Divorce and one spouse wanting to relocate: what's permitted?

23 posts in this topic

Hi. I am British, my wife is German and we live just outside Berlin. Unfortunately, she's threatening to leave me and take the kids with her and relocate back to the middle of nowhere in Saxony to be near her parents. I really hope we can work things out but if we separate, then is she just allowed move anywhere she wants within Germany? That would be a 3 and a half hour one way drive and it's not like I could pop around to pick them up on a friday and drop them back home so easily on a Sunday evening. 

 

Does anyone have any information on such a scenario? Any useful information would be greatly appreciated.

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I'm a bit confused, are you married to her at the moment, or are you both officially divorced?

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I am also confused, he says he is British but if you look at his profile he claims to be American.

 

Back on topic, I think she can threaten and do what she likes.

 

Maybe you should contact a lawyer.

 

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This just happened to a friend of ours. Do not let her move out with the kids. I do not care what your job is like. Get a lawyer immediately and get a custody arrangement in place for the trennungsjahr. If you let her move out with the kids, it sets a precedent for the court that will be taken into consideration, e.g., you were willing to do this then and not now.

 

Lawyer. Lawyer. Lawyer.

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Checking online sources, your wife is not breaking any law by moving elsewhere, even though both of you may have taken up the Sorgerecht for the kid.

You need a rechtsanwalt if you really want to fight this out.

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I think you have to be careful here. If there is a chance you can be together you should try to grasp it.

If you  involve lawyers then that could really freak her out. 

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23 minutes ago, