Brexit, New residence permits

[Feierabend 1,003]

Hello, just wondering if  anyone has yet had any instructions for applying for the new permit from Brandenburg, as the affected amongst us are required to do? I'm sure I read that the local Ausländerbehörde would actively contact UK people already resident once the transition phase began. So far nota peep. We are in LDS  district and their Brexit info. page hasn't been updated for ages. (Apparently there are only about 70 of us in the area. Berlin with many many more got it's procedure up and running last year.)

Perhaps they are waiting on finalised government guidelines?

[keith2011 1,654]

Same for me in Munich, I had letters prior to 31-3-19 and 31-10-19, saying they would contact me with more info. once the deal or no-deal situation was clear, but nothing new so far this year.

[yesterday 1,404]

I would think its much to early to hear anything, give 1 or 2 months

[Feierabend 1,003]

Cheers, good to know it's not just B'burg.

[RenegadeFurther 2,337]

You know the cut off date is June 2021. They can contact you any time till that date.

[Feierabend 1,003]

So, so much for "just make sure you are properly  registered and everything will be easy-peasy ..."

 

OH has just received instructions from LDS to apply for the Aufenthaltserlaubnis.

This consists of a 12 page form and the requirement to provide copies of nine documents;

passport, marriage certs, spouse's passport, full recent Meldebescheinigung, up to date photo; health insurance certificate, pension record, statement of income, any social security benefits, Europöisches Führungszeugnis (criminal record cert.)

Then he has to book an appointment to give signatures and fingerprints.

(We've been registered here for over 20 years.)

[snowingagain 3,994]

19 minutes ago, Feierabend said:

So, so much for "just make sure you are properly  registered and everything will be easy-peasy ..."

 

The BMI website has indicated all this.

 

"The foreigners authority is entitled to check whether you fall under the Withdrawal Agreement. To this end, documents may be required providing clear evidence that you were living in Germany on 31 December 2020 and continue to do so, or that you used to live in Germany and have not been absent from Germany for too long and have therefore retained your rights. Tax statements, salary statements, bank statements, a certificate of student status and other documents which clearly indicate that you actually have, or had, a main ordinary residence in Germany constitute suitable evidence.

 

In individual cases, the foreigners authority may also check whether the other conditions for entitlement to freedom of movement have been met, in particular, whether you are pursuing an economic activity, are seeking work within the permitted period or with a prospect of success or have sufficient resources to support yourself even though you are not pursuing an economic activity or seeking work."

 

https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/faqs/EN/topics/constitution/brexit/faqs-brexit.html;jsessionid=40C4F220936148439B7D60F4CA77D76B.2_cid364#doc15091950bodyText4

[Mackle 753]

 

48 minutes ago, Feierabend said:

So, so much for "just make sure you are properly  registered and everything will be easy-peasy ..."

 

OH has just received instructions from LDS to apply for the Aufenthaltserlaubnis.

This consists of a 12 page form and the requirement to provide copies of nine documents;

passport, marriage certs, spouse's passport, full recent Meldebescheinigung, up to date photo; health insurance certificate, pension record, statement of income, any social security benefits, Europöisches Führungszeugnis (criminal record cert.)

Then he has to book an appointment to give signatures and fingerprints.

(We've been registered here for over 20 years.)

 

So much for it being a declaratory system then? But also an Aufenthaltserlaubnis and the rights enshrined in the WA are different in places.

[Mackle 753]

@Feierabend I'm pretty such that I saw recently that one of the people (Matt) from the British in Germany organisation which did the Brexit information events in partnership with the  British Consulate, was asking for instances of people who had been asked to fill out the normal form for an Aufenthaltserlaubnis to contact him / the organisation as that form was not suitable for use with the Withdrawal agreement.

[HEM 10,215]

I'm in Schleswig-Holstein: back in March 2019 the locale Ausländeramt sent me a 4-page Antrag auf Erteilung eines Aufenthaltstitels - Aufenhaltsgesetz (AufenthG) which I completed & returned & received a letter dated 2. April 2019 with:

 

 

Since then its been quiet.  I carry a copy of this document with me but have never been asked for it (have not travelled outside DE since then due to Corona).

[engelchen 12,840]

1 hour ago, Feierabend said:

So, so much for "just make sure you are properly  registered and everything will be easy-peasy ..."

 

OH has just received instructions from LDS to apply for the Aufenthaltserlaubnis.

