Quitting Job on the first day? What would be my last day?

[Anirude 12]

 

I wish to cancel my new work agreement that I already signed in wake of another offer.

 

On 01.02.2019 (First day at the job)

 

Notice of termination: one month to the end of the month (during the probationary period)

 

Which day is my last day?

 

28.02.2019 or 31.03.2019?

 

It can also be that they could consent to letting me go without needing to enter work contract at all upon requesting.(As in work contract it says ''Quitting before the first day is excluded''

 

But just in case they wont allow? Then what joining date should I commit to the new company?

[alderhill 242]

Have you signed at the new place? Are you 100% sure that job and all paperwork will go ahead? Get a contract with start date signed ASAP.

 

Your last day is moot because you will not have a first day. No one can force you to work or show up. What are they going to do, kidnap you and chain you in the office kitchenette and make you scrub dishes? It's your reputation on the line, so do what protects that best.

 

Frankly, I'd tell the first workplace as quickly as possible. I'd send a short polite letter mit Einschreibung to inform them of your change of plans, thanking them for their time, etc. They will be a little annoyed I'm sure, but this sort of stuff happens often enough. The sooner you tell them, the sooner they can plan their next move. Waiting till the first day to say "juuuuust kidding, I actually have another job somewhere else, bye" will impress no one and is quite unprofessional.

[jeba 2,027]

6 hours ago, alderhill said:

What are they going to do, kidnap you and chain you in the office kitchenette and make you scrub dishes?

Sue him for damage compensation?

[Anirude 12]

1 hour ago, jeba said:

Sue him for damage compensation?

 

If they consent to let me go. Then question doesn't arise.

 

If they do not, then in that case what would be the last day of my work there? Coz the new company wants to know what joining dat they whould write on the contract. 

[Anirude 12]

8 hours ago, alderhill said:

Have you signed at the new place? Are you 100% sure that job and all paperwork will go ahead? Get a contract with start date signed ASAP.

 

Your last day is moot because you will not have a first day. No one can force you to work or show up. What are they going to do, kidnap you and chain you in the office kitchenette and make you scrub dishes? It's your reputation on the line, so do what protects that best.

 

Frankly, I'd tell the first workplace as quickly as possible. I'd send a short polite letter mit Einschreibung to inform them of your change of plans, thanking them for their time, etc. They will be a little annoyed I'm sure, but this sort of stuff happens often enough. The sooner you tell them, the sooner they can plan their next move. Waiting till the first day to say "juuuuust kidding, I actually have another job somewhere else, bye" will impress no one and is quite unprofessional.

 

Yes the paperwork with the new company is going ahead. They are asking about the joining date that I can commit on, and thats the question here?

 

I would talk to the old company and see how they react, obviously they would be pissed but I would like to inform them in advance so that they have time to find someone else but the question is in worst case what should be my last day of work? and new joining date accordingly? 

[alderhill 242]

4 hours ago, jeba said:

Sue him for damage compensation?

Not if he informs them now. Are they really going to pursue punitive legal action against someone who pulls out of a job because they found something else? We don't know which company, but it's still hard to believe.

 

2 hours ago, Anirude said:

I would talk to the old company and see how they react, obviously they would be pissed but I would like to inform them in advance so that they have time to find someone else but the question is in worst case what should be my last day of work? and new joining date accordingly? 

 

The new job's joining date is as soon as you can reasonably start work. Only you know.

 

Again, the last date at the first job won't exist, even as a worse case scenario, because will not to go there for one single day. Why on Earth would you? They will appreciate not wasting any more time with needless paperwork BEFOREHAND, right now. Again, just send a short polite letter with registered mail ASAP, as proven receipt of your letter. You can also call them as a courtesy, but anything by phone or email is legally not official (only fax or snail-mail). Just tell them you found something else, it's as easy as that. This happens all the time.

