Hospital bill for one night?

85 posts in this topic

22 hours ago, robinson100 said:

It seems that G67C can cost up to €1600:

 

https://diego.one/drg/g67c

 

then again, Rob already did provide this info at the start.

 

problem is, I for one do not in any way understand what that chart means (I grasp the high and low price, but nothing of how or why it changes in between)

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26 minutes ago, lisa13 said:

the bill posted by the OP looks *really* thin to me.  Meaning, even when my cats went to the emergency vet the charges were so detailed it often took several pages to cover.  I would have expected to see something like "sonogram: x euros, overnight stayL x euros, injection x euros, medicine for injectionL x euros".  Same kind of thing when I have a dental treatment not covered by the kasse - the bills are silly with details.

23 hours ago, Bao said:

Until now: This week, a letter arrived at my mail box form Allianz. They say that they do not have a contract with this St. Elisabethen hospital  so I must pay the bill myself. I was more than surprised: Almost 1700 Euro for a stay that lasted a few hours, with the only treatments being painkiller and ultrasound scan. And another problem is, the attached bill stated that it expired in April 2017, but the sending date on the letter from Allianz was October 1st 2018, and it only arrived this week.

 

The insurance company forwarded the bill to him. I wonder if he can get a bill from the hospital which should include more details.

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Yep, lisa. Agree. I think he´s an  ok guy totally. Just a different country and with a different attitude re regulations to Vietnam. Blimey, even the Greeks don´t give a damn about liability insurance. But I keep mine  just in case, from Germany...,( nach dem Motto: " rich foreigner  ( in  many a Greek mind )"..." HE pays even if I´m to blame "!!!:P..have had SOME examples already...4 and a half years here...

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don't have a cow @john g. but I never had comprehensive liability insurance til I moved here :)  

 

I did have a homeowner's policy that covered people being injured on my property, and of course you have to have liability cover with auto insurance, but that was it.  Unless a person is really loaded, I daresay most people simply do not carry personal liability cover in the US.  I don't recall anyone ever trying to sell it to me, that's for sure.

 

eta:  I think part of the reason for that is the issue of enforcement.  In Germany you can enforce a judgement quite easily.  In the US you can win a judgment against someone, but getting them to pay is another matter entirely.  In most cases it's just not worth it to sue someone who isn't rolling in dough.  There is no systemic method of enforcing payments.  Even for things like child support! 

 

hell, I was almost killed by a drunk driver, he was ordered to pay restitution as part of his sentence, I never saw a dime.  He didn't have any auto insurance.  too bad for me

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I had never heard of it, Lisa, when I moved to Germany from London in 1989! I didn´t even know I had to apply for health insurance!! I thought (actually, NO, I didn´t even think about it ) everyone was automatically health insured like in Britain...my " bad  " :Pback then!

Long story but that is how I got started in insurance myself! And empathy for newcomers in Germany in that regard (as long as not deliberately freeloading .)

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8 minutes ago, lisa13 said:

hell, I was almost killed by a drunk driver, he was ordered to pay restitution as part of his sentence, I never saw a dime.  He didn't have any auto insurance.  too bad for me

 

My son was killed by a drunk driver in the U.S. The guy's insurance would only pay $50k which is allowed in the state of VA. Like you said, no use suing him for more - he had nothing. Especially not liability insurance. That money barely paid the lawyers involved in the case. My granddaughter was left with nothing.

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yes.  The caps on default (ie minimum) driver liability insurance are absurdly low.  It's pretty disgusting.

 

you can get PIP (personal injury protection for yourself and passengers) on top, but as I recall that depending on the state, that may only be an option with comprehensive cover.  And even then I think the max payout was pretty low.  Not enough to cover a really serious injury or death.

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12 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

 

My son was killed by a drunk driver in the U.S. The guy's insurance would only pay $50k which is allowed in the state of VA. Like you said, no use suing him for more - he had nothing. Especially not liability insurance. That money barely paid the lawyers involved in the case. My granddaughter was left with nothing.

I feel for you, fraufruit. No tears like a mother´s tears. Sincerely. And father´s tears are bad enough.  Hugs, dear fraufruit,

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22 hours ago, swimmer said:

 

You should thoroughly review each item on the bill and the fee charged (against info on fee scales like in that link above) against what was actually done, and then go and have the discussion.   An insurer might well choose to try that, of course.

 

Different processes can attract different fees and rates,  but it's not really otherwise flexible.   Providers won't normally go "OK, 50% less" or whatever.  

 

I agree. 

 

I've never heard of anyone reducing the amount of a medical bill just because one is "a student" or "it's a lot" or whatever. However, a couple of times I've successfully contested those multipliers that doctors like so much ("Faktor") and had my medical bills reduced that way.

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2 hours ago, lisa13 said:

Just a thought:  would it be worthwhile to go to the verbraucherzentrale (or similar org) and have them review the bill for cost accuracy?  

 

the bill posted by the OP looks *really* thin to me.  Meaning, even when my cats went to the emergency vet the charges were so detailed it often took several pages to cover.  I would have expected to see something like "sonogram: x euros, overnight stayL x euros, injection x euros, medicine for injectionL x euros".  Same kind of thing when I have a dental treatment not covered by the kasse - the bills are silly with detail.

 

One thing that is unfortunately true about emergency medical service regardless of how detailed the bill is, is that they are allowed to charge up to three times the mandated rate for a given procedure.  Depends on what time of day you came in among other things (which I know nothing about), but that could be a large part of why this was so expensive.  

Oh yes, now that you mention it, I did arrive at the golden time: around 1-2 am, and it was a Sunday to boot! Maybe that was one of the reasons why the costs shot up so high :wacko:

 

And @john g. thanks for the encouragement, I will try my best to fit in the system here :)

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2 hours ago, vronchen said:

 

The insurance company forwarded the bill to him. I wonder if he can get a bill from the hospital which should include more details.

Ah good idea! I will come to the hospital to ask for this as soon as I have time!

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2 hours ago, fraufruit said:

Love you, john g. It is still hard.

My Nicole has a son--now 30 and often a pain in the arse..of course. Nicole often tells me..if something happens to my son, my life is over.

I would have to help/deal with it...dunno how.

Good mothers love and will see their sons again--they will, babe.There is a reason they are your children and there is a reason they will always continue to be.

Bless, sweetheart.

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12 minutes ago, Bao said:

Oh yes, now that you mention it, I did arrive at the golden time: around 1-2 am, and it was a Sunday to boot! Maybe that was one of the reasons why the costs shot up so high :wacko:

 

And @john g. thanks for the encouragement, I will try my best to fit in the system here :)

Get Haftpflicht insured, young friend! Just do it! 

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We didn't know about Haftpflichtversicherung and that we needed it, until after we needed it.  Anyone with children needs it, for sure!

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Not only those with children, dear katheliz..though very important. EVERYBODY in Germany needs it -cycling down the road  and you run someone over - you bump into someone in the supermarket and they fall over and break their leg etc

And worldwide stuff 24 hours a day,

People living in Germany- by this I mean naive expats - really need to understand how " heavy " this stuff is. You risk bankruptcy and why? German law and the unwillingness to pay 80-100 euros  a year to lessen the risk...

i hate feeling like a scummy insurance salesman---( which I´m not ) and this type of contract is hardly worth the effort but it´s the way it is--I´m an older guy now and know how easily mistakes can happen...

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I can see where the OP is coming from as I'm in Vietnam and have been living here for a long time. Just going into most hospitals here for a checkup when feeling bad means you normally don't get a bill exceeding 50 EUR and prices are generally stated in advance before they treat you (unless it is really serious) 

I sympathise with the OP as I remember having a nightmare of a time getting onto TK and then getting off it again when I left Germany. 

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12 hours ago, lisa13 said:

the bill posted by the OP looks *really* thin to me.  Meaning, even when my cats went to the emergency vet the charges were so detailed it often took several pages to cover.  I would have expected to see something like "sonogram: x euros, overnight stayL x euros, injection x euros, medicine for injectionL x euros".  Same kind of thing when I have a dental treatment not covered by the kasse - the bills are silly with detail.

 

One thing that is unfortunately true about emergency medical service regardless of how detailed the bill is, is that they are allowed to charge up to three times the mandated rate for a given procedure.  Depends on what time of day you came in among other things (which I know nothing about), but that could be a large part of why this was so expensive.  

 

What you describe only applies to out-patient treatment. As soon as you are admitted to a Hospital, bills work differently. 

 

 

12 hours ago, lisa13 said:

 

then again, Rob already did provide this info at the start.

 

problem is, I for one do not in any way understand what that chart means (I grasp the high and low price, but nothing of how or why it changes in between)

 

The graph just says that the first day is cheaper (0,259 of the base price), and from the 7th day it's more expensive. Everything in between is a fixed price (0,47 of the base price). I don't know where the values on that link come from but they definitely don't reflect the full base price. 

 

Where he might have a point is: why is he being charged for 2 days?

 

 

 

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So... after much waiting and a lot of paperwork, finally it was done. The insurer agreed to pay for the bills. It turned out that it was all miscommunication. Their refusal of paying the bill was from a lack of documents. There were two hospitals, so they sent me two emails requesting documents from both of them. Unfortunately, one of those emails never arrived. I checked all my email addresses again and again, but found only one email from the insurer on that day.

To all the users who have posted here, thank you very much for your concern. And though it is a bit late now, I wish you all a happy 2019!

All is good now. I even found an internship in Berlin :lol: Time for a new journey!

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