Tesla Gigafactories, News and Conversation

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"The batteries that could make fossil fuels obsolete"

 

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Driven by steeply falling prices and technological progress that allows batteries to store ever-larger amounts of energy, grid-scale systems are seeing record growth.

Many of the gains are spillovers from the auto industry's race to build smaller, cheaper, and more powerful lithium-ion batteries for electric cars. In the US, state clean-energy mandates, along with tax incentives for storage systems that are paired with solar installations, are also playing an important role.

 

The mass deployment of storage could overcome one of the biggest obstacles to renewable energy – its cycling between oversupply when the sun shines or the wind blows, and shortage when the Sun sets or the wind drops. By smoothing imbalances between supply and demand, proponents say, batteries can replace fossil fuel "peaker" plants that kick in for a few hours a day when energy demands soar. As such, widespread energy storage could be key to expanding the reach of renewables and speeding the transition to a carbon-free power grid.

 

"Energy storage is actually the true bridge to a clean-energy future," says Bernadette Del Chiaro, executive director of the California Solar and Storage Association.

 

How quickly that future arrives depends in large part on how rapidly costs continue to fall. Already the price tag for utility-scale battery storage in the US has plummeted, dropping nearly 70% between 2015 and 2018, according to the US Energy Information Administration. This sharp price drop has followed advances in lithium-ion battery chemistry to significantly improve performance. Power capacity has expanded rapidly, and batteries can store and discharge energy over ever-longer periods of time.

 

BBC

 

 

List of the largest battery storage power stations:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battery_storage_power_station#Largest_grid_batteries

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More on new battery development if you're interested -

 

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Even after a 60% surge in the stock price this month, QuantumScape (QS) founder and CEO Jagdeep Singh stresses he still isn’t constantly checking the company’s share price. Nope, he just has his head down trying to change the world of electric car batteries.

“I don’t claim to be someone who can predict the near-term stock market behavior. Our focus is to keep our nose to the grindstone, head down, and bring these batteries into real cars on real roads as fast as we can. If we do that, we think there is an opportunity to create a tremendous amount of value regardless of what the short-term stock price does,” Singh told Yahoo Finance Live.

QuantumScape — founded in 2010 by Singh and backed early by Microsoft founder Bill Gates and auto giant Volkswagen — recently took a big stride in bringing a major battery technology to market. And by extension, probably lifting QuantumScape’s market cap well beyond the current $22 billion level as the company moves from pre-revenue stage to serious revenue producer.

 

 

the rest

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50 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

More on new battery development if you're interested -

 

 

the rest

 

Wow...it was 4$ in October 2020 and its 67.5$ now 🤯 

 

 

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@fraufruit, the problem with that company is that they won't scale up before 2027/2028. By then they assume a cost of what Tesla will have in 2023-2024...

Solid state batteries are not required for cars. Their main advantage, energy density, is more suitable for planes and boats.

It does not matter on a 1800kg car if the battery weights 300 or 150kg.

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2 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

 

It does not matter on a 1800kg car if the battery weights 300 or 150kg.

 

I am almost sure it does matter...   

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Maybe another possible blip on the radar -

 

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While Gigafactory Berlin construction has been moving at a fast pace, Tesla Inc (NASDAQ: TSLA) has had a few setbacks, including stopping tree clearing due to animal rights activists court cases.

Now, a report from Electrek says Tesla has missed a $100 million security deposit, which is causing things to go on hold temporarily. Tesla didn’t obtain overall approval to build Gigafactory Berlin, according to Electrek, and is operating with partial approvals to keep advancing the project at a quicker pace.

The deposit is needed in case the project is never finished. In the event that happens, Tesla would be responsible to pay for the demolition. The $100 million deposit covers that possibility, although at this point it seems unlikely.

The payment was supposedly due on Dec. 17.

 

 

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germany always behaves as if there are no consequences for their actions.  companies and countries are watching from around the world and will add the cost of doing business with germany to the risks and investments....in both directions.  lizards and snakes are everywhere.

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On 12/16/2020, 12:00:33, MikeMelga said:

Ok, forgetting tech aside, what would be the purpose of spending a huge amount of money to crack the main computer? 

You can't steal anything C from it, as the neural network is useless by itself.

Why don't the computer hackers, install software on the Tesla via the online updates, to take control of the Tesla, then use the self drive functions to drive it away and steal it, selling to someone who can live without the missed functions for a fraction of the New price of a Tesla

 

it that not something "Valuable"

Latest hacks 

 

https://www.npr.org/2020/12/15/946776718/u-s-scrambles-to-understand-major-computer-hack-but-says-little?t=1608373486578

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I've been following that story about the U.S. "Russian" hacks. They aren't sure that it is Russia yet. Every time I read such stories I just slap my head and think who believes that the U.S. and other countries aren't hacking Russia, China, etc.?

 

One other thing I was thinking about this morning - Environmentalists trying to shut down the construction of an electric car factory. There must be some irony in that statement somewhere.

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5 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

I've been following that story about the U.S. "Russian" hacks. They aren't sure that it is Russia yet. Every time I read such stories I just slap my head and think who believes that the U.S. and other countries aren't hacking Russia, China, etc.?

