taxation of own-generated solar electricity

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15 minutes ago, MikeMelga said:

Does he know how much he would save per month with an EV? That would be around 130€ for an EV charged at home! Working 10 months per year, the savings just on fuel would be 4500€!


yep. Or he could cut the costs by 1/3 by participating in our car sharing scheme and/or doing some home office.  I don’t understand them either.

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On 16.2.2022, 14:39:53, Adem137 said:

Our solar output reduced from 2020 complete year 9,072kWh to 7,383kWh in 2021. Is this normal? As we had a bad summer last year? Or could something be wrong with my solar panels. 

Can´t you monitor your system? The software that comes with my inverter shows production for each individual panel. That way you can pick up if a panel is malfunctioning. Maybe worth upgrading your system?

 

 

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On 4/30/2022, 9:13:15, MikeMelga said:

Does he know how much he would save per month with an EV? That would be around 130€ for an EV charged at home! Working 10 months per year, the savings just on fuel would be 4500€!

 

You never understood how lower-up and middle-lower classes financials work.  Not everyone has 50 or 60k under their bed, and some people who have it do not want to put it into a car. 

 

Next:  Hey Hartz4 guy, why don't you buy a house and install a heat pump so you can save in heating costs?

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43 minutes ago, Krieg said:

 

You never understood how lower-up and middle-lower classes financials work.  Not everyone has 50 or 60k under their bed, and some people who have it do not want to put it into a car.

If the guy saves 5000€ per year on fuel, taxes and maintenance, and he still doesn't buy a 45k€ EV, then perhaps that's why he will always be lower class. His monthly savings almost pay a 60 month loan with zero downpayment!

 

You're right, I don't understand it because I do math.

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1 minute ago, MikeMelga said:

If the guy saves 5000€ per year on fuel, taxes and maintenance, and he still doesn't buy a 45k€ EV, then perhaps that's why he will always be lower class.

You're right, I don't understand it because I do math.

 

It is funny, in housing you belong to the "Renting is better than buying", most people with that mindset can be split in two, the ones who believe the cost of opportunity of the money makes it better to rent, the other ones are the ones who think they can rent something better that the property they could afford to buy.   Both mindsets are totally understandable, ever by me, who belongs to the "Buying is better" group, and I enjoy living rent free, I am still open mind enough to think their reasons are valid.      I myself prefer to buy nice used cars in the 10k-20k bracket, why? because I believe it is financially better for me and I get to enjoy high end cars without having to pay 80k for them.   Of course, you know my finances better than me.

 

You belong to the group of people who think "If you do not decide the same I decide, you are wrong", which ironically is a very popular mindset among the Germans.

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Just now, Krieg said:

 

It is funny, in housing you belong to the "Renting is better than buying", most people with that mindset can be split in two, the ones who believe the cost of opportunity of the money makes it better to rent, the other ones are the ones who think they can rent something better that the property they could afford to buy.   Both mindsets are totally understandable, ever by me, who belongs to the "Buying is better" group, and I enjoy living rent free, I am still open mind enough to think their reasons are valid. 

No, I don't have a fixed mindset, it depends on situation. I think renting in Munich makes more sense than buying, but that logic doesn't apply in other places.

 

Just now, Krieg said:

    I myself prefer to buy nice used cars in the 10k-20k bracket, why? because I believe it is financially better for me and I get to enjoy high end cars without having to pay 80k for them.   Of course, you know my finances better than me.

Problem is, you can't buy a decent used EV for 10-20k. And even so, it's all about priorities, I give priority on having a premium car over owning a house.

 

Just now, Krieg said:

You belong to the group of people who think "If you do not decide the same I decide, you are wrong", which ironically is a very popular mindset among the Germans.

I am open for logical discussions, which includes doing the math.

 

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@Krieg

you have my sympathy and I think EV more often than not cost more than they make you save. 

BUT for a guy doing 170 km/day or 600 eur/month ...:mellow:

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Just now, MikeMelga said:

 

Problem is, you can't buy a decent used EV for 10-20k. And even so, it's all about priorities, I give priority on having a premium car over owning a house.

 

I am open for logical discussions, which includes doing the math.

 

 

Oh, Irony overdose. You make clear your decision is totally subjective.  And then literally in your next sentence you talk about logic.

 

 

1 minute ago, Gambatte said:

@Krieg

you have my sympathy and I think EV more often than not cost more than they make you save. 

