Covid-19 Poll (UPDATE 9 Aug 2020: new poll questions)

[dessa_dangerous 13,315]

3 hours ago, balticus said:

 

Which forum rule was violated by my post?  😉

 

 

 

referral to removed posts

 

also, incitement to flame war

[Janx Spirit 11,331]

Cases and mortality by country

COUNTRY	CONFIRMED	DEATHS	CASE-FATALITY	DEATHS/100K POP.
San Marino	699	42	6.0%	124.32
Belgium	72,784	9,866	13.6%	86.38
United Kingdom	310,696	46,596	15.0%	70.08
Andorra	955	52	5.4%	67.53
Peru	463,875	20,649	4.5%	64.55
Spain	314,362	28,503	9.1%	61.00
Italy	249,756	35,190	14.1%	58.23
Sweden	82,323	5,763	7.0%	56.59
Chile	368,825	9,958	2.7%	53.17
US	4,941,755	161,347	3.3%	49.32
Brazil	2,962,442	99,572	3.4%	47.54
France	235,207	30,327	12.9%	45.27
Mexico	469,407	51,311	10.9%	40.66
Panama	72,560	1,591	2.2%	38.09
Ireland	26,470	1,772	6.7%	36.51
Netherlands	58,117	6,174	10.6%	35.83
Ecuador	91,969	5,897	6.4%	34.52
Bolivia	87,891	3,524	4.0%	31.04
Armenia	39,985	777	1.9%	26.32
North Macedonia	11,554	519	4.5%	24.92
Colombia	367,204	12,250	3.3%	24.67
Canada	120,903	9,017	7.5%	24.33
Moldova	26,990	835	3.1%	23.55
Switzerland	36,269	1,986	5.5%	23.32
Kyrgyzstan	39,162	1,451	3.7%	22.97
Iran	322,567	18,132	5.6%	22.17
Luxembourg	7,113	119	1.7%	19.58
South Africa	545,476	9,909	1.8%	17.15
Portugal	52,351	1,746	3.3%	16.98
Kosovo	9,869	303	3.1%	16.42
Honduras	46,365	1,465	3.2%	15.28
Iraq	144,064	5,236	3.6%	13.62
Romania	59,273	2,616	4.4%	13.43
Guatemala	55,270	2,168	3.9%	12.57
Bosnia and Herzegovina	13,687	394	2.9%	11.85
Dominican Republic	77,709	1,259	1.6%	11.85
Kuwait	70,727	471	0.7%	11.38
Germany	216,196	9,195	4.3%	11.09
Denmark	14,747	617	4.2%	10.64
Oman	81,067	502	0.6%	10.39
Monaco	128	4	3.1%	10.34
Russia	875,378	14,698	1.7%	10.17
Bahrain	43,307	159	0.4%	10.13
Argentina	235,677	4,411	1.9%	9.91
Montenegro	3,549	61	1.7%	9.80
Saudi Arabia	285,793	3,093	1.1%	9.18
Serbia	27,608	626	2.3%	8.97
Austria	21,837	720	3.3%	8.14
El Salvador	19,544	520	2.7%	8.10
Sao Tome and Principe	878	15	1.7%	7.11
Turkey	238,450	5,813	2.4%	7.06
Albania	6,151	189	3.1%	6.59
Israel	80,991	581	0.7%	6.54
Qatar	112,383	180	0.2%	6.47
Equatorial Guinea	4,821	83	1.7%	6.34
Bulgaria	13,209	442	3.3%	6.29
Hungary	4,621	602	13.0%	6.16
Djibouti	5,338	59	1.1%	6.15
Belarus	68,614	583	0.8%	6.15
Slovenia	2,233	125	5.6%	6.05
Finland	7,554	331	4.4%	6.00
Kazakhstan	97,829	1,058	1.1%	5.79
Cabo Verde	2,780	29	1.0%	5.33
Egypt	95,147	4,971	5.2%	5.05
Suriname	2,203	29	1.3%	5.03
Eswatini	3,036	56	1.8%	4.93
Azerbaijan	33,376	483	1.4%	4.86
Norway	9,551	256	2.7%	4.82
Estonia	2,133	63	3.0%	4.77
Poland	50,324	1,787	3.6%	4.71
Costa Rica	22,081	218	1.0%	4.36
Ukraine	80,018	1,879	2.3%	4.21
Croatia	5,466	155	2.8%	3.79
United Arab Emirates	62,061	356	0.6%	3.70
Maldives	4,769	19	0.4%	3.68
Czechia	18,060	389	2.2%	3.66
