arbeitslosengeld for non-EU workers

[ExPattheDog 37]

Hey all  

 

background: working in Berlin for 1,5-2years, American citizen- currently a blue card holder, but started out with a work visa 

 

I recently took a new job, and I'm getting signs the company isn't super stable. I'm now worrying about potentially losing my job (and regretting leaving my old one!) and I have a few questions...

 

As I've been working legally here, I've been paying into the unemployment insurance. If I lose my job, am I entitled to it? 

 

I'm not so sure because I'm American and my blue card/work visa is tied to my employer. 

 

If the answer is no, and I expect it will be, what do I need to do to become eligible? My understanding is that the requirements are: 1. Work 12 months over the last two years (done and check), and 2. Have an unrestricted residence permit. 

 

So I guess my question is, how do I get an unrestricted visa? 

 

Ive also heard about people getting unemployment while on a fiktionpermit (or something similar). Is this possible? What loopholes are available, of any? 

 

Im not in any immediate risk, but I want to be prepared well in advance in case it happens and I can't find a suitable job in time.

 

thank you!

[techgirl 1,827]

If you've been working here long enough, then yes, you are entitled to unemployment if you lose your job. I (also an American) received 1.5 months of unemployment between contracts -- one ended August 15 and the next began October 1. This also did not affect my eventual permanent residency permit (which I've now held for a couple years).

 

If you're worried about the stability of your company, you can ask for a work permit that's not tied to your employer after (if I remember correctly) 2 years. It's still time restricted, but you're free to switch employers. This is the type I had when I applied for unemployment, and I requested it as soon as I was eligible so that I didn't have to worry about my contract ending and not finding another job in time. 

[ExPattheDog 37]

On 1/24/2018, 10:13:09, techgirl said:

 

 

Ah, thank you so much techgirl! That is really, really helpful. If I may clarify and confirm, after 2 years of legal residence/working here, I can request a non-employer specific work permit (with an expiration date) even before I receive my permanent residence permit? Is this correct? If you could possibly link me where you read this, that would be great...

 

Also a question... since I'm here now 1,5years, lets say something happens in the next 6 months and I need to switch to a job seekers visa. Can I still apply for an unrestricted work visa after the 2 year mark, even if 6 months of the last 24 months were on job seekers? I presume not?

 

THANK YOU

[techgirl 1,827]

As far as the first question goes, yes, you can -- that's what I did. It was in my old passport, so I can't quote the exact wording, but I went from "befristet" and "Beschäftigung nur bei xxx Arbeitgeber" to "befristet" und "Beschäftigung gestattet" -- it was several years later that I received the Niederlassungserlaubnis. I did have an active but time-limited work contract when I made this first change, and a permanent work contract (past the Probezeit) when I got the NE.

 

For the second question, I can't answer definitively, but I would also assume not. The idea is that you have secure income, which a "job-seeker" presumably does not.

[ExPattheDog 37]

Thanks! You're super helpful... 

 

one other thing I'm trying to find out is, if I get an unrestricted work visa and need to get unemployment, how long can I stay in the county for?  

[papak 4]

Check the requirement for NE. I know after some months of holding a bluecard, ie 18 months or so, you could apply for for NE if you have B1 communication language skills. Kindly check the BAMF page. I hope this helps.

[ExPattheDog 37]

On 1/24/2018, 10:13:09, techgirl said:

If you've been working here long enough,

 

What is long enough? I've been here for 22 months

[Guest]

4 hours ago, ExPattheDog said:

 

What is long enough? I've been here for 22 months

 

'Being here' is not relevant – you have to have paid into the insurance (for at least 12 months) while working to get s.t.h out. 22 months make 11 months, the max. is 12 months. OTOH you have to inform the Ausländerbehörde when you loose your job and have only 3 months to find a new job.

[ExPattheDog 37]

2 hours ago, someonesdaughter said:

 

'Being here' is not relevant – you have to have paid into the insurance (for at least 12 months) while working

as this entire post discusses, I've been working here for 22 months...

