Landlord asking for back payment of rent due to his calculation mistake

[jeba 2,621]

12 minutes ago, swimmer said:

Not sure accusing you of not paying your rent is actually that "nice", myself. 

But pointing out that he made a mistake as a consequence of which you owe him but he out of the kindness of his heart allowes you to pay incrementally sure is nice. Where is he accusing the OP of anything?

[CustomX 96]

I love how these threads bring out the agression in some folks. And the fairytale manufacturers. He didn't "accuse" us of anything. Where on earth does that come from? 

 

Yes - I could pore over  the Nebenkosten bills if I want to, and have the time and stomach for it. He's offered to send them. Don't think I can be bothered. The total cost per month after we pay back the owed amount, works out to be within 15-20 EUR of the quoted warm rental amount per month. Ie. it passes the smell test. Its just suboptimal to have a 2000 EUR debt come out of nowhere. First world problems. 

[msam 502]

1 hour ago, CustomX said:

 

As I said above, the exact source of the miscalculation is of little consequence to us. Nebenkosten, parking spots, whatever. The upshot is that we've paid less than agreed in the contract, we owe him money and its just not optimal to be presented with a 2000 EUR bill. We likely just have to suck it up. Thanks for the input, all. 

 

Except that the source is (Almost) important.

 

If you haven't been paying for the garage, the landlord has 3 years time to ask for them

If you haven't been paying nebenkosten he normally has less time as said by swimmer

 

1 hour ago, swimmer said:

Anything to end 2016 is now dead usually as only he has till 31.12.2017 to bill you.   The 2017 may still to be settled (but none of us here really know that for sure as we do not know full situ) but that's all.  He still has to provide details of charges etc.

 

 

And obviously: contact the mieterverein

 

edit: removed incorrect information, had a different case in mind (in some cases the landlord can make corrections after the one year)

[swimmer 3,700]

32 minutes ago, CustomX said:

.He didn't "accuse" us of anything. Where on earth does that come from? 

 

 

You said he told you that you have two years of outstanding rent.  That's what he's saying.   He said you breached your contract.   Potentially, that's opening up legal action against you or such.  Personally, I would firmly rebut that - in writing, asap, at the first suggestion.  It's in my interest.  But then I've been an auditor for decades so of course I would - no messing when it comes to law and my cash and reputation .  (The NC is a different thing).

 

If it's no big deal and that is cool, and you have no time to worry about bills, or to bother analysing your costs and managing the money it probably took effort to earn, then that is fair enough.  No sweat.  Nobody here cares.

 

But it does confuse people if then you get all huffy and uncool and stressed about...being asked to pay your bills.

 

If it's no big deal and you can't be bothered, then why even ask?  Just forget it.   See what happens next.

 

You are of course right to say 2k is a significant sum.  Your landlord probably thinks the same.

[Sir Percy B 1,209]

1 hour ago, CustomX said:

I love how these threads bring out the agression in some folks. And the fairytale manufacturers. He didn't "accuse" us of anything. Where on earth does that come from? 

 

Yes - I could pore over  the Nebenkosten bills if I want to, and have the time and stomach for it. He's offered to send them. Don't think I can be bothered. The total cost per month after we pay back the owed amount, works out to be within 15-20 EUR of the quoted warm rental amount per month. Ie. it passes the smell test. Its just suboptimal to have a 2000 EUR debt come out of nowhere. First world problems. 

 

Be fair you're both to blame, you for one in not managing your own financial responsibilities in sorting out your rental obligation and the landlord for not making the correct calculations.

Had you kept on top of your affairs you would of noticed by your own examples, a lot sooner than 24 months down the line, that you were paying to little.

 

Personally, I don't think the Mietverein would do anything here as I don't think you have anything to dispute.

By your own admission, you either don't have the stomach or are just to lazy to bother and left it in the hands of the landlord, said landlord has since recognised his/her mistake and you now want to know what legal recourse you have.

 

Fuck me, given the amount of threads about unscrupulous landlords on this forum I think you're pretty lucky.

 

My advice, there's no need to suck it up just pay what you owe, manage yourself, learn and move on and I'm sure the world would be a happier place.

[CustomX 96]

As always, Toytown delivers entertainment in spades. Thanks for the feedback, all. Always interesting to see different peoples' interpretations, extrapolations and conjurings from a given set of facts.  Interesting to see the quickness to aportion blame to either me or the landlord. The landlord has been extremely nice and apologetic about it  and I never had any intention of  doing him out of money owed. I was merely interested to know where I stood from a legal perspective. Quite funny to see an uptight auditor telling me that I'm getting "huffy, uncool and stressed" because I asked for feedback.  Schönes Wochenende All!  

[BayrischDude 1,983]

22 hours ago, CustomX said:

Landlord has contacted us saying that he's mistakenly forgotten to charge us the agreed parking spot sum for the last 24 months and that we therefore owe him almost 2000 EUR. He wants to add it onto our monthly payments, so that we effectively pay it in installments.

 

8 hours ago, CustomX said:

 

He's not claiming that the backpayment is for the parking spot.  He's simply said that he made a mistake in the calculation.

 

8 hours ago, CustomX said:

 

As I said above, the exact source of the miscalculation is of little consequence to us. Nebenkosten, parking spots, whatever.

