8,875 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, fraufruit said:

Thanks. I just read that U.S. has fully vaccinated 12.3% and single doses for 22.7%.

 

scroll here

 

Looks a bit better than Germany.

Indeed you are correct FF.

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2 hours ago, murphaph said:

here in the EU we're only doing badly compared to a handful of countries

Those handful of other countries (in particular US and UK) are also modern, wealthy countries i.e. precisely the type of country against which the EU's performance should be compared. I criticised Boris Johnson about 10 months ago, when he used that line of argument to suggest the vast number of UK deaths wasn't too bad compared to many other countries: he had stopped comparing the UK to France, Germany, et al but instead wanted to compare against Brazil.

2 hours ago, murphaph said:

at least we are ahead of even the UK and US

That 2nd dose statistic might (as of today) make Germany seem less bad than the UK (but not the US). But whilst that statistic marginally supports your case (if the rate of vaccination in the UK continues, it will outstrip Germany on that one too) the only one which really matters (are people still getting ill and/or dying) shows Germany is now performing badly.  After shocking early mis-management of the crisis by the UK and US, the US is now vaccinating 2m+ per day, the UK has been regularly vaccinating 5-600k people a day for weeks. In Germany that number is around 200k. That is my concern, and I'd like to see the German government being more pro-active in getting systems set up so that the roll-out can be faster.

It isn't all due to a lack of available vaccines.

 

 

 

 

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Yeah I'd like to see an increase in vaccinations here too. I think the centralised structure of the NHS has lent itself far better to mass vaccination than our decentralised system here. I hope lessons are learned for future pandemics. In Ireland the system is crap but also centralised and the overwhelming issue has been one of supply there too, not actually getting the shots into the arms.

 

 

 

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32 minutes ago, dstanners said:

Those handful of other countries (in particular US and UK) are also modern, wealthy countries i.e. precisely the type of country against which the EU's performance should be compared. I criticised Boris Johnson about 10 months ago, when he used that line of argument to suggest the vast number of UK deaths wasn't too bad compared to many other countries: he had stopped comparing the UK to France, Germany, et al but instead wanted to compare against Brazil.

That 2nd dose statistic might (as of today) make Germany seem less bad than the UK (but not the US). But whilst that statistic marginally supports your case (if the rate of vaccination in the UK continues, it will outstrip Germany on that one too) the only one which really matters (are people still getting ill and/or dying) shows Germany is now performing badly.  After shocking early mis-management of the crisis by the UK and US, the US is now vaccinating 2m+ per day, the UK has been regularly vaccinating 5-600k people a day for weeks. In Germany that number is around 200k. That is my concern, and I'd like to see the German government being more pro-active in getting systems set up so that the roll-out can be faster.

It isn't all due to a lack of available vaccines.

 

 

 

 

Luckily they have just announced that Hausarzte can start from Easter so this should have a big impact to the rate of vaccinations

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30 minutes ago, dstanners said:

That is my concern, and I'd like to see the German government being more pro-active in getting systems set up so that the roll-out can be faster.

It isn't all due to a lack of available vaccines.

 

You are forgetting about German federalism. 

 

The German Government is only responsible for acquiring the vaccine and transporting it to the Länder.

 

The Lander are responsible for administrating the vaccines.

 

 

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Just now, engelchen said:

You are forgetting about German federalism.

 

Which is the root cause of many ills here (& I don't mean medical ones). 

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2 hours ago, engelchen said:

 

 

You are forgetting about German federalism. 

 

The German Government is only responsible for acquiring the vaccine and transporting it to the Länder.

 

The Lander are responsible for administrating the vaccines.

 

 

 i prefer federal democracy than strong center which has a tendency to become autocratic.

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42 minutes ago, RajeshG said:

 i prefer federal democracy than strong center which has a tendency to become autocratic.

 

I'm not against federalism per se, but federalism in Germany doesn't work well. Living in Berlin you should know this. 😉

 

Berlin is falling apart and bad governance is making everything worse. The federal government does not have the authority to interfere and the locals are too wrapped up in ideology to make changes. 

 

3 hours ago, HEM said:

 

Which is the root cause of many ills here (& I don't mean medical ones). 

 

I have to agree. 

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"We have to be honest about the situation - in Europe we don't have enough vaccines to stop a third wave through vaccinations alone," Spahn told reporters.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-56460696

 

Meanwhile, some US states are opening vaccinations to everyone over 16 starting next month. In Germany, we're heading back into another lockdown ...

 

https://twitter.com/GovPritzker/status/1372605352508801030

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4 hours ago, murphaph said:

I think the centralised structure of the NHS has lent itself far better to mass vaccination than our decentralised system

 

4 hours ago, engelchen said:

The German Government is only responsible for acquiring the vaccine and transporting it to the Länder

Until recently, that was what I saw as a key justification for the delays here too, and I'm sure it plays a role. However, the US is also federal, and as I understand it the vaccines are being rolled out by the states. 

One of the other issues is the very restrictive approach taken in Germany to interpreting GDPR and sharing data (age data and details of professions) which also adds to beaurocracy delays. But again, that only really has an impact on prioritising certain groups, not a general role-out.

 

 

 

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39 minutes ago, engelchen said:

 

I'm not against federalism per se, but federalism in Germany doesn't work well.

 

Overall it seemed to work well last year though, when different Länder were able to make local decisions, and it felt at the time like a very agile response to CoViD.

 

Out of interest, if you had a blank piece of paper, what would you replace Germany federalism with?

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21 minutes ago, Fritsen said:

 

Meanwhile, some US states are opening vaccinations to everyone over 16 starting next month. In Germany, we're heading back into another lockdown ...

 

https://twitter.com/GovPritzker/status/1372605352508801030

 

Some private companies in the UAE will vaccinate tourists. I think it is with Sinopharm, which I don't think is WHO approved and no idea how that is going to work with internationally recognised vaccine passports or cards. 

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25 minutes ago, Fritsen said:

Meanwhile, some US states are opening vaccinations to everyone over 16 starting next month. In Germany, we're heading back into another lockdown ...

 

As far as I know, we are still in the 2nd lockdown so I guess it's a seamless transition to the 3rd :)

As for some US states opening up, I am not so sure that is a good idea.  They haven't vaccinated enough people to reach herd immunity and likely they'll have loads of new cases.

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26 minutes ago, Mackle said:

Some private companies in the UAE will vaccinate tourists. I think it is with Sinopharm, which I don't think is WHO approved and no idea how that is going to work with internationally recognised vaccine passports or cards. 

 

So they will just have to get tested and quarantine when they come home I guess. Just like everyone else.

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3 hours ago, LeonG said:

 

As far as I know, we are still in the 2nd lockdown so I guess it's a seamless transition to the 3rd :)

As for some US states opening up, I am not so sure that is a good idea.  They haven't vaccinated enough people to reach herd immunity and likely they'll have loads of new cases.

 

Well, restrictions were gradually being loosened, but all that is being rolled back now. Some US states are opening up way too soon, but they are also vaccinating much more quickly than the EU. At this rate, we'll be lucky if vaccines open up to 16+ by autumn ...

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So will this new “circuit breaker” being announced by Merkel include closing schools?

 

i hope not, I really do. For the kids mental health. 
 

 And what was the point in introducing and rolling out self testing in schools if they half knew this may be coming up? 

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Can Someone change this site so New posts go at the top not the bottom? So don’t have to scroll down ?

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