Tesla Gigafactories, News and Conversation

[Krieg 15,027]

1 hour ago, HH_Sailor said:

Beg to differ...

 

My boat's autopilot follows a series of waypoints. So it takes on the route that I program.

If this is what a Tesla does (turn left at the next lights, then right after Rewe) then I'd call it an autopilot.

 

If it only holds course and speed, then it's a high end cruise control with lane keeping assistance.

 

 

 

The main problem is that Tesla tells you, here you have your Autopilot, it will drive by itself and take you to your destination, but you have to be all the time there paying attention and ready to react when it makes a mistake.   So if there is an accident it is always the driver's fault.  

[fraufruit 42,165]

Quote

 

In July, the California DMV filed a complaint that EV manufacturer Tesla had put out "untrue or misleading" advertisements on its website in relation to its Full Self-Driving (FSD) and Autopilot technology. The DMV's gripe, essentially, is that the tech is impressive — but because it still needs constant supervision, it's neither fully self-driving nor anything approaching a true autopilot.

That complaint didn't go unnoticed, because this week the state’s legislature quickly passed a bill that would force Tesla to stop using the term Full Self-Driving entirely. The bill, which now only requires a signature from Governor Gavin Newsom, targets misleading advertising on self-driving technology in general and not just from Tesla, but it's clear the automaker is a major target.

 

 

[CincyInDE 3,293]

I had to get my windshield replaced, and the shop did not correctly reconnect all the autopilot cameras.  While the problem was being diagnosed and argued about between the glass shop and Tesla (with me as a proxy -- which was super annoying), I drove 4 hours to Schwarzwald and back.  NOT having autopilot, traffic-aware cruise control, speed limit display, safety features (like the automatic braking assistant) was really really kind of a pain in the ass.

 

So my point is, call it whatever the F you want.  When you don't have it you really notice its absence.

 

Carry on bickering, please. 

 

 

[MikeMelga 7,312]

This is all irrelevant when robotaxi comes. And in 20 years it will be forbidden for humans to drive at all.

[MikeMelga 7,312]

2 hours ago, Krieg said:

 

The main problem is that Tesla tells you, here you have your Autopilot, it will drive by itself and take you to your destination, but you have to be all the time there paying attention and ready to react when it makes a mistake.   So if there is an accident it is always the driver's fault.  

No, what Tesla says, from their webpage: " Autopilot enables your car to steer, accelerate and brake automatically within its lane.  Current Autopilot features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous. ".

 

Nothing said about taking to destination.

Regarding responsibility, it's very simple: that would require a L3 permission, which either doesn't exist in many countries, or is severely handicapped like in Germany. So if they made it L3 instead of L2, NOBODY would use it in Germany.

[Krieg 15,027]

15 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

No, what Tesla says, from their webpage: " Autopilot enables your car to steer, accelerate and brake automatically within its lane.  Current Autopilot features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous. ".

 

Nothing said about taking to destination.

Regarding responsibility, it's very simple: that would require a L3 permission, which either doesn't exist in many countries, or is severely handicapped like in Germany. So if they made it L3 instead of L2, NOBODY would use it in Germany.

 

Thank you for making my point.   I appreciate it.

[catjones 1,690]

23 hours ago, yesterday said:

Sorry I got that wrong 

 

I do believe that this is the first time I've read an unequivocal apology on TT.  @yesterday should get some sort of an award.  

Thanks.

[MikeMelga 7,312]

No bullshit test. No "super-guessing" youtuber, no competitor making fake videos.

As usual, the side pole test is impressively good.

 

SAFEST CAR IN THE WORLD 2022! Rest are fucking youtuber idiots and competitors spreading FUD.

https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/safest-fleet-cars/#?selectedMake=0&selectedMakeName=Select%20a%20make&selectedModel=0&selectedStar=&includeFullSafetyPackage=true&includeStandardSafetyPackage=true&selectedModelName=All&selectedProtocols=45155,41776&selectedClasses=1202,1199,1201,1196,1205,1203,1198,1179,40250,1197,1204,1180,34736,44997&allClasses=true&allProtocols=false&allDriverAssistanceTechnologies=true&selectedDriverAssistanceTechnologies=-1,1421,6001,1422&thirdRowFitment=false

 

 

[yesterday 2,022]

If you go to the Euro NCAP website

 

https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/

 

You will see Tesla is the safest, Fleet car 

 

While Mercedes has the safest family car !!!

