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Business compliance: gifts from suppliers

50 posts in this topic

1 minute ago, dj_jay_smith said:

 

Which I agree with in principal.

 

But if you are the head of a company and you have a choice, which would you do:

 

fire 100s or 1,000s of people and close down the company

or

pay some guys a few thousand (or much less in places like Angola).

 

Well, if you get caught the damage will cost even more nowadays.   You can ask Siemens and why they are nowadays really strict about this, it was painfully expensive everywhere they've got caught in the 90s and 00s.

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12 minutes ago, dj_jay_smith said:

 

Which I agree with in principal.

 

But if you are the head of a company and you have a choice, which would you do:

 

fire 100s or 1,000s of people and close down the company

or

pay some guys a few thousand (or much less in places like Angola).

 

Exactly, hence compliance laws. The pressure has to come from government and society. Companies aren't gonna do it by themselves.

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29 minutes ago, Krieg said:

 

Well, if you get caught the damage will cost even more nowadays.   You can ask Siemens and why they are nowadays really strict about this, it was painfully expensive everywhere they've got caught in the 90s and 00s.

IIRC, half of the board of directors and supervisory board landed in prison. Nigeria put Siemens on the black list for some years as if you can do business there w/o bribes.

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On 9/10/2019, 10:47:56, the.frollein said:

but only if you're not Megalomaniac Mike

 

yeah his proclamations sound a bit arrogant, but I've worked in a few companies with a couple of key employees whose departure would have resulted in complete disaster for the company.  It is very possible Mr Melga works in such a company and that he is actually one of those people.  I don't think there's any shame in being aware of that.

 

it's never wise for a company to rely too much on a few special employees for their existence, but especially when a company is small, they usually can't afford to duplicate resources or efforts to avoid knowledge/contribution silos.  Even in a larger org, this idea that every employee can be replaced at the drop of a hat is pretty naive.  Even if you can find someone with most of the applicable skills quickly (much easier said than done in tech, especially) so that you have someone's butt in the empty seat, the costs and loss of productivity during the on-boarding process is no joke, and you won't have a fully productive replacement for quite some time.  And that's if the replacement turns out to be truly fit for the job - best case scenario

 

There are loads of ways to calculate ordinary cost of employee turnover but the bottom line is that it's equally arrogant for an employer to view employees as 100% disposable. And that's just for normal employees.  Expand that several times over for some key employees and yes, sometimes an employee is just about impossible to part with without incurring tremendous or even catastrophic collateral damage.  It really can happen.

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1 hour ago, Krieg said:

 

Well, if you get caught the damage will cost even more nowadays.   You can ask Siemens and why they are nowadays really strict about this, it was painfully expensive everywhere they've got caught in the 90s and 00s.

I was working in Siemens when that all kicked off, it was quite a scandal at the time and it's the reason Compliance is such a big issue today. 

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On 9/11/2019, 9:29:13, theGman said:

 

It's the same as anything, two wrongs don't make a right. Don't do business in Angola. Report your competitors. If it has to stop, then it has to start somewhere.

Doesn´t work like that. The company that I was talking about (not mine!!) was tasked by another company from another european country. They had a worldwide range of operations, and the customer just told them to move operations to Angola.

They would lose this huge customer if they said no.

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22 hours ago, lisa13 said:

 

yeah his proclamations sound a bit arrogant, but I've worked in a few companies with a couple of key employees whose departure would have resulted in complete disaster for the company.  It is very possible Mr Melga works in such a company and that he is actually one of those people.  I don't think there's any shame in being aware of that.

Exactly! These 3 people, me included, are well identified from management as "key people". Perhaps there are others, I guess the list changes. It´s not an ego thing, I´ve worked in places where I was not a key person.  Right now it´s a comfortable position where your employment is more or less secured. At least until one of the other key people leaves.

 

22 hours ago, lisa13 said:

 

it's never wise for a company to rely too much on a few special employees for their existence, but especially when a company is small, they usually can't afford to duplicate resources or efforts to avoid knowledge/contribution silos.  Even in a larger org, this idea that every employee can be replaced at the drop of a hat is pretty naive.  Even if you can find someone with most of the applicable skills quickly (much easier said than done in tech, especially) so that you have someone's butt in the empty seat, the costs and loss of productivity during the on-boarding process is no joke, and you won't have a fully productive replacement for quite some time.  And that's if the replacement turns out to be truly fit for the job - best case scenario

Exactly! Problem here was that management cut on investment a few years ago and several people left. In the meantime I´ve accumulated 5.5 years of deep knowledge about our main product and all others on my team have been here for much shorter time.

Not an ego thing, it´s how things go when management is driven by accountants.

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1 hour ago, MikeMelga said:

Doesn´t work like that. The company that I was talking about (not mine!!) was tasked by another company from another european country. They had a worldwide range of operations, and the customer just told them to move operations to Angola.

They would lose this huge customer if they said no.

 

The point is though, that I (government, society, the world) don't care. It's only a problem for the companies involved. Bribes are bad, so bribes are illegal. End of. We need to stand up to it.

 

It's like all those massive companies not paying tax (Amazon, Starbucks etc). They threaten leaving the country and taking the jobs away with it. But we need to stand up to it.

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Im not a compliance office, but I am close to the process.  Generally the rules are simple, dont accept anything which might be considered a bribe and if you are placed into a difficult situation, report it to the compliance officer who will deal with it.

 

If you know there will be problems in the future (its the culture in X to bribe, what should I do?) then you state that to the compliance officer now up front.

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On 11. September 2019 um 02:28:09, catjones said:

All of the companies I work for as an employee and all the companies I worked with as a consultant had a zero tolerance for gifts of any kind.  None.  Zero.

Pharma? Nowadays, you can't accept a pen of 20 cents in that industry. In the past, GP's were invited to luxury conferences in the Caribbean: one day conference, four days holiday in 5-star hotel incl. golf resort. Please prescribe our medicine to your patients!

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