Mauritania	6,498	157	2.4%	3.57
Afghanistan	37,015	1,307	3.5%	3.52
India	2,088,611	42,518	2.0%	3.14
Antigua and Barbuda	92	3	3.3%	3.12
Algeria	34,155	1,282	3.8%	3.04
Lithuania	2,194	81	3.7%	2.90
Pakistan	282,645	6,052	2.1%	2.85
Iceland	1,952	10	0.5%	2.83
Guyana	538	22	4.1%	2.82
Barbados	138	7	5.1%	2.44
Gabon	7,923	51	0.6%	2.41
Indonesia	121,226	5,593	4.6%	2.09
Bangladesh	252,502	3,333	1.3%	2.07
West Bank and Gaza	13,722	94	0.7%	2.06
Philippines	122,754	2,168	1.8%	2.03
Greece	5,270	210	4.0%	1.96
Nicaragua	3,902	123	3.2%	1.90
Malta	995	9	0.9%	1.86
Sudan	11,894	773	6.5%	1.85
Latvia	1,281	32	2.5%	1.66
Liberia	1,230	78	6.3%	1.62
Libya	5,079	108	2.1%	1.62
Cyprus	1,222	19	1.6%	1.60
Haiti	7,599	177	2.3%	1.59
Cameroon	17,718	391	2.2%	1.55
Guinea-Bissau	2,032	27	1.3%	1.44
Senegal	10,887	225	2.1%	1.42
Morocco	30,662	461	1.5%	1.28
Central African Republic	4,641	59	1.3%	1.26
Zambia	7,486	200	2.7%	1.15
Australia	20,698	278	1.3%	1.11
Congo (Brazzaville)	3,637	58	1.6%	1.11
Lesotho	742	23	3.1%	1.09
Uruguay	1,325	37	2.8%	1.07
Lebanon	5,951	70	1.2%	1.02
Paraguay	6,508	69	1.1%	0.99
Sierra Leone	1,887	68	3.6%	0.89
Comoros	396	7	1.8%	0.84
Japan	45,764	1,042	2.3%	0.82
Kenya	25,138	413	1.6%	0.80
Mauritius	344	10	2.9%	0.79
Cuba	2,829	88	3.1%	0.78
Malawi	4,575	137	3.0%	0.76
Venezuela	24,166	208	0.9%	0.72
Zimbabwe	4,451	102	2.3%	0.71
Brunei	142	3	2.1%	0.70
Ghana	40,097	206	0.5%	0.69
Tajikistan	7,706	62	0.8%	0.68
Mali	2,561	125	4.9%	0.66
Namibia	2,802	16	0.6%	0.65
Somalia	3,227	93	2.9%	0.62
Korea, South	14,562	304	2.1%	0.59
Trinidad and Tobago	225	8	3.6%	0.58
Slovakia	2,523	31	1.2%	0.57
Uzbekistan	29,057	181	0.6%	0.55
Madagascar	12,708	135	1.1%	0.51
Chad	942	76	8.1%	0.49
Singapore	54,797	27	0.0%	0.48
Nigeria	45,687	936	2.0%	0.48
Georgia	1,213	17	1.4%	0.46
New Zealand	1,569	22	1.4%	0.45
Jamaica	987	13	1.3%	0.44
Tunisia	1,656	51	3.1%	0.44
South Sudan	2,450	47	1.9%	0.43
Cote d'Ivoire	16,524	104	0.6%	0.41
Guinea	7,777	50	0.6%	0.40
Malaysia	9,063	125	1.4%	0.40
Ethiopia	21,452	380	1.8%	0.35
China	88,580	4,681	5.3%	0.34
Benin	1,936	38	2.0%	0.33
Niger	1,153	69	6.0%	0.31
Togo	1,028	22	2.1%	0.28
Burkina Faso	1,158	54	4.7%	0.27
Congo (Kinshasa)	9,355	218	2.3%	0.26
Nepal	22,214	70	0.3%	0.25
Angola	1,538	67	4.4%	0.22
Jordan	1,237	11	0.9%	0.11
Thailand	3,345	58	1.7%	0.08
Mozambique	2,213	15	0.7%	0.05
Sri Lanka	2,839	11	0.4%	0.05
Rwanda	2,128	5	0.2%	0.04
Tanzania	509	21	4.1%	0.04
Papua New Guinea	188	3	1.6%	0.03
Taiwan*	477	7	1.5%	0.03
Uganda	1,254	6	0.5%	0.01
Vietnam	789	10	1.3%	0.01
Yemen	1,796	512	28.5%	nan
Syria	1,060	48	4.5%	nan
Gambia	1,090	19	1.7%	nan
Bahamas	830	14	1.7%	nan
Diamond Princess	712	13	1.8%	nan
Burma	359	6	1.7%	nan

 

 

https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/data/mortality

 

Shocking to see the UK so high.

