About to sign job contract: no overtime, no bonus, no healthcare and no annual rise clause?

13 posts in this topic

Hi everyone.

 

I am offered an Engineering job in Bayern area, but since I'm not very familiar with convention/custom of German job contract, I have some doubt with the contract, namely:

 

  1. No overtime regulation clause (means they don't recognize overtime?)
  2. No bonus regulation clause (no bonus scheme/supplement at all, fixed payment?)
  3. No annual pay-rise clause (is it something one should negotiate later?)
  4. No healthcare clause (there is pension, though) (I have to take public insurance by myself I am non-EU national)

 

A basic check against https://ec.europa.eu/eures/main.jsp?lang=en&acro=living&catId=8270&parentId=7778&countryId=DE&langChanged=true (Employment contracts)

seems to check out though, with some exception.

 

Quote

name and address of the employee ( )
name and address of the employer ( )
place of work ( )
description of duties ( )
date on which employment commenced ( )
duration of probationary period ( )
in the case of fixed-term contracts, duration of the contract ( n/a)
in the case of open-ended contracts, permissible termination date and required periods of notice ( )
weekly or daily working hours ( )
amount of remuneration and of any supplements (  - Only salary)
timing and method of payment ( x  no mention, is it ok?
leave allowance ( x - there is clause about allowed vacation in days, I believe it's paid leave)
reference to collective agreements and to works and service agreements ( x )

 

Is this kind of condition is to be expected for a German contract? what should I be aware of?


The company itself is a medium sized company (80+ people) which is subsidiary of larger, multi-national company. In additio the salary is on slightly higher than the region average. (to give context about legitimacy)

 

I'm not sure what information/context I should add, feel free to suggest if some info are missing and I will update it immediately.

 

Cheers,

 

Achi

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When you say "no health insurance clause", do you mean it is just not mentioned or that it is explicitly excluded? The former would be completely normal, the latter would ring alarm bells.

 

 

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4. You have to have health insurance if the employee contract is a German one and the costs are more or less split between you and the employer. You are guaranteed acceptance into public insurance and have the option of private German insurance if your income is high enough.

Either way : you and the employer will both have to pay contributions.

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2 minutes ago, engelchen said:

When you say "no health insurance clause", do you mean it is just not mentioned or that it is explicitly excluded? The former would be completely normal, the latter would ring alarm bells.

 

 

Hey there, no it is just not mentioned. I did ask the company about that and they say I can take public insurance, but they did not mention about who's paying how much.

I didn't ask further at that time, I will ask again before I handed out the signed contract.

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2 minutes ago, john g. said:

4. You have to have health insurance if the employee contract is a German one and the costs are more or less split between you and the employer. You are guaranteed acceptance into public insurance and have the option of private German insurance if your income is high enough.

Either way : you and the employer will both have to pay contributions.

I understand, but what is the percentage?

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Public insurance: your part is approx. 8 per cent of your gross income

Private insurance: doesn't depend on income for the price but on your health, age and the tariff you choose.

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7 minutes ago, aachsoo said:

Hey there, no it is just not mentioned. I did ask the company about that and they say I can take public insurance, but they did not mention about who's paying how much.

 

As long as it is a normal employment contract, the social security contributions are all set by law. You need to choose an insurance company and let your employer know.

 

Quote

I didn't ask further at that time, I will ask again before I handed out the signed contract.

 

It is not unusual that there is no clause regarding annual raises and bonuses, however, you might want to ask about overtime and negotiate a clause.

 

Is your contract governed by a collective bargaining agreement (Tarifvertrag)? I've also had very short contracts because all the details were set in the Tarifvertrag.

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18 minutes ago, engelchen said:

As long as it is a normal employment contract, the social security contributions are all set by law. You need to choose an insurance company and let your employer know.

It is not unusual that there is no clause regarding annual raises and bonuses, however, you might want to ask about overtime and negotiate a clause.

I see, indeed German contact is a bit different than I would expect.. I will try to ask about the overtime but I was under impression they expect all work to be done on the 40h/w. Personally I don't think it's always achievable if there is big project, but that's more reason to negotiate.

