Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0

Private surveillance of community property areas

15 posts in this topic

A friend of mine has an issue, where a neighbor is dumping their food trash in plastic bags on the floor next to the trashcans instead of putting it into the trashcan. This happens in the daytime, where my friend is at work and he is therefore not able to confront the sinner.

 

 

The trashcans are located on the private property community area/ground, which my friend is “part-owner” of.

 

 

Is my friend allowed to setup a private surveillance Camera from his balcony [to catch the fish] or this this a privacy infringement?

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think a camera is legal in this situation.

 

Has he put a notice up at the trashcans? Is there a can for bio waste? Sounds like somebody just doesn't want to put their bio stuff in a regular container.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

is it possible the "offender" can't, physically, put the bags into the container?  they could be:  old, injured, disabled, short, a child, etc.

 

I have trouble lifting the lids on our garbage bins and the hinges rarely work to hold them open while I try to get the bag in.  I am very able bodied, but not tall, so I have very little leverage to open them, and then have to basically heave larger bags up into the bin while I'm holding it open.  I can do it, but it's not easy!  Usually I use small bags so heaving is not necessary, but if I hurt my shoulder or back, for example, I could not get the damned thing open to put any sized bags in, and yes, I would leave the bag next to the bin in this case.

 

Is the point of the spying to find out who is doing it?  or to catch them in the act so they can be "punished"?  If he knows who it is, he should just talk to them.  If he doesn't, maybe he could just consider there may be a "good" reason someone is doing this, and just get the hell over it.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, fraufruit said:

I don't think a camera is legal in this situation.

 

Has he put a notice up at the trashcans? Is there a can for bio waste? Sounds like somebody just doesn't want to put their bio stuff in a regular container.

Yes, there are four different trash-cans [for Plastic, Paper, Bio and “Restmüll”] and the space in them is not the issue.

3 hours ago, lisa13 said:

is it possible the "offender" can't, physically, put the bags into the container?  they could be:  old, injured, disabled, short, a child, etc.

 

I have trouble lifting the lids on our garbage bins and the hinges rarely work to hold them open while I try to get the bag in.  I am very able bodied, but not tall, so I have very little leverage to open them, and then have to basically heave larger bags up into the bin while I'm holding it open.  I can do it, but it's not easy!  Usually I use small bags so heaving is not necessary, but if I hurt my shoulder or back, for example, I could not get the damned thing open to put any sized bags in, and yes, I would leave the bag next to the bin in this case.

 

Is the point of the spying to find out who is doing it?  or to catch them in the act so they can be "punished"?  If he knows who it is, he should just talk to them.  If he doesn't, maybe he could just consider there may be a "good" reason someone is doing this, and just get the hell over it.

It could be that the person [or more] is not capable of lifting their own trash or don’t know that the trash belong in the trashcan or how to sort it, but the problem is that dumping trash like this will attract rats.

 

The purpose is to find out who and confront them with a “why?”

 

My friend has also contacted the Property manager company and asked them to send out a information letter for all the owners.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, teevee said:

My friend has also contacted the Property manager company and asked them to send out a information letter for all the owners.

 

the standard method is for the hausverwaltung to post a notice for all residents.  The perp is living there, and may or may not be an owner. 

 

I can tell you the owner of my flat would do fuck-all if he received a letter about a general problem in the house.  I'd never hear about it unless he had some specific, existing reason to suspect me.  Even then, doubtful.

 

I don't see how leaving a bag of trash on the floor is any more likely to attract rats than a big ole container full of trash is.

 

maybe you have special rat proof containers?  We in Munich most definitely don't. If there are rats in the vicinity to attract, the containers alone will do it.

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Your friend could also drop notices in all of the mail boxes. Keep it friendly.

 

BTW, "why" questions usually put the person in a defensive mode. "Is their some reason you can't access the bio bin?" might be a better question. 

 

Also, printing out easy instructions about what goes into each bin as well as what is prohibited may be helpful. I would have to learn all of that if I lived somewhere with a lot of different bins. We only have paper, bio and Restmüll.

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, fraufruit said:

Your friend could also drop notices in all of the mail boxes. Keep it friendly.

 

BTW, "why" questions usually put the person in a defensive mode. "Is their some reason you can't access the bio bin?" might be a better question. 

 

Also, printing out easy instructions about what goes into each bin as well as what is prohibited may be helpful. I would have to learn all of that if I lived somewhere with a lot of different bins. We only have paper, bio and Restmüll.

Leaving a friendly notice in the mailboxes is a good idea, maybe even better than the standard method with contacting the “Hausverwaltung”, which could result in that the information never ends at the renter. [due to the owner-filter]

 

Lets says that you make a friendly notice including easy instructions about how to handle trash. After a few weeks, you see that nothing has changed. 

 

What would you then do?
 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, lisa13 said:

I'd pick up the bag and put it in the bin.

 

Yep done this for years.  No sweat.

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, lisa13 said:

I'd pick up the bag and put it in the bin.

This is not problem-solving, but resignation.

 

 

So, the conclusion from the answers above is no, that a private person cannot setup a surveillance legally.

 

 

Let’s try to modify the main question as;

 

Is it legal to install a surveillance system on community property, if the other owners agree after voting? [From private -> community]

 

0

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

15 minutes ago, teevee said:

This is not problem-solving, but resignation.

 

what problem are you trying to solve?  Do you want the trash in the bin, or are you actually more interested in bringing the offender to "justice"?  seriously.  Let it freaking GOOOOO.  Thank your lucky stars this is the only "infraction" you encounter and get over it.  Or stay home and wait for the perp to appear then go harass them.

 

17 minutes ago, teevee said:

Is it legal to install a surveillance system on community property

 

NO it's not.  

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
39 minutes ago, teevee said:

This is not problem-solving, but resignation.

 

 

That is the pragmatic approach. Your questions seem like control mania. What does 'your friend' think he will achieve if he catches the 'perpetrator'? 

 

Not throwing trash in the bin is not a criminal offence - but illegal video surveillance or data storage can quickly become one. 

 

Quote

 

Let’s try to modify the main question as;

 

Is it legal to install a surveillance system on community property, 

 

 

Not the way you imagine it to be.

 

Not only do all owners have to agree, the surveillance must also be made recognisable for everyone (clearly visibly signs!), it must be clear and visible who is responsible for this measure and how the Federal Data Protection Act is complied with. The purposes of the surveillance must be determined beforehand and bindingly. If data collected by video surveillance can be assigned to a specific person, this person must be informed of any processing or use and all data that is not or no longer required for the purpose must be deleted immediately and verifiably.  

 

If your friend has no other hobbies, the first thing he should do is find a lawyer and get legal advice on how to carry out his surveillance offensive in a legally secure way without getting into real trouble. 


 

 

1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

for the cost of your surveillance and recording equipment (could be happening at night, so infrared required), legal fees, court costs, wages lost, witness protection relocation, reselling fees on ebay (resulting in a loss) you could easily hire one of the many jobless to stop by and pick up the trash...perhaps for as long as you live there.  "problem solved" and you're helping someone in need. 

 

is it friday yet?

2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0