 

So Tesla does not win in every sector, so its looks like you are posting  FUD, safety ratings can be different for different types of cars - Tesla does not win in every sector, this video does not make that distinction. 

 

Its even more interesting, if you look at the results for assisted-driving-gradings

 

The VW ID 5, gets a rating of Very good, while the Tesla Model 3 autopilot only get a Moderate. Do not know how to understand this, is autopilot real not the best in its class. 

 

Look at the website yourself,  It would appear some Tesla fan boy, has adjusted the filters to make the  conclusion they like

[Keleth 9,315]

16 hours ago, MikeMelga said:

No, what Tesla says, from their webpage: " Autopilot enables your car to steer, accelerate and brake automatically within its lane.  Current Autopilot features require active driver supervision and do not make the vehicle autonomous. ".

 

Nothing said about taking to destination.

Regarding responsibility, it's very simple: that would require a L3 permission, which either doesn't exist in many countries, or is severely handicapped like in Germany. So if they made it L3 instead of L2, NOBODY would use it in Germany.

 

We live in a world where you have to have signs telling people not to put their hands in fire or set light to themselves etc.

Tesla can legally distance themselves from people using its autopilot wrongly but actually calling it autopilot is not a good idea,there are enough idiots out there who would believe by the name that it does precisely what they think autopilot means.

 

[Keleth 9,315]

14 minutes ago, yesterday said:

If you go to the Euro NCAP website

 

https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/

 

You will see Tesla is the safest, Fleet car 

 

While Mercedes has the safest family car !!!

 

So Tesla does not win in every sector, so its looks like you are posting  FUD, safety ratings can be different for different types of cars - Tesla does not win in every sector, this video does not make that distinction. 

 

Its even more interesting, if you look at the results for assisted-driving-gradings

 

The VW ID 5, gets a rating of Very good, while the Tesla Model 3 autopilot only get a Moderate. Do not know how to understand this, is autopilot real not the best in its class. 

 

Look at the website yourself,  It would appear some Tesla fan boy, has adjusted the filters to make, so they can draw a conclusion they like

According to this page on that website the Mercedes comes top of the pure electric category as well...

Euro NCAP | Euro NCAP Best in Class 2021

[MikeMelga 7,312]

As predicted, it begins... the German mittlestand automotive destruction...

https://m-focus-de.translate.goog/finanzen/news/kronach-kronach-neuses-automobilzulieferer-dr-schneider-ist-insolvent_id_142492202.html?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=fr&_x_tr_pto=wapp

 

[MikeMelga 7,312]

4 hours ago, yesterday said:

If you go to the Euro NCAP website

 

https://www.euroncap.com/en/ratings-rewards/

 

You will see Tesla is the safest, Fleet car 

 

While Mercedes has the safest family car !!!

So Tesla does not win in every sector, so its looks like you are posting  FUD, safety ratings can be different for different types of cars - Tesla does not win in every sector, this video does not make that distinction. 

Dummy, you are looking at unsorted list. If you look at the values, Tesla comes on top.

Click on "Overall rating" column to order by overall rating.

 

 

Quote

 

Its even more interesting, if you look at the results for assisted-driving-gradings

 

The VW ID 5, gets a rating of Very good, while the Tesla Model 3 autopilot only get a Moderate. Do not know how to understand this, is autopilot real not the best in its class. 

Where are you seeing that? The Model 3, last tested in 2019, was top of the class.

Worst, the Model 3 was tested in 2019, while the iD5 was tested in 2021, so the tests are not comparable, as they were changed in 2020.

If you want to compare that, then you can compare the Model Y with iD5, because they used the same test for both. And Model Y has the same safety system as Model 3. 

Here Tesla is a clear winner, 98% vs 85%.

 

Quote

Look at the website yourself,  It would appear some Tesla fan boy, has adjusted the filters to make the  conclusion they like

I'm not immune to criticism, but if you want to criticize me, you better be sure about the data.

[MikeMelga 7,312]

4 hours ago, Keleth said:

According to this page on that website the Mercedes comes top of the pure electric category as well...

