Hospital bill for one night?

79 posts in this topic

Okay, the story is like this: One and a half year ago, in March 2017, I had an acute stomachache at mid night so a taxi was called to transport me to the nearest hospital, which was St. Elisabethen Krankenhaus in Frankfurt am Main. There they gave me an abdominal ultrasound scan and a shot of pain killer. Then they told me that I should change to another hospital to get better treatment and the ambulance for that arrived at dawn. My stay at the second hospital was covered entirely by my insurance (Mawista) so all was good.

 

Until now: This week, a letter arrived at my mail box form Allianz. They say that they do not have a contract with this St. Elisabethen hospital  so I must pay the bill myself. I was more than surprised: Almost 1700 Euro for a stay that lasted a few hours, with the only treatments being painkiller and ultrasound scan. And another problem is, the attached bill stated that it expired in April 2017, but the sending date on the letter from Allianz was October 1st 2018, and it only arrived this week.

 

There are two things that are unclear to me:

-This bill feels totally unreal. It feels almost like extortion if you ask me. The most expensive thing in the bill is: DRG-Ziffer G67C (1600 Euros). Is this kind of price normal in Germany?

-Will I face some problem with the police since this bill expired so long ago?

 

And this is not the first time a bill from Allianz like this arrived either. A year ago they asked for the transportation fee of the ambulance, and I already paid that. 400 Euros for a 15 minutes trip :blink:

 

Thank you for reading this until the end. I hope that I will receive an answer soon. I am lost, I do not know what I should do. 1700 is too much for a student.

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sounds like US style healthcare.  "In network" not "in network" - you're sick/having an emergency, how on earth can a person research this kind of detail re: coverage in a state like this? 

 

Why did you accept a policy like this, especially as a student? and is that even legal cover in Germany?

 

if it makes you feel better, I had a short ambulance ride (less than 5 miles) in the US, cost $1200 in 1997.  Included in the bill, apparently they charged $250 to pour peroxide on my knee.

 

sounds like you got a deal ;)

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You don't need to worry about the police. This is just a civil matter.

 

5 minutes ago, robinson100 said:

 

Why don't you have "normal" health insurance?

 

 

I can only guess: because Mawista is much cheaper (until something like this happens).

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5 minutes ago, Smaug said:

You don't need to worry about the police. This is just a civil matter.

 

 

I can only guess: because Mawista is much cheaper (until something like this happens).

Hm, could get to the Inkasso phase....letters, Mahnungen, lezte Mahnungen etc...

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18 minutes ago, robinson100 said:

It seems that G67C can cost up to €1600:

 

https://diego.one/drg/g67c

 

Why don't you have "normal" health insurance?

Maybe not able to get student insurance in the German public system. Maybe too " old " (ie over 30 ) - maybe just went for cheap (probably ) - maybe poorly advised. Or not advised.

And German hospitals are expensive..I actually asked TK the other month : " what does a stay  of eg 3 days cost in hospital  in Germany? "

" Weiss nicht..".Basically,, it depends: ( my questions ) " what did you get dragged in for? What did they do to you? Which hospital ? "

Got a  really ballpark figure of between 3-5,000 euros ."

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44 minutes ago, robinson100 said:

It seems that G67C can cost up to €1600:

 

https://diego.one/drg/g67c

 

Why don't you have "normal" health insurance?

I can only admit that I was careless. When I first came to Germany, I did not know much about the required paper works so I had an agent helped me, and he used Mawista as my insurance. Well, every thing passed at the Consulate and I successfully got a visa so I never gave much thought about it. I only knew about AOK and the others much later, but when I asked to join, they refused, saying that I cannot change insurer until my studies are finished...

 

So the only way to solve this is by paying directly to the hospital after all?

 

By the way, as I said, they did not give me the treatment, the other hospital did. They only did an ultrasonic scan and gave me painkiller. Does that even count as "treatment"...

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14 minutes ago, john g. said:

Hm, could get to the Inkasso phase...letters, Mahnungen, lezte Mahnungen etc...