[jeba 2,027]

7 hours ago, Anirude said:

If they do not, then in that case what would be the last day of my work there? Coz the new company wants to know what joining dat they whould write on the contract. 

My uneducated guess is that in that case you could only give notice at the beginning of January because of:

 

17 hours ago, Anirude said:

''Quitting before the first day is excluded''

effective end of Febraury so that you´d be available to the new company on 1 March.

I´d try to negotiate with the new company that your entry date will depend on the "old" company´s reaction.

[alderhill 242]

Seriously, what sort of company is this? Did you sign up for a troop of mercenaries or a gang of smugglers or what? What kind of contract did you sign?

 

It sounds like they have a problem with people jumping ship if they have to specifically include a bogus point in a contract. Red flag. I'd get as far away as possible as quick as possible. 

[zwiebelfisch 6,252]

3 minutes ago, alderhill said:

It sounds like they have a problem with people jumping ship if they have to specifically include a bogus point in a contract. Red flag. I'd get as far away as possible as quick as possible. 

 

I know of companies that have had problems with people signing contracts without intending to start. I'm told (by indians) that this is a common practice in India for example, though I can't say how common it really is.  

This causes problems (buying hardware, turning down other applicants etc), so some have attempted to prevent it with clauses along these lines.

My gut feeling is that the company is wasting it's time. There is little point forcing someone to work for a month or so, their on boarding is likely to be longer than that and in the end it's just more wasted money.

[Anirude 12]

11 hours ago, zwiebelfisch said:

 

I know of companies that have had problems with people signing contracts without intending to start. I'm told (by indians) that this is a common practice in India for example, though I can't say how common it really is.  

This causes problems (buying hardware, turning down other applicants etc), so some have attempted to prevent it with clauses along these lines.

My gut feeling is that the company is wasting it's time. There is little point forcing someone to work for a month or so, their on boarding is likely to be longer than that and in the end it's just more wasted money.

 

Don't get your head stuck in Nationalities. It happens all over the world where job market is dynamic. And this question relates in general to Germany. They don't chalk out contracts or their laws based on what may or may not happen in India, though this assumption is way too funny for me.

[Anirude 12]

12 hours ago, alderhill said:

Seriously, what sort of company is this? Did you sign up for a troop of mercenaries or a gang of smugglers or what? What kind of contract did you sign?

 

It sounds like they have a problem with people jumping ship if they have to specifically include a bogus point in a contract. Red flag. I'd get as far away as possible as quick as possible. 

 

Which bogus point are you referring to? 

 

Well maybe it is, though let me tell you a little inside story to this. This first company actually sold a fixed + variable salary(Erfolgsbeteiligung der Firma) during the negotiation phase and didn't mention even the provision of the variable salary in the contract upon my requests(I actually apotted that a bit late), so that was a dummy sold, I had no other option at the time and has already quit my current company so had to sign the offer, but it left me in bad taste and thankfully this new company approached me then which ended up in actually an even better offer. 

 

 

 

[alderhill 242]

2 hours ago, Anirude said:

Which bogus point are you referring to? 

 

Stating that you can't pull out of a job before even starting it. As if! I understand where they're coming from, it's annoying when new hires change their minds mid-way into the process. But that's life, and an absurd and practically un-enforceable point to include on a contract. A scare tactic and nothing more. This is really not standard in Germany.

 

Is this company in some way connected with India? Is the owner an Indian? Do many Indians work there? As @zwiebelfisch alludes to, I suspect there is a cross-cultural element to this. 

 

2 hours ago, Anirude said:

Well maybe it is, though let me tell you a little inside story to this. This first company actually sold a fixed + variable salary (Erfolgsbeteiligung der Firma) during the negotiation phase and didn't mention even the provision of the variable salary in the contract upon my requests(I actually apotted that a bit late), so that was a dummy sold, I had no other option at the time and has already quit my current company so had to sign the offer, but it left me in bad taste and thankfully this new company approached me then which ended up in actually an even better offer. 

