Company employed with invalid permit and fired afterward

31 posts in this topic

Dear All,

To clarify, I was working in Germany when I got this job offer. I had Aufenthaltstitel tied to my present employer. I informed the HR's office about this and clearly said that I need to get a new one. The HR's office gave a very dubious answer (later digging in emails I discovered that they interpreted my Aufenthaltstitel as a blue card, WTF). Long story short, after starting a job it was discovered that I was employed illegally. I started a blue card application expected to the help from HR's office to make an urgent appointment at the Auslanderbehorde to get a Fiktionsbeschainigugng. But the HR's office strictly insisted not to be involved in any matters and asked to wait. Waiting lasted two months while the contract signed by two parties was illegal.

As someone mentioned before, it would be just one call of HR's office to ABH to explain a situation about urgent hiring and get an appointment.

cheers

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6 minutes ago, SpongeOver said:

 

I thought I cannot apply for a new visa without going back to South Africa.

 

The visa is necessary to enter Germany. You don't need to apply for a new visa. because you are already here. You would need to change your Aufenthaltstitel/residence and work permit. 

 

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55 minutes ago, SpongeOver said:

 

I thought I cannot apply for a new visa without going back to South Africa. I am restricted to my job and my position. And I cannot apply for an entry visa from Germany. I thought when the Aufenthaltstitel becomes invalid, that I no longer have a valid permit, and since I wouldn't have a valid visa to fall back on that I would need to leave.

 

Are you a specialty cook? There are only very few residence permits that cannot be extended here.

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I thought you had to apply for new permits from home country as well (unless you come from a special place like the US or Canada)

 

a large part of my reason for believing that was my Russian colleagues were all required to do that to get their residence permits.  They all had whatever kind of permit/visa they needed to come here to interview, but they still had to go back to get their work/residence permits from the German Mission closest to them in Russia.  It took months for some of them.

 

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1 minute ago, lisa13 said:

I thought you had to apply for new permits from home country as well (unless you come from a special place like the US or Canada)

 

a large part of my reason for believing that was my Russian colleagues were all required to do that to get their residence permits.  They all had whatever kind of permit/visa they needed to come here to interview, but they still had to go back to get their work/residence permits from the German Mission closest to them in Russia.  It took months for some of them.

 

 

You are confusing temporary visit visas and residence permits. Your colleagues who came to Germany on a temporary C visa, needed to return to Russia to apply and receive a long-term D visa that makes it possible for them to apply for a residence permit in Germany.

 

Foreigners who are already resident in Germany (and hold a German residence permit) are allowed to apply to work for another employer within Germany (certain exceptions apply).

 

For future reference, if your company is seriously interested in hiring a foreigner who needs a visa, they can also tell them to apply for a job seekers visa when coming for an interview. This special permit makes if possible for qualified workers to change to a residence permit without having to go back home first.

 

 

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as always, thank you for the clarification @engelchen

 

is the job seekers visa associated with the bluecard?  That's the only context in which I've ever heard of it, but since I'm clearly not so knowledgeable I'm asking :)

 

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14 hours ago, engelchen said:

 

Are you a specialty cook? There are only very few residence permits that cannot be extended here.

 

For a moment I thought "Are you a specialty cook" was an insult :D:D

Thank you for taking the time and correcting me. I am sure this information will help others who falsely believe the same thing.

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15 hours ago, The long wolf said:

Dear All,

To clarify, I was working in Germany when I got this job offer. I had Aufenthaltstitel tied to my present employer. I informed the HR's office about this and clearly said that I need to get a new one. The HR's office gave a very dubious answer (later digging in emails I discovered that they interpreted my Aufenthaltstitel as a blue card, WTF). Long story short, after starting a job it was discovered that I was employed illegally. I started a blue card application expected to the help from HR's office to make an urgent appointment at the Auslanderbehorde to get a Fiktionsbeschainigugng. But the HR's office strictly insisted not to be involved in any matters and asked to wait. Waiting lasted two months while the contract signed by two parties was illegal.

As someone mentioned before, it would be just one call of HR's office to ABH to explain a situation about urgent hiring and get an appointment.

cheers

 

 

OK, now I get it.   But still, why was the Blue Card a must? You can work without a Blue Card.   AFAIK in your situation you only had to go to the AB and apply to change employer.   

 

 

14 hours ago, engelchen said:

For future reference, if your company is seriously interested in hiring a foreigner who needs a visa, they can also tell them to apply for a job seekers visa when coming for an interview. This special permit makes if possible for qualified workers to change to a residence permit without having to go back home first.

 

 

 

AFAIK this would be only for citizen of privileged countries (USA, Australia, etc).   Someone coming from a developing country has to go back home and apply for a permit there.  

 

Of course, except when they were already working here and they are just changing jobs, that can be done here.  

 

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On 4/16/2019, 5:58:29, lisa13 said:

as always, thank you for the clarification @engelchen

 

is the job seekers visa associated with the bluecard?  That's the only context in which I've ever heard of it, but since I'm clearly not so knowledgeable I'm asking :)

 

 

It was created at the same time as the Blue Card, and has similar requirements except one doesn't need to have a job offer (but, on the other hand, one needs to demonstrate having enough funds). The use case is someone who first relocates, looks for work for up to 6 months, then receives a BC.

 

It is relatively rarely used as most people who relocate prefer to look for job from their old place of residence and it's trivial to get and use the short-term stay visa in comparison.

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On 4/17/2019, 8:26:41, Krieg said:

 

 

OK, now I get it.   But still, why was the Blue Card a must? You can work without a Blue Card.   AFAIK in your situation you only had to go to the AB and apply to change employer.   

 

 

 

AFAIK this would be only for citizen of privileged countries (USA, Australia, etc).   Someone coming from a developing country has to go back home and apply for a permit there.  

 

Of course, except when they were already working here and they are just changing jobs, that can be done here.  

 

 

This is incorrect, the job seekers visa is exactly the visa for people from non-privileged countries. It is the long-term visa given for 6 months that allows the holder to officially move to Germany. After that it will not be necessary to return to the home country.

 

Whereas USA, Australia, etc. simply don't need any visa.

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On 4/16/2019, 4:42:32, SpongeOver said:

 

I thought I cannot apply for a new visa without going back to South Africa. I am restricted to my job and my position. And I cannot apply for an entry visa from Germany. I thought when the Aufenthaltstitel becomes invalid, that I no longer have a valid permit, and since I wouldn't have a valid visa to fall back on that I would need to leave.

 

If this is not true, then sorry about wrong information. If what I was thinking is wrong, then that's a bit of a relief. I like backup plans and right now there is no backup plan if the current job doesn't pan out.

 

The general rues are quite simple. You apply for the thing that allows you to live in Germany at the place where you currently live.

 

If you live in SA, you apply to the Germany consulate. This doesn't change if you have a short-term Schengen visa or long-term German visa which you haven't used yet.

 

Once you moved to Germany and did the Anmeldung, you officially live there and go to the local ABH for all immigration issues.

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