Employer (startup) blatantly using dirty tactics to fire me

7 posts in this topic

Hi TT,

 

As many companies do towards the end of the year, they're cleaning up the managerial fuck ups, and as a result a bunch of colleagues and myself have been laid off.

I'm not taking this termination personally, but the company has continuously tried to misinform, pressure, lie, threaten, and even scheme so that I agree to the bullshit terms they came up with.

 

I made it pretty clear that I disagree with them, and that I won't be going down easy. I also told them I'll be lawyering up. The tension is real.

 

I'll be meeting my lawyer within 24 hours, but I'm scared that they'll try to frame me for some shit I didn't do. 

 

I will happily consult my lawyer but I wanted to find some solace on this forum in the meantime.

 

• not on probation

• long notice period

• fired for redundancy or financial difficulties, idk

• historically outperformed expectations and did nothing wrong

• yelled at for not signing my termination notice without consulting a lawyer first.

• falsely threatened me with immediate termination if I don't comply (hahah yeah ok)

 

It's just a fucked up situation overall lol, do you guys have any experiences like this?

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I wouldn't worry much, once you have a lawyer then they will protect you from any problems and I'm sure that they are used to seeing and dealing with such things.

 

In the meantime, just make sure that you don't have any contact with them.  And make sure that any contact in the future goes via your lawyer.

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2 hours ago, anonymousGerman said:

Hi TT,

 

As many companies do towards the end of the year, they're cleaning up the managerial fuck ups, and as a result a bunch of colleagues and myself have been laid off.

I'm not taking this termination personally, but the company has continuously tried to misinform, pressure, lie, threaten, and even scheme so that I agree to the bullshit terms they came up with.

 

I made it pretty clear that I disagree with them, and that I won't be going down easy. I also told them I'll be lawyering up. The tension is real.

 

I'll be meeting my lawyer within 24 hours, but I'm scared that they'll try to frame me for some shit I didn't do. 

 

I will happily consult my lawyer but I wanted to find some solace on this forum in the meantime.

 

• not on probation

• long notice period

• fired for redundancy or financial difficulties, idk

• historically outperformed expectations and did nothing wrong

• yelled at for not signing my termination notice without consulting a lawyer first.

• falsely threatened me with immediate termination if I don't comply (hahah yeah ok)

 

It's just a fucked up situation overall lol, do you guys have any experiences like this?

Good luck with that and I hope you have legal insurance.

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Well at least they were not smart enough to not yell at you when not signing immediately. A colleague of mine underwent psychological tricks like "you know its your last chance tommorrow the offer is no longer valid and you'll be out sacked with no compensation at all"... great bullshit. Well done for not signing before consulting your lawyer.

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@anonymousgerman: As you likely have a contract, just make sure that your baseline is that you get the minimum required within that. It is also worthwhile to get a lawyer, yes.

I suggest (as an ex-lawyer) that you identify the questions you need answered...make a list...refine it...make sure you know what you want to know, and then go see the lawyer. ( it is the best use of your time - and the cheapest way to make use of legal services).

I have been working in a start-up...never again for me. Too many numpties...but that's just my limited experience.

Good luck with it - I am sure you will be fine (...and don't forget the Zeugnis impacts (the long game, so to speak) )...

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If you are still going into work think about protecting yourself in small ways like a password on your computer. 

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Startups are tricky. I've seen both types and yes, it's almost always towards the end of the financial year when this stuff happens.

 

The biggest problem is that in Germany you can't sue for an Abfindung per se. You can only sue to keep your job but in most cases in a small start-up you won't want to work there anymore anyway (and often these redundancies are a sign the company is beginning to fail or lose the confidence of its investors) because the environment will be toxic and it's better to get out with something rather than just not get paid when the company likely becomes properly insolvent (and I have friends who've been really caught out by that because you can't claim any ALG if a company is effectively bankrupt but hasn't officially declared it!)

 

It is common that you sue to keep your job (Kündigungsschutzklage) and then during the process, you agree to the termination for a redundancy payment but that's not the starting position. But these sums are not as large as people think. The Arbeitsgericht sees 2 weeks salary per year of service as reasonable. If you have an offer better than this already there may be nothing worth fighting for.

 

The theory in Germany is fine and I guess in big concerns it works but in the start-up world it just doesn't. The small time CEOs of these start-ups can get quite vindictive and use the slightest excuse to fire a person without notice if they don't go quietly. They are emotionally attached to their (in their minds) next Facebook. They are sure they will not be one of the 90% of start-ups that fail. The maths says otherwise. 

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