Vacation for school aged kids, outside of vacation times

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I am just wondering if anyone has gotten around the school system, in respect to taking vacations when school vacation is. I know that school is mandatory as long as you are living in German, but what about if I moved to the U.S. for a month and "abmelded" my family from Germany and then "anmelded" us when we came back. We have always traveled a lot, but this really puts a kink in the traveling. The first born is now in 1st grade and is in a private school. I dont know if the school would accept this even if it was legal to do, just trying to get some out of the box responses. Not only do I like the freedom of choosing when to travel, I just saw the flight cost in spring vs summer, I could travel there a couple time for price difference.

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I'm not knowledgeable on this topic, but I do know a German family that took their daughter out of school for 2 weeks and then had 2 weeks of vacation, so they could go the Asia for a long vacation. They were able to get special permission from the school director since their daughter was doing very well in school. I suppose you should just ask the school your child attends.

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6 hours ago, kspeedy28 said:

. Not only do I like the freedom of choosing when to travel, I just saw the flight cost in spring vs summer, I could travel there a couple time for price difference.

 

I am sure teachers and lecturers would also like the freedom, but they do not have it, for the simple reason that they are employed to teach!!!

Germany has Schulpflicht and it is to be taken seriously - even to the extent of having extra police checks at airports last summer just before the holidays!

I would suggest having a word with the school director, and checking out if the school maybe has an "inofficial" way of dealing with parents wanting to travel.

In the meantime, feel free to use the services of Easyjet and Ryanair on the weekends and do some sightseeing!!!

 

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49 minutes ago, robinson100 said:

I am sure teachers and lecturers would also like the freedom, but they do not have it, for the simple reason that they are employed to teach!!!

Exactly.
 

Quote

Germany has Schulpflicht and it is to be taken seriously

 

This is not a joke.

 

When our son was at Gymnasium we applied in writing on two separate occasions to the school director to take him out of school for either 1 or 2 days (not weeks) to travel to UK with us to visit my mother & attend a concert.  The school director consulted with his class teacher & responded in the affirmative.

Attending the concert inspired our son to learn to play the accoustic guitar.

 

 

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8 hours ago, kspeedy28 said:

I just saw the flight cost in spring vs summer, I could travel there a couple time for price difference.

 

Flight prices to the U.S. seem to change almost weekly when I start looking 3 months or more in advance. Better deals come along especially if you can be flexible with your dates and it also depends when you are looking. 

 

BTW, you don't need to abmelden when you leave for 4 weeks. You are not moving, just going for a visit. I do this every year.

 

I believe most parents would love to travel outside of the usual holidays. That's just something one has to give up when one has school age children.

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20 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

BTW, you don't need to abmelden when you leave for 4 weeks.

But you can get around Schulpflicht, which I think is what the OP wants to do. It would probably work but whether it´s a good idea is another question (missing out on a few weeks of schooling might not help them feel comfortable after their return as they will have knowledge gaps).

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I am fully aware of the Schulpflicht and how serious it is (kids have been taken from their parents because of this and I am fully against it), that was the reason for the question. I suppose it should have prefaced it with more information. My children and I are dual citizens with Germany and the U.S., so I guess the question is, does Germany have jurisdiction over my kids or the US? That was the reason I would abmeld us, because at that point the way I see it Germany has no jurisdiction over us, that we are then US citizens once again.

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36 minutes ago, kspeedy28 said:

My children and I are dual citizens with Germany and the U.S.

 

36 minutes ago, kspeedy28 said:

the way I see it Germany has no jurisdiction over us, that we are then US citizens once again.

 

Interesting.

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2 hours ago, kspeedy28 said:

That was the reason I would abmeld us, because at that point the way I see it Germany has no jurisdiction over us, that we are then US citizens once again.

LOL. I'm sure the German authorities will love being told that they have no jurisdiction over you or your family, although you're German citizens.

 

I think the key point here is that your kid is enrolled in a German school, whether or not you're currently registered as living in Germany. As such, it will be up to the school as the primary instance to enforce Schulpflicht. You don't say where you're living, but here in Berlin, an absence of 4 weeks would have to be approved by the school board. The same applies to any absence directly before or after school vacations. We got special dispensation to fly to California two days before fall vacation started a couple of years ago, because my mother was celebrating a big birthday on the first Saturday of the vacation and we had to leave early to make it to the party on time.