[Rushrush 301]

An option I didn't see is "I'm a lockdown skeptic, that would be me.

 

As an aside why the hell is everyone NOW mandating masks when the death/inflection rates are falling. Why not at the beginning when it matter.

[dessa_dangerous 13,315]

@Rushrush you don't think numbers 2, 3, 4 or 6 could describe you?

 

Eight answers is the maximum allowed, by the way.  

 

However, don't hesitate to open your own thread and create a poll with all the answers that you think describe the people around you.  I would actually be really curious to see what that would look like.

[El Jeffo 42,135]

Plague rats, please...

 

[bramble 9,643]

2 hours ago, balticus said:

In Finland, Denmark, Estonia, and Latvia there is no mask mandate.   Look at their case loads on worldometers.info .

 

 

 

I refuted your claim about the Netherlands. They obviously now seem to think wearing face masks being obligatory in certain areas has some worth.

[Metall 14,557]

1 hour ago, El Jeffo said:

Plague rats, please...

 

 

Actually, it says "do not throw trash here, please" (kokoni gomiwo sutenaide kudasai).

*happily having having a nerd moment here!*

 

...actually, the throwing trash statement applies pretty well to parts of this thread, too.

 

[Guest]

41 minutes ago, bramble said:

I refuted your claim about the Netherlands. They obviously now seem to think wearing face masks being obligatory in certain areas has some worth.

Not really.

 

Nothing about masks on this page.

 

https://www.government.nl/topics/coronavirus-covid-19/tackling-new-coronavirus-in-the-netherlands/basic-rules-for-everyone

 

This from the "Dutch Dr. Fauci":

 

https://www.newsweek.com/netherlands-mask-policy-1522917

 

Bottom line is that they are not convinced there is any benefit.

 

Denmark:

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-07-26/face-mask-photo-op-adds-to-bewilderment-over-non-use-in-denmark

 

There is diversity of opinion.

 

UCLA Professor on the transmission.   Based on other articles, he does not advocate masks for everyone.

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/07/23/we-can-control-covid-19-before-vaccine-by-focusing-core-groups/

 

It is nice that TTers want to be conscientious, but the ideas about masks are not science based and the lack of support for kids going back to school is absurd.

[bramble 9,643]

35 minutes ago, balticus said:

Not really.

 

Nothing about masks on this page.

 

https://www.government.nl/topics/coronavirus-covid-19/tackling-new-coronavirus-in-the-netherlands/basic-rules-for-everyone

 

This from the "Dutch Dr. Fauci":

 

https://www.newsweek.com/netherlands-mask-policy-1522917

 

Please keep up. They seem to have changed their minds in the meantime.  Masks are obligatory in certain areas since beginning of August. It's even been in the news recently. Rotterdam and Amsterdam specifically. 

 

Edit: Just one of several news outlets saying all the same:  https://rp-online.de/nrw/staedte/kleve/corona-in-holland-unterschiedliche-corona-schutzmassnahmen-und-bestimmungen_aid-52621403

INFO
These are the new regulations in Holland
Measures As outdoor masks are now compulsory in neuralgic places in Amsterdam and Rotterdam, disposable masks are to be distributed free of charge during peak shopping hours.

Punishment The police have already announced controls of the compulsory masks. After an introductory phase, they want to prosecute administrative offences with fines. The authorities and politicians already reserve the right to extend the wearing obligation if the number of new corona infections continues to rise.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

[catjones 1,702]

On 8/8/2020, 3:34:53, DaringD said:

This has exposed to me just how many people in the world are spoiled brats, with no sense of common good and no sense of duty. 

 

and the sanctimonious, self-righteous, mask-hysterics. 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, bramble said:

 

Please keep up. They seem to have changed their minds in the meantime.  Masks are obligatory in certain areas since beginning of August. It's even been in the news recently. Rotterdam and Amsterdam specifically. 