This consists of a 12 page form and the requirement to provide copies of nine documents;

passport, marriage certs, spouse's passport, full recent Meldebescheinigung, up to date photo; health insurance certificate, pension record, statement of income, any social security benefits, Europöisches Führungszeugnis (criminal record cert.)

Then he has to book an appointment to give signatures and fingerprints.

(We've been registered here for over 20 years.)

 

I don't see the problem. Do you have an issue with providing any of the documents?

[RenegadeFurther 2,337]

54 minutes ago, engelchen said:

 

I don't see the problem. Do you have an issue with providing any of the documents?

 

You also need a letter from your employer, contract and last salary slip is not enough, you also need a letter from your landlord.

 

If your kid is at school you need a letter from the school.

 

Basically all people you have met in Germany will need to write a letter.

 

All documents will have to be translated also.

[Mackle 753]

1 hour ago, RenegadeFurther said:

 

You also need a letter from your employer, contract and last salary slip is not enough, you also need a letter from your landlord.

 

If your kid is at school you need a letter from the school.

 

Basically all people you have met in Germany will need to write a letter.

 

All documents will have to be translated also.

 

RF, have you messaged Matt Bristowe in BiG with this? 

[RenegadeFurther 2,337]

19 minutes ago, Mackle said:

 

RF, have you messaged Matt Bristowe in BiG with this? 

 

It is on the Berlin website for documents which Brits need to bring.

[BethAnnBitt 1,992]

Quote

OH has just received instructions from LDS to apply for the Aufenthaltserlaubnis.

This consists of a 12 page form and the requirement to provide copies of nine documents;

passport, marriage certs, spouse's passport, full recent Meldebescheinigung, up to date photo; health insurance certificate, pension record, statement of income, any social security benefits, Europöisches Führungszeugnis (criminal record cert.)

Then he has to book an appointment to give signatures and fingerprints.

(We've been registered here for over 20 years.)

This is the drill that we third country nationals have.  I even needed an Apostille for my marriage certificate.  I hear your frustration at this, especially after 20 years here, but it seems that until/unless something better is negotiated you folks are being moved into our queue.  

[RenegadeFurther 2,337]

5 minutes ago, BethAnnBitt said:

This is the drill that we third country nationals have.  I even needed an Apostille for my marriage certificate.  I hear your frustration at this, especially after 20 years here, but it seems that until/unless something better is negotiated you folks are being moved into our queue.  

 

No it is not the same.

 

Our rights are governed by the WA.

[Metall 13,670]

21 minutes ago, BethAnnBitt said:

This is the drill that we third country nationals have.  I even needed an Apostille for my marriage certificate.  I hear your frustration at this, especially after 20 years here, but it seems that until/unless something better is negotiated you folks are being moved into our queue.  

 

Yeah, welcome to the Third Country Waiting Room! Isn't that what you Brexiteers wanted?

[BethAnnBitt 1,992]

20 minutes ago, RenegadeFurther said:

No it is not the same.

Apparently the paperwork you must submit is the same as ours.  And the chipped card Aufenthaltstitel that you will be issued looks exactly like ours.

Quote

Our rights are governed by the WA.

With all due respect, I hope that works out to your satisfaction, but if that were definitively the case I think we would have a lot less freaking out on TT right now.

[Metall 13,670]

2 minutes ago, BethAnnBitt said:

 

With all due respect, I hope that works out to your satisfaction, but if that were definitively the case I think we would have a lot less freaking out on TT right now.

But some people want that!

[Mackle 753]

31 minutes ago, BethAnnBitt said:

Apparently the paperwork you must submit is the same as ours.  And the chipped card Aufenthaltstitel that you will be issued looks exactly like ours.

With all due respect, I hope that works out to your satisfaction, but if that were the case I think we would have a lot less freaking out on TT right now.

 

The confusing thing with this is that fairly recently the organisation that had been in consultation with Axel Dittman (British in Germany e.V), had been asking people to report instances of being asked to fill out the aufenthaltserlaubnis form by their local ABH, as the form was not suitable for use by those already in-country before the end of the year, and that it asked for details which under a declaratory system were not required.

 

If the system is constitutive in practice, then why not just call it that right from the outset rather than have people like Axel Dittman say being declaratory means nobody will have to leave as a result of Brexit?  And, if it is constitutive in practice, then why need to introduce new specific forms that ask for the same detail in the existing aufenthaltserlaubnis form, since that form already works?