 

2 hours ago, someonesdaughter said:

when you loose your job and have only 3 months to find a new job.

everywhere else says 6 months on the job seekers visa. where did you hear 3 months?

[Guest]

28 minutes ago, ExPattheDog said:

as this entire post discusses, I've been working here for 22 months...

 

It's important to use the correct terms:

 

Quote

everywhere else says 6 months on the job seekers visa. where did you hear 3 months?

 

You say you have a bluecard, not a job seekers visa. The 6 month are for graduates of German or foreign universities (§18 c AufenthG).

 

With Bluecard you have 3 months:

 

"Where the duration of the employment contract is less than four years, the EU Blue Card shall be issued or extended for the period covering the employment contract plus three months." Source: §19a AUfenthG (in English)

 

It's been discussed before btw see, see.

[Neptoon 2]

I have to admit that I fell into this pit in 2016. I worked on and off with a freelance visa and then obtained a Festanstellung with visa (regular visa, not Blue Card) that let me work as an Angestellter tied to one employer, worked for that employer (for a little less than two years) and was let go, applied for unemployment compensation, and was approved.

The Agentur für Arbeit makes you go to an initial discussion, at which time it was determined that because my visa was tied to my last employer, I was "unvermittelbar" (unable to be placed) into a new job (due to the fact that I would need a new visa, which they're somehow not responsible for), so they then turned around and denied my unemployment compensation a week after it was approved. 

I didn't know about/was unsure about my eligibility to change my visa at that time to the unlimited "Beschäftigung gestattet" which, if I understand TechGirl above, would have let me collect unemployment compensation and enjoy the help of the Agentur für Arbeit in finding new work.

At this time things have worked themselves out but all my German friends were furious, advised me to appeal and get a lawyer, but I've not had much luck with that route before so I didn't follow their advice. See also http://www.berlin.de/labo/willkommen-in-berlin/dienstleistungen/service.245714.php/dienstleistung/326856/

[LeonG 14,797]

On 31.3.2018, 12:02:31, Neptoon said:

The Agentur für Arbeit makes you go to an initial discussion, at which time it was determined that because my visa was tied to my last employer, I was "unvermittelbar" (unable to be placed) into a new job (due to the fact that I would need a new visa, which they're somehow not responsible for), so they then turned around and denied my unemployment compensation a week after it was approved. 

 

I think it's the same in other countries.  When I was in Canada, Germans who were laid off there were not getting unemployment benefits either even though they were paying into the system.  It was considered unfair to Canadians to give it to them since they were unable to take the next job that came along since they would need a work permit which can be a lengthy process.

 

[TurMech 180]

In accordance with section 82 subs. 6 of the German Residence Act, persons who are resident are obliged to notify the competent immigration authority of the loss of their job where employment is subject to approval by the immigration authority. The foreigner in question initially still holds a valid residence title, but the immigration authority may stipulate a subsequent time limitation at its discretion. This time limitation may however take account of the possibility to seek employment, particularly if entitlements to unemployment benefit 1 (“ALG I”) have arisen as a result of contributions that have been made.

 

Source: http://www.bamf.de/EN/Infothek/FragenAntworten/BlaueKarteEU/blaue-karte-eu-node.html

[ExPattheDog 37]

UPDATE:

 

I received ALG1. How?

 

1. Because I've already been here 23months before job loss, the Auslanderbehorde issued me a Fiktionsbescheinigung, which included the checked box 'der Aufenthalt als erlaub,' essentially extending my residence permit in the absence of employment temporarily (for 6 months). As I was then technically eligible for work, ALG1 was no problem. 

 

Good luck to anyone else in a similar situation!

[dayleyc 0]

Hi,

I have a question. I am a non-EU citizen and I have done my MSc and PhD in Germany and I had a contract for 3.5 years from the university during my PhD studies. My residence permit is with §18 and entitled to my work. Apparently, due to this restricted permit, I can not apply for the arbeitslosengeld 1. I have an appointment in two weeks and I thought I could only ask for job-seeking visa. However, with that, I can not get arbeitslosengeld 1 either.