 

Quote

Is your contract governed by a collective bargaining agreement (Tarifvertrag)? I've also had very short contracts because all the details were set in the Tarifvertrag.

How do I found this out? there is no clause referring to Tarifvertrag in my contract.

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38 minutes ago, aachsoo said:

...

 

  1. No overtime regulation clause (means they don't recognize overtime?)
  2. No bonus regulation clause (no bonus scheme/supplement at all, fixed payment?)
  3. No annual pay-rise clause (is it something one should negotiate later?)
  4. No healthcare clause (there is pension, though) (I have to take public insurance by myself I am non-EU national)

...

 

 

1:   You will need to ask.  There could be an agreement on a union level or on a works council level.  But the details might not be in your contract but subject to a separate agreement between the employer and the works council/union.  This might also include things such as flexi-time, home office, etc.  There might be a fixed defined compensation level (e.g.  xx Euros per hour) or variable (e.g.  first 10 hours per month at 1x hourly rate, next 10 hours at 1.5x hourly, public holidays, Sundays at 2x hourly rate etc.)

 

What must be stated in the number of hours per week you will work, and maybe also the expected working times and/or days.

 

 

2:  Yes, it would seem as if you don't have a bonus included in your contract. 

 

 

3:  I have never had a contract which had an annual pay rise stated.  The best I have had stated that there would be an annual review, but that does not mean that you get a rise.  However, this has never been an issue.  I would never expect any employer to put such a thing in a contract, otherwise they have to give you this even if you under performed badly the whole year.  And on the other hand, they would not give you more even if you were a star performer in the company!

 

4:  As the others have basically said, heath insurance is a legal requirement.  It is not provided by the company and you need to arrange cover yourselves.  However, the amount the company has to pay towards this is set in law and will be in addition to your salary.  

So this is not an issue.

 

Other points you had (with a 'x' against them)

5:  timing and method of payment ( x  no mention, is it ok?

Method is not normally an issue.  Timing you need to discuss.  It might for example be split into 12, 13 or 14 payments (the 13th and 14th are effectively an extra payment in summer and Christmas, but the annual salary is the same).  You need to ask HR. Better to have it in the contract.


6:  leave allowance ( x - there is clause about allowed vacation in days, I believe it's paid leave)

You get minimum 20 days paid leave as per law.  Anything additional must be stated, so you need to check the exact wording and again maybe ask HR.


7:  reference to collective agreements and to works and service agreements ( x )

This does not have to be explicitly stated as they will anyway be valid.  An example is what I stated in answer to question 1.

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@dj_jay_smith '

Hi, thanks a lot for the detailed reply!

 

1) I asked, the overtime is internally regulated, not on the contract but they recognize work time noted. A bit weird, but I guess it works for those already there.

2) Yes confirmed no bonus for my position

3) Understood, I was thinking about rise to account for inflation, not performance-wise.

4) Yes, I get it now

5) The contract specifically said gross amount per calendar month, so it's 12 month

6) Yes it's > 20 days

7) Ok. I just confirmed they don't have tarifvertrag, so means no union?

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In my previous company, they were using the gross amount per calendar.

The bad thing is that your salary over time is eaten up by the inflation and it is very hard to get it increase.

For some people who were close to be retired, they didn't get any increase at the last five years because they were sure that they cannot go anywhere.

This was the main reason that I left the company for slightly less salary and after six month I got a huge salary jump in my new company.

 

If you have chance, try to find out something with Tarif. 

You cannot negotiate any year about inflation.

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11 hours ago, Moonwave said:

In my previous company, they were using the gross amount per calendar.

The bad thing is that your salary over time is eaten up by the inflation and it is very hard to get it increase.

For some people who were close to be retired, they didn't get any increase at the last five years because they were sure that they cannot go anywhere.

This was the main reason that I left the company for slightly less salary and after six month I got a huge salary jump in my new company.

 

If you have chance, try to find out something with Tarif. 

You cannot negotiate any year about inflation.

 

Hmm this is something to watch out for.

I asked, they don't have tarifvertrag..

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10 minutes ago, aachsoo said:

 

Hmm this is something to watch out for.

I asked, they don't have tarifvertrag..

 

That's pretty much standard, most employees in Germany work without Tarifvertrag those days.

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