 

One other thing I was thinking about this morning - Environmentalists trying to shut down the construction of an electric car factory. There must be some irony in that statement somewhere.

 

We are never going to know, who did this as, they want to keep it a hidden. Just like we are never going to find out who poisoned 3 people in the UK, using Russian nuclear material, but we can all guess.

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4 hours ago, yesterday said:

We are never going to know, who did this

 

Actually, that's not true.  Given the scale and technical sophistication, this is not some guy in his basement, but state-sponsored and those states are known and on a short list.  It wasn't Luxemburg.  Like any serial crime, "DNA" is left at the scene and it can be compared to previous hacks.  When I assign the same custom project to two programmers, I will get the same result, but the code will be different.  "Looks like Ivan is at it again."

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30 minutes ago, catjones said:

 

Actually, that's not true.  Given the scale and technical sophistication, this is not some guy in his basement, but state-sponsored and those states are known and on a short list.  It wasn't Luxemburg.  Like any serial crime, "DNA" is left at the scene and it can be compared to previous hacks.  When I assign the same custom project to two programmers, I will get the same result, but the code will be different.  "Looks like Ivan is at it again."

 

Well actual a lot of hacker attacks are one man bands see here

https://www.kaspersky.com/resource-center/threats/top-ten-greatest-hackers

 

Sure we can all listen to the BS coming out  from the Governments, but actually, if a hacker is good they are not going to find you, its normally a stupid mistake that catch's you out.

We all know that US bans thinks like Huawei and Tiktok, not because they are a threat to national security, but because they are a threat to apple and other entertainment platforms.

 

And we all know how wrong the security services where  about the weapons of mass destruction that Saddam Hussain also had, how many millions died on that mistake.

 

Of course we will never see the evidence, of who did this attack, because its security related, and we could point out the obvious mistake in their work if we could, but pretty sure Russia will be targeted in the end.

 

 

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Joking aside, I would like to know why he thinks ~ 15% less of a vehicles total KSW wont make any difference to its perfomance... 

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Porsche and I presume Tesla must be wasting money then making most of the panels etc out of Aluminium because it keeps the weight down.

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23 hours ago, yesterday said:

We all know that US bans thinks like Huawei and Tiktok, not because they are a threat to national security, but because they are a threat to apple and other entertainment platforms.

 

Tiktok was an over-reach, but Trump's hardball on China might be the only thing I agree with him on.  (More his advisors than him, anyhow, and he often has the wrong motivation and no perspective past his nose.) I'm not hawkish, isolationist or protectionist at all, but we are foolishly lax on China, i.e. the Chinese state. The Chinese state are massive hypocrites. Few Western apps are allowed to operate in China, not without severe restrictions or state censorship, and not without 'technology transfer' (handing over your trade secrets). In short, e.g. Twitter is banned in China, but China is allowed to reap profits on running Tiktok outside its border. I mean, a foreign shell company, but still. Apple and Samsung, let's say, also have severe restrictions (not that they care), not to mention counterfeiters and fakers everywhere, but Huawei faces little obstacle in its market pursuits here. Nuts to that.

 

In the future, a spirit of reciprocity must exist or every Chinese company can tit-for-tat what the Chinese government does, i.e. banned. Don't forget, the Chinese government are holding two Canadians hostage in dungeons as reprisal for the (legal) detainment of Meng Wanzhou. Australian journalists were also imprisoned and hounded out.   

 

I am all for criticism of the US and other countries which do wrong. But they are not equivalent with Iran, which last week hanged a journalist for the crime of journalism, and continues to house many more in dungeons. China does the same, not to mention the hundreds of thousands right now in literal concentration camps (oops, vocational training centres). 

 

Huawei is right to be targeted as suspicious. China has benefited massively from Western aid, help and technological advancement, but the Chinese state is happy to let it remain a one way benefit and meanwhile cry about mistreatment while ramping-up anti-Western nationalism and suspicion in China, making unilateral claims on territory for military purposes, destroying the freedoms of Hong Kong, etc. 

 

Don't listen to any Chinese ambassador-puppet crocodile tears. 

 

23 hours ago, yesterday said:

And we all know how wrong the security services where  about the weapons of mass destruction that Saddam Hussain also had, how many millions died on that mistake.

 

The whole world knew it was BS, only certain American audiences ever for a second thought this had merit. I think Saddam had, understandably, very few friends to stand in his corner to stop what was obviously misdirected anti-Ay-rab revenge. 

 

23 hours ago, yesterday said:

Of course we will never see the evidence, of who did this attack, because its security related, and we could point out the obvious mistake in their work if we could, but pretty sure Russia will be targeted in the end.

 

China and Russia are the source of almost all state-level hacking attacks against Western governments (and plenty of weak governments in Asia and Africa, too). And yes, the US does it too. What's worse, a nationalist dictator with a gun, a begrudged mafioso with a gun, or a 'roided-up cop with a gun? (Trick question.)

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1 minute ago, alderhill said:

I'm not hawkish, isolationist or protectionist at all, but we are foolishly lax on China, i.e. the Chinese state.

Of course we are.

If we don`t allow China freedom and the ability to exploit it`s workers then where else is all the cheap shit going to come from.

The US needs China as bad as it is as China needs the US.

 

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