 

As the saying goes, beggars can't be choosers. But whatever this company is, it has warning bells all over it. It's in everyone's interest if you inform the old job ASAP that you found something else that fits you better, end of story. If they want to waste time and resources chasing a non-employee, it's really not your problem anymore. 

[Anirude 12]

2 hours ago, alderhill said:

 

Stating that you can't pull out of a job before even starting it. As if! I understand where they're coming from, it's annoying when new hires change their minds mid-way into the process. But that's life, and an absurd and practically un-enforceable point to include on a contract. A scare tactic and nothing more. This is really not standard in Germany.

 

Is this company in some way connected with India? Is the owner an Indian? Do many Indians work there? As @zwiebelfisch alludes to, I suspect there is a cross-cultural element to this. 

 

 

As the saying goes, beggars can't be choosers. But whatever this company is, it has warning bells all over it. It's in everyone's interest if you inform the old job ASAP that you found something else that fits you better, end of story. If they want to waste time and resources chasing a non-employee, it's really not your problem anymore. 

 

There is no connection to india whatsoever. They are 100% german spekaing company. The only thing they know that has the word india is 'Indian Ocean' probably. 

 

 

[someonesdaughter 2,862]

2 hours ago, alderhill said:

 But that's life, and an absurd and practically un-enforceable point to include on a contract. 

 

I suggest you get smart before you make such BS claims.

 

"Jedoch kann hingegen das Recht zur ordentlichen Kündigung vertraglich beschränkt bzw. ausgeschlossen werden. So kann vertraglich vereinbart werden, dass die ordentliche Kündigung vor Dienstantritt ausgeschlossen wird. Dies wurde durch das Bundesarbeitsgericht, 2 AZR 324/03, bereits entschieden."

 

https://www.anwalt.de/rechtstipps/die-kuendigung-vor-arbeitsantritt-wirksam-oder-nicht_082667.html

 

and

 

"Ein Blick in den Arbeitsvertrag ist auch deshalb ratsam, weil er eventuell eine Vertragsstrafe bei Nichtaufnahme der Arbeit beinhaltet. Vertragsstrafen bis zur Höhe eines Bruttomonatsgehalts gelten dabei regelmäßig als zulässig."
 

https://karrierebibel.de/kuendigung-vor-arbeitsantritt/#Vorzeitige-Kuendigung-laesst-sich-ausschliessen

 

@anyrude: Check your contract to see if a contractual penalty is due if you cancel it before starting the job. 

 

 

[Anirude 12]

1 hour ago, someonesdaughter said:

@anyrude: Check your contract to see if a contractual penalty is due if you cancel it before starting the job. 

 

 

 

Thats actually a good point. I will throughly check it again. I skimmed through once, couldn't really find anything with 'Strafe' or 'Bußgeld'.

 

Though 2 points worth noting. 

 

1. Kündigung vorm Arbeitsbeginn ist ausgeschlossen. 

 

2. In der Probezeit könnte den Vertrag von den beiden Partein ohne Grunde mit einem Kündigungsfrist von ''Einem Monat bis zum Monatsende'' gekündigt werden.

[someonesdaughter 2,862]

1 minute ago, Anirude said:

 

Thats actually a good point. I will throughly check it again. I skimmed through once, couldn't really find anything with 'Strafe' or 'Bußgeld'

 

Look for the word 'Vertragsstrafe' [contractual penalty, not fine (Bußgeld) or penalty (Strafe)].

[Anirude 12]

7 minutes ago, someonesdaughter said:

 

Look for the word 'Vertragsstrafe' [contractual penalty, not fine (Bußgeld) or penalty (Strafe)].

 

  You probably are not aware of a case-insensitive substring search ;)

[Anirude 12]

So as an update, all clarified with the company I signed up with, they agree on cancelling the contract and issuing Aufhebungsvertrag. I am glad it worked out. :)

[dstanners 543]

Glad it worked out. Good luck in the new job.