 

You are right, John. I didn't mean he didn't have to worry, just that he didn't have to worry about the coppers :-) 

 

Such a big debt is unlikely to go away.

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I had a typical "expat" private provider policy in the days before local healthcare was mandatory here.  This policy was 100% clear that it was only to be used at a small set of locations they had agreements with to provide for me.   It did not give me cover elsewhere.   Any other bill was nothing to do with them.  So that set up is entirely normal.

 

My view is that the general rule is that anything involving capital / assets seems to be when the price ramps up.   We have to contribute a fixed part of the full cost of that - machines, vehicles etc.   Ambulance all out is typically c. 500 Euros for that reason, mainly.    Basically, keeping away from the assets is how to contain the costs.

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2 minutes ago, swimmer said:

I had a typical "expat" private provider policy in the days before local healthcare was mandatory here.  This policy was 100% clear that it was only to be used at a small set of locations they had agreements with to provide for me.   It did not give me cover elsewhere.  So that set up is entirely normal.

Ah, that I know and I agree that I must pay this bill. But my questions were about the price and the expiration date of the bill :rolleyes:

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My situation is different, Smaug! I had an  emergency operation here in Greece in March and they still haven´t sent me the bill.  that´s Greece...I feel sorry for the young guy in a different system and with the language stuff. 

I would always recommend people read the terms and conditions of a contract before signing but if it´s only in German (or maybe it wasn´t?)...young is young.

And who is supposed to know which hospitals are covered?

And, on the other hand, the system is so complex...Germany doesn´t do easy...and the debt is indeed unlikely to go away.

 

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1 minute ago, john g. said:

My situation is different, Smaug! I had an  emergency operation here in Greece in March and they still haven´t sent me the bill.  that´s Greece...I feel sorry for the young guy in a different system and with the language stuff. 

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It can happen in Germany. A Berlin hospital waited 365 days before sending me their bill. I thought they'd forgotten about me! :-)

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10 minutes ago, Bao said:

Ah, that I know and I agree that I must pay this bill. But my questions were about the price and the expiration date of the bill :rolleyes:

 

Sorry, thought that was the surprise bit.  The bill is personal.  How we choose to find the money to pay it is down to us.  Our creditor (provider) still wants paying.   If we choose to fund ourselves via private insurance, that is a different contract.    You mean the "due date for payment" I think.

 

You could try querying it as too high (according to the standard rates  linked earlier).

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Nobody should forget you, Smaug! You´re too nice a person - SHAME on them!

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10 minutes ago, Bao said:

Ah, that I know and I agree that I must pay this bill. But my questions were about the price and the expiration date of the bill :rolleyes:

 

There is no "expiration date" on a bill, bills don't expirate when they are not paid. If bills expired, no one would pay them anymore (but simply play dead until the expiration date isn over). 

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Just now, john g. said:

Nobody should forget you, Smaug! You´re too nice a person - SHAME on them!

Urgh, so the only way to solve this is to pay the bill directly to the hospital after all? Is there any chance for me to negotiate or something like that to lower the price? 1700 will be a huge blow to my finance...

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I suspect he's more worried that his payment could be considered "late", even if he paid it immediately

 

I would inspect whatever Allianz sent to see if there is a due date.  I think the original date of the bill represents the date the hospital submitted the charges to allianz, so I kinda doubt you'd be on the hook and in trouble for this (yet) since you have only recently been informed.  no idea though - never had any experience like that here.

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2 minutes ago, Bao said:

Urgh, so the only way to solve this is to pay the bill directly to the hospital after all? Is there any chance for me to negotiate or something like that to lower the price? 

 

Someone has already suggested that, but I wouldn't make a bet on success. 

 

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4 minutes ago, Bao said:

Is there any chance for me to negotiate or something like that to lower the price? ..

 

You should thoroughly review each item on the bill and the fee charged (against info on fee scales like in that link above) against what was actually done, and then go and have the discussion.   An insurer might well choose to try that, of course.

 

Different processes can attract different fees and rates,  but it's not really otherwise flexible.   Providers won't normally go "OK, 50% less" or whatever.  

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