Euro NCAP | Euro NCAP Best in Class 2021

I usually just ignore you, but can't pass the opportunity to tell you you're wrong,  Tesla did no EuroNCap test in 2021. If you compare 2022 and 2021, same methodology, Tesla comes as a clear winner.

[yesterday 2,022]

53 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

Dummy, you are looking at unsorted list. If you look at the values, Tesla comes on top.

Click on "Overall rating" column to order by overall rating.

 

 

Agreed, the website default, does not default to the sorted list, when it first starts.

 

53 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

Where are you seeing that? The Model 3, last tested in 2019, was top of the class.

Worst, the Model 3 was tested in 2019, while the iD5 was tested in 2021, so the tests are not comparable, as they were changed in 2020.

If you want to compare that, then you can compare the Model Y with iD5, because they used the same test for both. And Model Y has the same safety system as Model 3. 

Here Tesla is a clear winner, 98% vs 85%.

 

Maybe we are taking about different things here

 

I was talking about  assisted driving gradings, which is on the dark grey  menu, with white text, right to middle of the screen, 2nd entry from the bottom is called 

assisted-driving-gradings , click on it

 

It has nothing to do, with the safety tests, so it does not matter that they were changed for 2021. Things like crashing cars into each other were changed.

I took this to mean an assessment of the driver assist features ( autopilot etc Driving Assistant Professional) and the safety implications, but not the protection the car gives once a crash has occurred.

 

At the top of the list you see VW ID 5,   which has ratings of  76%  and 85 %  and overall Very Good    Looks like the test was done in 2022

while   

The Tesla Model 3, which has ratings of 36 % and 95 % and overall score of Moderate.Looks like the test was done 2020

If you open the TAB, under ASSISTANCE COMPETENCE, one on e items listed is  Driver Monitoring, which is not very good, I remember reading about this on other websites.

Other  assisted-driving-gradings cars like the 

BMW 3 Series, which has a rating of 82 % and  90 %, and an overall score of Very Good, Looks like the test was performed in 2020, so is more of an apples to apples comparison.

using Driving Assistant Professional.

Of course I can accept things can change between 2020 (for Model 3, not for BMW) and 2022, but that page does not have any assisted-driving-gradings for the model Y, maybe test not performed yet, but there is a large difference between ID5/BMW and Model 3 in autonomous driving performance.

 

 

53 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

I'm not immune to criticism, but if you want to criticize me, you better be sure about the data.

 

Sure I always try to be correct and thankyou for your answers, as well I am normally not insulting people just trying to understand the situation.

 

[arsenal21 401]

On 7/9/2022, 16:47:33, MikeMelga said:

This is all irrelevant when robotaxi comes. And in 20 years it will be forbidden for humans to drive at all.

On 11/6/2022, 21:36:58, yesterday said:

 

Won't happen. Too many people like driving.

[arsenal21 401]

On 7/9/2022, 13:51:32, Krieg said:

 

The main problem is that Tesla tells you, here you have your Autopilot, it will drive by itself and take you to your destination, but you have to be all the time there paying attention and ready to react when it makes a mistake.   So if there is an accident it is always the driver's fault.  

If the Tesla senses the car is about to crash, it diconnects the autopilot so the driver is wholly liable 🤣

[DanglingPointer 29]

Hi All,
Does anyone know about the Tesla Model Y deliveries in Germany?

I ordered Model-Y on 18th June and it was showing a delivery date of Sep-30 to Nov-14.
I was out of Germany for August and until mid September. Hence I sold my model-3 thinking I have to wait a couple of weeks to get the car.

 

Now today, my account status got changed automatically and it shows new delivery dates of Jan-March 2023.

This is quite bad considering the news and articles all over the place saying, Tesla has ramped up production and deliveries have scaled up. Also, I believe, I loose BAFA bonus as well if it comes beyond 2022.

Did someone face a similar situation? What to do? I called Tesla and they said they dont know yet why the dates are changed. If it is is parts shortage or something else. They asked me to check into it later in few days, but right now they can't say anything.

 

BR
 

[mtbiking 1,894]

I’d say that even Tesla can’t completely escape the laws of economic gravity. Delivery times are chaotic across entire industries, and it pays off to have some redundancy.. JIT is not really a good strategy since at least 2020.

[CincyInDE 3,293]

last I heard they are still only producing Performance Model Y in Germany.  Delivery range varies depending on which variant you choose.