Muslim Police Officer fined for refusing to shake female colleague's hand

430 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, engelchen said:

 

BTW, it is interesting that the majority of women on this thread are insulted by the pig's refusal to shake hands with women, but many of the men don't see the problem. <_<

 

 

 

 

A lot of the men here had painted themselves into a corner having already supported muslim boys last year who refused to shake hands with their female teachers.

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16 minutes ago, jeba said:

No reason to become rude.

 

I wasn't being rude to you. I merely explained that it is foolish that making such an exception for one could disrupt the whole police force.  

 

16 minutes ago, jeba said:

I´m not even sure it was a public event rather than an internal occasion.

 

It doesn't matter. It was a Beförderungsfeier and they were probably all in uniform. 

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2 minutes ago, jeba said:

Even if it was public - what if he had given a kiss on the hand and bowed (which I´ve seen when my late granny was greeted in Austria)? Would that also be seen as disrespectful?

 

He did greet her.  He did the hand on heart bow. thing.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, jeba said:

as long as he had no intention of being disrespectful he shouldn´t be regarded as being disrespectful.

 

This one phrase defined a lot of sexual harassment cases.  It matters not the intention of the 'doer' but rather the perception and feelings of the 'receiver'.  

 

He might have had absolutely no intention to disrespect his female colleague, but if she felt disrespected that holds more weight.  One's actions that involve more than one person  must be viewed from both sides. 

 

I cannot recall the amount of times I made a faux pas in other countries.  While my intention was not to offend, I did.  I was wrong, not the others.

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2 minutes ago, jaycool said:

Personally, I would lend more weight to his right to religious freedom more than to her right to be treated equally through handshake***, but those are the rules in Germany.


About time I started suing women who kiss females but when they reach me they extend a hand instead!

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3 minutes ago, jaycool said:

 

Of course it's relevant. We're talking about the rules in Germany, not Italy, Russia or New Zealand.

 

Personally, I would lend more weight to his right to religious freedom more than to her right to be treated equally through handshake***, but those are the rules in Germany.

 

*** If someone refused to shake my hand, I'd think "what a dick" and that would be the end of it. If someone forced me to go against my personal beliefs, they would have a fight on their hands (shook or unshook).

 

What if instead of refusing to shake the hands of women he had refused to shake hands with black people?  Still say he is a dick and move on or is that a problem?

 

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Just now, zwiebelfisch said:

 

What if instead of refusing to shake the hands of women he had refused to shake hands with black people?  Still say he is a dick and move on or is that a problem?

 


It would depend on his argument for that. I have no problem chest bumping another man. But I'm going to think twice about chest bumping a woman. Some arguments work in some situations and don't work in others. Intention as Jeba says is a better indicator in this case.

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3 minutes ago, Dunkle Schokolade said:


It would depend on his argument for that. I have no problem chest bumping another man. But I'm going to think twice about chest bumping a woman. Some arguments work in some situations and don't work in others.

 

 

With the possible exception of sporting events, where is chest bumping appropriate in a work context? :wacko:

 

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I've had this happen to me with two adult muslim pupils - a Syrian and a Moroccan. They came for English conversation regularly. They didn't come together, they came separately. They wouldn't shake hands and also wouldn't drink out of my cups or glasses or use my clean towels in the bathroom. Instead they wiped their wet hands on their jeans. It was odd that when I offered a drink of mineral water (I had the bottle and the glasses on the table in front of us) they would refuse, yet a little while later they would drink out of their own bottles of mineral water they had in their bags). I didn't make a fuss or even discuss the subject in case it created embarrassment between us. Otherwise they were quite friendly. Nevertheless, it created several uncomfortable moments, which inhibited normal conversation. I mean, how can you feel comfortable and at ease with men, who seem to think you are unclean? Religion was discussed on occasion because they also came during Ramadam. I was interested but was careful not to be too inquisitive as I was afraid of unintentionally offending them, though I had disclosed that I personally am not religious. 

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Holy crap, this thread took off!

 

I am way too lazy to remember how different greetings go. Three kisses for women in Holland always really slowed things down, and then two kisses here, sometimes one. WTF.

 

I just tend to say hello/hi, and maybe wave or raise my hand (in a non-Nazi way... most of the time). I don't do names either, even if I know them. I guess I just got used to it.

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20 minutes ago, engelchen said:

 

With the possible exception of sporting events, where is chest bumping appropriate in a work context? :wacko:

 


Maybe I've watched too many American Police movies. My favourite TV show of all time is "The Wire". The director David Simon claims it is an accurate description of life in Baltimore. There is an entire season on police officers. Chest bumping appears 100% appropriate in that context.