 

On 7/23/2018, 5:17:32, ExPattheDog said:

1. Because I've already been here 23months before job loss, the Auslanderbehorde issued me a Fiktionsbescheinigung, which included the checked box 'der Aufenthalt als erlaub,' essentially extending my residence permit in the absence of employment temporarily (for 6 months). As I was then technically eligible for work, ALG1 was no problem. 

2

Now, if I go to Auslanderamt and ask for Aufenthalt asl erlaubt instead of Aufenthaltstitel als fortbestehend am I eligible for that?

Do you know where can I find the written official statement on this?

 

Moreover, I have 18-months of job-seeking visa right. If I am eligible for the  Aufenthalt asl erlaubt, how long would that be? Can I change it to job-seeking visa afterwards?

 

Thank you!

[laurenBv 0]

Hello everyone! I am in the same situation. I was given a job seeking visa for 6 months which says.   „ Erwerbstätigkeit ab 01.05. nicht gestattet“ My ALG officer has said that this makes me ineligible, but he suggests I go back to the Auslanderbehorde to ask to change the visa. I will unfortunately not be able to get an appointment so I will go and wait in line. In everyone's experience, are they usually willing to change it after a visa has been issued? I have worked here 5 years as a wissenschaftlicher mitarbeiterin, so not a short amount of time but I do not speak German

 

Thanks for any advice! 

 

[honigbiene 13]

On 3/26/2018, 6:30:20, someonesdaughter said:

 

'Being here' is not relevant – you have to have paid into the insurance (for at least 12 months) while working to get s.t.h out. 22 months make 11 months, the max. is 12 months. OTOH you have to inform the Ausländerbehörde when you loose your job and have only 3 months to find a new job.

Sorry to pop in here. But, is this true for those who are NE holders as well? I.e., informing the Ausländersbehörde about loss of job and 3 months to look for a job.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, honigbiene said:

Sorry to pop in here. But, is this true for those who are NE holders as well? I.e., informing the Ausländersbehörde about loss of job and 3 months to look for a job.

 

No. 

[lcoontz 3]

I received alg1 after having worked on a company that was tied to my blue card for 22 months. This forum was helpful for me in preparing for the process but it turned out to be easier than expected (I always had the proper documentation and had basic german speaking ability) I went to the auslandebehorde in Berlin at Kepplerstrasse without an appointment (was difficult to convince the front door security to let me in but just be adamant and go to the top floor and get a waiting number) to report that I lost my job and I brought with me a letter from my company that stated I was fired. They printed a new green slip (you must bring your blue card and the green slip both!) to indicate that I was not anymore with my old company and seemed to be pretty understanding of my situation. When I asked how long I have to find a job, they said I might receive a notice from them after 3 months to come in and interview with them about my job search. Then I finished applied for ALG 1 (make sure to register with them as soon as you know you will lose your job, you can do it online.) and had no problems. At the arbeitsagentur, I got a rep that spoke english once, and the other times I needed my gf who speaks fluent german to come with (I don't recommend trying without at least a A2 level of german). It really helps to speak german through all this process. I got approx 1/2 of the time I worked offered for my ALG 1 time but I was able to find a new job in less time. I only needed to meet with my unemployment counselor 1 time in 3 months. When I got a new contract offered to me, I took my new contract back to the auslandebehorde and they updated my green slip to the new company name. All in all, hardest part was waking up early to arrive at the auslandebehorde office by 6am to avoid queuing and improving my basic german language skills.

[ToniMasvidal 9]

What is important is the eligibility. Those affected must have completed the so-called qualifying period in order to receive ALG 1 benefits. If you were employed subject to compulsory insurance for at least twelve months within the framework period of two years before becoming unemployed, you are entitled to ALG1.

For more informaiton on ALG1 or ALG2 you can look on:  https://www.hartz4.org/arbeitslosengeld-1/