 

7 hours ago, CustomX said:

Yes - I could pore over  the Nebenkosten bills if I want to, and have the time and stomach for it. He's offered to send them. Don't think I can be bothered.

Your posts I find to have been very entertaining and interesting.  To say the least. 

[swimmer 3,700]

Well, interestingly, I too am dealing with a property request for about 2k today, albeit as an owner .    I suppose the harsh truth is that - short of living off mum and dad forever - we do have to deal with this life stuff from time to time.  The question is whether to invest the time up front or wait until it is needed.   Either (or other) is OK.  I certainly had better things planned for today but this is a priority.  

 

I did have to take time to wade through the papers.   Then I decided "I can live with A, B, C but not convinced about D, E..."  and so then wrote an email saying "not convinced about D,E so please tell me more, not sure I can currently agree that..." or similar.   Perfectly OK to do that.   In my view, better to document that but, again, only my opinion.

 

Yes, my counterparts are great too .   But it is still a business transaction and if I do not pay what I should, they will take me through debtor process for sure.  Nice has its limits.   Business is business.   I am perfectly nice in my work, but I will still go through contract and money collection process when I have to.  Just my job.

 

The other thing I found helped today is a contingency pot.  Of course the prospect of paying 2k is not great but then I got reminded "that's what our contingency is for".  True - then it felt better.  It's actually household budget not yet spent.

 

If we can't be bothered with own money, nobody else probably will care.  Just good self care.

[CustomX 96]

2 hours ago, BayrischDude said:

 

 

 

Your posts I find to have been very entertaining and interesting.  To say the least. 

 

If there's one thing I've learned in 20ish years posting on forums, its that every forum has a number of pedants who will play word games and semantics and refuse to see the wood for the trees. Keep at it, Champ. 

[CustomX 96]

2 hours ago, swimmer said:

Well, interestingly, I too am dealing with a property request for about 2k today, albeit as an owner .    I suppose the harsh truth is that - short of living off mum and dad forever - we do have to deal with this life stuff from time to time.  The question is whether to invest the time up front or wait until it is needed.   Either (or other) is OK.  I certainly had better things planned for today but this is a priority.  

 

I did have to take time to wade through the papers.   Then I decided "I can live with A, B, C but not convinced about D, E..."  and so then wrote an email saying "not convinced about D,E so please tell me more, not sure I can currently agree that..." or similar.   Perfectly OK to do that.   In my view, better to document that but, again, only my opinion.

 

Yes, my counterparts are great too .   But it is still a business transaction and if I do not pay what I should, they will take me through debtor process for sure.  Nice has its limits.   Business is business.   I am perfectly nice in my work, but I will still go through contract and money collection process when I have to.  Just my job.

 

The other thing I found helped today is a contingency pot.  Of course the prospect of paying 2k is not great but then I got reminded "that's what our contingency is for".  True - then it felt better.  It's actually household budget not yet spent.

 

If we can't be bothered with own money, nobody else probably will care.  Just good self care.

 

I'm pretty damn good with money and figures. Not many bills get paid without scrutiny aside from the regular ones for consistent amounts. I chase my debtors like any business person does. Were the net affect of this situation, us being asked to pay significantly more than our originally quoted/agreed  warm rental rate, I'd be kicking up a fuss. Considering the net effect has us within 13 EUR of the original monthly sum, the difference is immaterial and also passes the smell test (as I said earlier) and thus I've made the decision that my own time is not worth the hassle of battling through Deutsch utility bills for the past 2.5 years.   

[optimista 3,818]

On 07/12/2018, 10:13:37, CustomX said:

I could pore over  the Nebenkosten bills if I want to, and have the time and stomach for it. He's offered to send them. Don't think I can be bothered.

 

This is the problem. It could cost you 2K. Your decision. Hate to say it but conmen always come across as very nice people. That's their trade. I smell a bit of a rat. He was in clover for quite some time as you had first overpaid the Nebenkosten... then tried to iron it out by charging you less... (what a nice man he is) and now comes along with an "oversight"... hmm... confusing? Of course...

 

If he really is that genuine nice guy, he has still proven he cannot do the maths, even though it is so important. Give the guy one chance but not two. He has messed up once, now you sit down and do the checking. Wearisome though this will be, if you ever get the paperwork (first little test of his integrity, see if he really sends you the stuff), in your shoes I'd be interested to know if the guy is kosher or not if you intend to continue renting from him.

 

Sorry to be so cynical, but life's experience...

[MikeMelga 4,815]

On 12/7/2018, 9:36:57, theGman said:

The LL hasn't put parking into the nebenkosten. OP said so:

 

"Original quoted monthly rent = 1020 + parking 80 + nebenkosten 100 = total of 1200 EUR to be paid monthly."

 

This was a pure fuck up. From both sides to be honest. The cold rent is  1100 (1020 + 80). But, due to said fuck up, they were asked to pay a warm rent of 1025 for 2 years (OK, a little bit more for the second year).

 

So they were paying warm rent that was actually even lower than the cold rent. How that goes on for 2 years I dunno, but in my opinion, as sucky as it is, 1100 is what is in the contract and they have been underpaying for 2 years. So now it's time to catch up.

Gman nailed it. Fuck up from both sides, don't see ground for you to complain.