big fat lie that vaccines won't be mandatory. By October/November, when the remaining population refuses the vaccine, they will just make their life miserable, for example by having a requirement for vaccination passports to be able to travel. In practice, this will be mandatory.

Eventually they will expand it for kids and then they can make it mandatory for schools.

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1 hour ago, yourkeau said:

I am not saying, this is a fact. Germany is not as bad as France, though, and German anti-vax sentiment results mostly from risk aversion rather than disbelief in science. 

 

 6051d83a41158_MW-HL701_Antiva_2019061911

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/this-is-the-most-anti-vaxxer-country-in-the-world-2019-06-19

 

Less than 70% of Germans believe that Pfizer-BioNTech is safe, only ~43% trust AstraZeneca:

https://de.statista.com/infografik/24393/umfrage-zur-einschaetzung-der-sicherheit-von-corona-impfstoffen/

 

It is safe to assume that at least 25% of German population will not take any vaccine. However, for new mutations you need 80-90% vaccination quote to get herd immunity. 

 

In Israel sceptics get vaccines as they were threatened to not to be able to enjoy life (travel abroad, eating out, gyms etc). In Germany sceptics will block any attempt to do so. 

Being sceptical of a new vaccine is not the same as being anti vaxx.

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1 hour ago, fraufruit said:

I have a question. If I get vaccine A now, must I get my booster shot from vaccine A or can I then get vaccine B or C? Will I be married to the first one I get?

I used to do research in immunology.

I can't definitely answer that question, but I personally would NOT mix vaccines. IMHO, that COULD lead to two partial, temporary immune responses and a real danger of NO lasting immunity.

 

Some thoughts:

- The various vaccines use different methods of introducing non-lethal antigens, some using messenger RNA to make the body produce the antigen, others using viruses etc.
MAYBE that's OK, as the goal is to get the body to "see" an antigen and respond to it without getting sick.

 

- More problematic is the question - what sort of antigen is produced/presented to the body? A Covid shell spike? What exact part of it? A bit of the Covid virus envelope? What exact bit? The resulting antigens triggering the all important immune response could be subtly or not so subtly different, and the resulting very specific antibodies from shot 1 of vaccine A might be different from shot 2 of vaccine B.

That means the initial immune reponse caused by shot 1 (vaccine A) is not reinforced by shot 2 (vaccine B ) to become a more permanent response, and shot 2 just triggers another initial weak response.

In such a case, BOTH initial responses for BOTH VACCINES fade away after a few weeks/months instead of hopefully a year or more, and stronger!

 

- Wouldn't the two different initial immune responses somehow "stimulate" each other?

I don't know. Maybe if very similar. But I would bet money (but not my life) science right now doesn't know the answer either.

 

It's kind of like a weapons race - what armor to build against what weapons?

 

Now, I'm just (hopefully intelligently) guessing here from my background - but I personally will be insisting on a second shot of the SAME VACCINE.

 

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, jeba said:

I wouldn´t be surprised if it turns out that this mainly affects women of childbearing age (IF there is even a causal relationship) as those are at elevated risk for clotting anyway and at least consider administration to men and postmenopausal women to continue. You can´t keep an effective vaccine lying on the shelf while the virus is spreading unabatedly.

The elderly have a higher risk of thrombosis than women of childbearing age.

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31 minutes ago, Metall said:

I personally will be insisting on a second shot of the SAME VACCINE.

 

Actually, I wasn't referring to the second shot that one must get with all vaccines other than J & J. I'm talking about booster shots further down the road. From what I read, the vaccines only last for some months and then we will need a booster the same as with flu shots.

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4 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

 

Actually, I wasn't referring to the second shot that one must get with all vaccines other than J & J. I'm talking about booster shots further down the road. From what I read, the vaccines only last for some months and then we will need a booster the same as with flu shots.

 

I don't think it matters.  Like when you get tetanus shots which you are supposed to booster every 10 years, you don't always get the same vaccine.

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10 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

 

Actually, I wasn't referring to the second shot that one must get with all vaccines other than J & J. I'm talking about booster shots further down the road. From what I read, the vaccines only last for some months and then we will need a booster the same as with flu shots.

I would apply the same reasoning to booster shots, to be honest.

I would be concerned if there will be a booster effect at all if using a different vaccine...

 

...hoping there will be a study soon.

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5 minutes ago, LeonG said:

 

I don't think it matters.  Like when you get tetanus shots which you are supposed to booster every 10 years, you don't always get the same vaccine.

As with the 'flu shots- every year they contain 2-3 varieties of previous year's strain.

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