 

There was also an Australian family at our son's school that got extended leave from school because the father had a 6-month assignment in Southeast Asia and the family wanted to join him for the last two months. So it's certainly possible, but you'll need to think of a better reason than "the flights are cheaper when school's in session".

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57 minutes ago, El Jeffo said:

LOL. I'm sure the German authorities will love being told that they have no jurisdiction over you or your family, although you're German citizens.

 

I'm still waiting for the "home school in Germany" trope and argument. ;)

 

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2 hours ago, kspeedy28 said:

My children and I are dual citizens with Germany and the U.S., so I guess the question is, does Germany have jurisdiction over my kids or the US?

 

you make me see the beauty of Germany's stance that normally disallows dual citizenship.

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49 minutes ago, El Jeffo said:

LOL. I'm sure the German authorities will love being told that they have no jurisdiction over you or your family, although you're German citizens.

I'm evidently not being clear. There is a point where the German authorities jurisdiction stops as myself and my children are not Only German citizens, but they are also US citizens and as an extreme example, if I am living in the united states and the kids are home schooled Germany cannot say it is illegal. I am trying to find the exact position of that legal boarder between when are they us citizen or German. I said I am looking for an out of the box idea solution, not a bunch of nay saying. I could get those answers from the normal lines of communication. I thought this forum would be a bit more open to such communication.

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38 minutes ago, kspeedy28 said:

 if I am living in the united states and the kids are home schooled Germany cannot say it is illegal.

 

Why would Germany even care?    You will have left, moved to another country.   If I moved back to my "home" nation, I'd expect to get on with my life there without Germany sticking their nose in, never mind judging what I do.    And, equally, since I moved here, I have certainly not had my home nation coming to me and commenting on how I live in Germany.  (Although one national decision made in 2016 has had a large impact on all of us :angry:).

 

You might be doing that thing of assuming other parties are more interested in you than they actually are.   Thus making it harder than it is.    

 

Just get on with moving back the the US if it is what you want.   It's a nice idea but none of us who leave will find a weeping German authority on its knees, begging us to stay :ph34r:.     People come and go all the time.   Bear in mind that you will have a lot to do after deregistering here and no longer being a German resident.     The kids' schoolplaces here will be given up because obviously non-residents can't reserve them (and probably swiftly taken up by others).  You will need to set up local US healthcare policies that cover your kids.  The Kindergeld will stop.    As one starting the process of repatriating (not to US), I'd see the change in those as my big issues.   Saving a few $$$ is neither here or a bit of travel is much less valuable, and much less important to the stability of my family's lives.  

 

In 2018, I would not also under-estimate the costs and barriers from giving up a secure foothold in, and trying to re-enter, a decent German locale at some point in the future.   

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I'm wondering if parents can pull their kids out of U.S. schools for one month vacations. Perhaps if it would be for something seriously educational, I suppose. Not sure.

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12 hours ago, kspeedy28 said:

I know that school is mandatory as long as you are living in German, but what about if I moved to the U.S. for a month and "abmelded" my family from Germany and then "anmelded" us when we came back. 

When you and your partner are on vavation you still get paid by your employer, right? What about the tax implications that you aren't registered in Germany but still get a payment by a German employer into your German bank account?

 

This and the fact that the teachers will smell a rat is going to back fire in your face.

 

The fact that you don't cancel your rental contract, don't quit your job, don't cancel your bank acount but "moved" to another country is obviously cheating the system...

 

The least problem will be the "Anmeldung" after coming back, when your rental contract says that you started renting that place 3 (or whatever) years ago. 

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39 minutes ago, kspeedy28 said:

I'm evidently not being clear. There is a point where the German authorities jurisdiction stops as myself and my children are not Only German citizens, but they are also US citizens and as an extreme example, if I am living in the united states and the kids are home schooled Germany cannot say it is illegal. I am trying to find the exact position of that legal boarder between when are they us citizen or German. I said I am looking for an out of the box idea solution, not a bunch of nay saying. I could get those answers from the normal lines of communication. I thought this forum would be a bit more open to such communication.