BUT for a guy doing 170 km/day or 600 eur/month ...:mellow:

 

Sure, but life is what it is.  Do you know the guy's finances?  Do you know if he bought his ICE car new or used?  If he is jumping every 3 years from a used 10k car to the next one, the TOC will work totally different than buying a brand new car.   He might be an anti-EV guy, or a petrolhead.   Maybe the EV car he would need does not exist yet.    Maybe he gives priority to other things and put his money into those other things.  Maybe he does not trust yet the EV technology.  Maybe he thinks the productions of EVs is worse for the environment than the production of ICEs.  Maybe he decided to buy one but he is not willing to wait 18 months so he will wait until the market settles.  Maybe he buys German cars only and he does not think there is a German EV that is worth at the moment.  Maybe he buys only ONE German brand (pretty popular in Germany to be a BMW/MB/Audi fanboi).   Maybe towing is important for him and he thinks there is no good option yet for the type of car he likes.  And plenty of many other reasons.

 

I know you care more about he environment, and thinking only about that, yes, the guy would do better with an EV.  But things are not that simple.

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Krieg,

sure there are unknowns and maybe maybe EV is still the wrong choice from him.

 

Here what we do know:

*) this guys work commutes 170km/day, 600eur/month, out of Munich.

*) colleague of mtbiking, himself probably an educated well paid Munich based expat

 

What I extrapolate, maybe wrong but likely right

*) his earnings are not bad, in fact they are probably good

*) EV would be good for his finances

 

Disclaimer: I'm not a fun of EV, but that's more because I hate cars. From that I even created for myself a privileged position such that I can do almost everything, with very minimal car usage. From this, EV would be wrong for me.

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Following that logic all taxis, Uber cars, delivery vans, etc should be already EVs, but they are not.  Of course they will be in the future.

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7 hours ago, Krieg said:

 

Oh, Irony overdose. You make clear your decision is totally subjective.  And then literally in your next sentence you talk about logic.

I'ts not subjective. Premium cars usually are safer and more comfortable. My comfort metric is very simple: drive a car for 3h and have no back pain. Can't do that with most cheap cars. Get me a cheap car with high end suspension and high end safety scores and I'm fine. Logic, of course.

By the way, the Tesla despite having a harder suspension than my Mercedes (because of battery weight), is much more comfortable on long trips, as the suspension is better, seats are better and autopilot makes it simple.

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3 hours ago, MikeMelga said:

I'ts not subjective. Premium cars usually are safer and more comfortable. My comfort metric is very simple: drive a car for 3h and have no back pain. Can't do that with most cheap cars. Get me a cheap car with high end suspension and high end safety scores and I'm fine. Logic, of course.

By the way, the Tesla despite having a harder suspension than my Mercedes (because of battery weight), is much more comfortable on long trips, as the suspension is better, seats are better and autopilot makes it simple.

 

I have owned cars all through my life, I think, Mini, Golf, TR7, Toyota Supra 1, Golf GTI, Toyota Supra 2, Mitsubishi 3000GT, Yaris. I drove all of them on longer rides, Supra 1, Golf GT1, Supra 2 and the 3000GT all went to England and back 1600km each way, without stopping. Would always get out of the car, eat dinner with my mother and go out to the Pub, never had any back problems. Yeah  never had back problems riding my sports Motor bike either. Cannot comment on crash protection as I never had a serious crash, probable get one tomorrow :wub:

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I actually have back problems but still had no problems with 3-4 hr. drives in my old Honda Civic and later up to 7 hr. drives in my cheap Dacia.  I have however sat in cars where the seats were causing me problems.  I am thinking of some car a friend of mine had.  I think it was a Hyundai.  I also have problems with long flights.

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Sorry to hear that, as with MM  as well

 

Obviously so much in life is personal, I suppose I have had problems in other parts of my life that other people do not get

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I used to drive a crappy renault with 1 small cushion, that I could around every few minutes... I'm sure most people are not so affected as I am, but it's a (sensible) way to measure comfort.

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13 hours ago, yesterday said:

 

I have owned cars all through my life, I think, Mini, Golf, TR7, Toyota Supra 1, Golf GTI, Toyota Supra 2, Mitsubishi 3000GT, Yaris. I drove all of them on longer rides, Supra 1, Golf GT1, Supra 2 and the 3000GT all went to England and back 1600km each way, without stopping. Would always get out of the car, eat dinner with my mother and go out to the Pub, never had any back problems. Yeah  never had back problems riding my sports Motor bike either. Cannot comment on crash protection as I never had a serious crash, probable get one tomorrow :wub:

 

This a great history of cars, congrats.   I am right now considering a new daily driver and I am taking my time to decide and to test drive options, because it is probably going to be the last ICE car I buy.  I am leaning towards a Golf GTI, it must be something smallish but not too thirsty considering the gas prices.

 

This is another thing that might keep some people from going EV, the people who appreciate the fun of driving and the way sport-ish and/or powerful cars react.   EVs can be pretty fast, but I don't even know how to explain it, they are kind of boring.  I am not sure what the issue is, maybe because they are permanently in the power band.

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