 

Edit: Just one of several news outlets saying all the same:  https://rp-online.de/nrw/staedte/kleve/corona-in-holland-unterschiedliche-corona-schutzmassnahmen-und-bestimmungen_aid-52621403

INFO
These are the new regulations in Holland
Measures As outdoor masks are now compulsory in neuralgic places in Amsterdam and Rotterdam, disposable masks are to be distributed free of charge during peak shopping hours.

Punishment The police have already announced controls of the compulsory masks. After an introductory phase, they want to prosecute administrative offences with fines. The authorities and politicians already reserve the right to extend the wearing obligation if the number of new corona infections continues to rise.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

 

My understanding is that cities like Amsterdam and Rotterdam are free to make stricter regulations, but the rules do not come from the Federal level.

 

https://www.politico.eu/article/as-europe-masks-up-coronavirus-covid19-the-netherlands-dithers/

 

Note that the article states once again that the authorities have doubts about the efficacy of masks.

[bramble 9,643]

53 minutes ago, balticus said:

My understanding is that cities like Amsterdam and Rotterdam are free to make stricter regulations, but the rules do not come from the Federal level.

 

Whatever your understanding is, you previously made the claim that masks are not compulsory in the Netherlands, which I refuted with updated facts. Just accept that, please. Disussion finished. 

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, bramble said:

 

Whatever your understanding is, you previously made the claim that masks are not compulsory in the Netherlands, which I refuted with updated facts. Just accept that, please. Disussion finished. 

 

They are compulsory in some areas but not everywhere and not by mandate of the Federal government.  You would need to read the links I posted to see why you refuted nothing.

 

But you have missed the forest for the trees:   there are lots of high level people who believe that the use cases for masks are very limited.  Health ministers of Netherlands and Denmark to be specific.

[bramble 9,643]

22 minutes ago, balticus said:

They are compulsory in some areas but not everywhere

 

That's what I said with links to verify. You didn't. 

 

22 minutes ago, balticus said:

and not by mandate of the Federal government.

 

So what? It's probably only a matter of time. 

 

Edit: Discussion definitely finished as of now. 

[Guest]

Private businesses have the right to require masks.    It is just an extension of "no shirt, no shoes, no service."

 

But the efficacy has not been proven sufficiently to people who are high level and who tend to err on the side of caution.

[BethAnnBitt 2,991]

I live on the Swiss border and in my neighboring Kanton masks are only required on public transportation, and as I have noted on TT threads many Swiss folks are evading that too.  Also when people disembark they rip those masks off in a flash.  It‘s a different mindset from here and one that actually gets my Swiss neighbor upset (he prefers the German approach).  I also have friends who live in Switzerland and think it‘s nuts here in Germany.  So I am kind of living in a bipolar world when it comes to the mask wearing thing.

 

My observation is that when a rule such as mask wearing is more relaxed it causes people to exercise much less caution in general.  Conversely, mask wearing subtly encourages better social distancing and hygiene practices.  This annoying contraption that you are tethered to reminds you to behave.  People like to push boundaries and when the boundaries are clear and err more of the side of caution I think it keeps everything a little more safe.  At least it‘s a tradeoff I am willing to make for now. 

[Rushrush 301]

Insert facepalm 

 

 

 

[Keleth 9,321]

9 hours ago, Rushrush said:

Discussed before but Sweden has pretty much beaten covid, no more deaths much few cases. Read this first

Just read the article you linked and the table on next page of this thread.

Table doesn`t make pretty reading for them especially deaths per 100k pop or case fatality rating.

I`m pretty amazed that he says Covid is over in Sweden.It was incredibly low in many countries including Germany but it`s started to rise again.

 

[Keleth 9,321]

I still cannot see the great problem with wearing a mask.

I know someone said in shops in Cyprus 40 degrees etc buta bit of uncomfort for a short time is surely no great shakes and the 40 degrees is probably an outlier in a big % of shops worldwide.

Spent 3 weeks in reha and there you wear a mask or they send you home.Can take it off in your room or mealtimes and off of clinic grounds.You wear it all the time in doors otherwise and that includes physiotherapy,gym etc.

Now I wear one for 8 hours at work in mid 30 heat and yer it is uncomfortable for a while but you get used to it.

Yes we hear health reason mentioned but sorry I always look at it that if the wife can wear one shopping or on bus then anyone can wear one.

[keith2011 2,678]

It is actually really quite simple, if I have to wear a mask to protect others then others had better damn well wear a mask to return the favour. If they won't then sooner or later fists are going to fly and that won't be good if they are mine!

 

Angry after a late evening U-bahn trip.