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Would all those who claim that he should be punished for bowing rather than shaking hands also demand the same if someone would refuse to kiss someone they meet e. g. in Russia (think Honecker-Brechnew style)? Or should John.G  start doling out cheek kisses because he lives in Greece or otherwise be fined?

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8 minutes ago, jeba said:

Would all those who claim that he should be punished for bowing rather than shaking hands also demand the same if someone would refuse to kiss someone they meet e. g. in Russia (think Honecker-Brechnew style)? Or should John.G  start doling out cheek kisses because he lives in Greece or otherwise be fined?


They'll point out that he is a police officer. But in my opinion what they really mean to say is that he is a muslim.

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Got to commend the media for an exceptionally good job at maligning Islam. Some Muslims obviously do a good job of helping them along, so at least there's a broad base to blame for the hysteria.

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On 3/17/2018, 1:49:07, MikeMelga said:

You guys would feel very awkward in Portugal, where you are supposed to greet women with 2 kisses in the cheeks, even if you don't know them...

 

My first real big trip out of my country was to Argentina, for a couple of months in a work assignment.  I was totally shocked that everyone gave kisses in the cheeks when they were introduced the first time, woman to woman, man to woman, and the worst ... MEN TO MEN!!!!

 

In the times I was raised we even talked to women using the informal way (i.e. Du in German) but we talked to other men strictly using the formal way (Sie in German) because "talking to other men in the informal way was way too gay".

 

And there I was, in that devilish place in which men kissed other men.   After a few weeks every one in the whole company knew about my issues with kissing men and my constant rejection, so it became a joke.    Every day guys will try to kiss me just to see my reaction, and then they had a laugh and all I could think was "F*ck this gay nonsense".    I was there in Buenos Aires for a couple of months (and later on came multiple times again) and made very good friends.   Those a-holes had a plan for my last day in the country on that assignment.   We had a meeting and we were all sitting at the table, once the meeting finished they all jumped on me, I was trapped with my legs under the table, they hold me from the arms and one by one kissed me on the cheek and wished me a safe trip back home and expressed their gratitude of working with me and how they valued our new friendship.   All I could think was "F*ck this sh*t, f*ck all these gay idiots" and then it got worse every time the kisser had a beard.   Then they released me, they all laughed, I laughed and had water in my eyes while I was thinking "As*h*les, they all kissed me".

 

Now 20+ years forward I have great memories of my days in Buenos Aires and I think my kissing experience wouldn't be possible in the ultra PC world we have today.  It would be sexual harassment and I should be probably entitled to join the #MeToo movement.

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Wow. TT is such an education. I had no idea that chest bumping even existed!! (I watch no sport.)

 

At the end of the day I think the police officer was showing clear signs of his inability to fully integrate into his host country. He has his limits and bowed out (pun intended) of the hand-shake. Integration starts with the small things. When in Rome do as the Romans do, especially when you are in a uniform.

 

I found myself feeling offended/irritated/defensive (like enough is enough) last night seeing an advert on British TV with a muslim lady in her headscarf. ITV bending over backwards to be inclusive to the point that the natives feel defensive. It feels like an insidious infiltration of our mores. Really. Muslim uniform now has seriously negative associations in the West. Our post-Judeo-Christian culture is being changed oh so slowly,  softly, softly, bit by bit, so we barely notice. I do not want to live in a headscarf society! And why wasn't it a man in a turban? I do not consider myself to be NF but I notice myself becoming more and more defensive on this subject.

 

Bayerische Dude's arguments are totally lucid and hit the nail right on the head.

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2 minutes ago, optimista said:

At the end of the day I think the police officer was showing clear signs of his inability to fully integrate into his host country. He has his limits and bowed out (pun intended) of the hand-shake. Integration starts with the small things. When in Rome do as the Romans do, especially when you are in a uniform.

 

What if the guy was born here?

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1 minute ago, Krieg said:

 

What if the guy was born here?

 Then there are no excuses for his behaviour at all. Hes just a victim.

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2 minutes ago, Krieg said:

 

What if the guy was born here?

 

Then he highlights the problems of a Parallelgesellschaft.

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11 minutes ago, coolness.personified said:

 Then there are no excuses for his behaviour at all. Hes just a victim.

 

Well did I say his behavior was OK?  

 

The point is this is news worthy only because he is a Muslim. 

 

And you are assuming he is an immigrant because of his religion,   It is a bit ironic to complain about his lack of integration when you don't see him as a German.

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