At the risk of failing to offer the helpful answers you're clearly seeking, what you don't realize is that citizenship is completely irrelevant to the circumstances. Residency is what decides what laws govern you and your family, and right now you appear to be resident in Germany, so German laws apply.

 

You maintain that you can simply deregister at the Einwohnermeldeamt and therefore won't be a resident any more, so you can take 4 weeks of vacation unencumbered by German law, and then come back and register again. Even if that's technically correct, It's highly unlikely that the authorities (and the courts, should it come to that) will follow your argumentation that you weren't a German resident while you were violating the mandatory schooling laws, given that your child will still be enrolled in school (as I mentioned previously), you'll still maintain your abode here, your bank account(s), etc.

 

No offense, but as swimmer suggested, if you find the laws in Germany on mandatory school attendance too odious, perhaps it's not the right country for you.

 

EDIT: GET OUTTA MY HEAD, @franklan, OR I'MMA START CHARGING YOU RENT

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Yes, exactly.  I almost came back to add that it is residency that ultimately defines a lot of how we are treated and our entitlement.  Not citizenship.

 

If I did move back to my home nation, most of what happened to me would be because I am a resident.   My citizenship obviously entitles me to what residents get - but I do have to actually live there.   And similar not reside here, in order to get out of my German obligations. 

 

"Substance over form" is one of those age-old principles that is fairly reliable on these matters.    If we actually have our lives here (substance) then one assertion that is different (form) will not over-ride that.    And another thing I often say here, authorities are really not stupid.   They know all the games and tricks people try.   Can spot them a mile off.

 

Also worth noting that there is also no "I" here.     Surprising language given the highest impact would be on the children.  They would be deregistered as well.    Where would they be documented?   To be undocumented is not an advisable state for most people but especially not for minors, usually, one that authorities tend to try and avoid. 

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6 hours ago, kspeedy28 said:

My children and I are dual citizens with Germany and the U.S., so I guess the question is, does Germany have jurisdiction over my kids or the US? That was the reason I would abmeld us, because at that point the way I see it Germany has no jurisdiction over us, that we are then US citizens once again.

This is not a matter of nationality, but of residence.

 

Regarding abmelding for a short time, this sounds like too much trouble with a lot of consequences.

If you abmeld, then you have to restart all over again when you return.

Unsure how it would work out with your several insurances, rent, etc. They could be considered void. Is it really worth the hassle?

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16 hours ago, kspeedy28 said:

I am just wondering if anyone has gotten around the school system, in respect to taking vacations when school vacation is. I know that school is mandatory as long as you are living in German, but what about if I moved to the U.S. for a month and "abmelded" my family from Germany and then "anmelded" us when we came back. We have always traveled a lot, but this really puts a kink in the traveling. The first born is now in 1st grade and is in a private school. I dont know if the school would accept this even if it was legal to do, just trying to get some out of the box responses. Not only do I like the freedom of choosing when to travel, I just saw the flight cost in spring vs summer, I could travel there a couple time for price difference.

 

I come from a country where it's not a problem to take kids out of school for a couple of weeks, at least if they are doing ok.  However, I do see schulpflicht as a good thing because if they didn't, you might be showing your kids the world and teaching them something along the way but other parents might take their kids out of school to not teach them anything at all or in order to have them work in the family business or to brainwash them into a religious cult or something.

 

As for your plan to do an abmeldung and an anmeldung again, I think it would work.  You tell the school you are moving back to the US.  You come back a month later, enroll the kid again and say that your job you had lined up didn't work out.  It should work.  One time.  Next time, the school will have your plan worked out and they may well notify the jugendamt that you are pulling your kid from school for a mere long vacation.

 

Hence, if you want to do it, I suggest you do it when the kid is older and will remember their once in a lifetime long vacation during school time more vividly.  For future vacations, save up the money and go when the school has holidays.

 

 

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26 minutes ago, LeonG said:

...enroll the kid again...

... assuming that is possible. Good schools fill up fast. And they like to boost their results statistics by creaming off the best students. It may be a risky game.

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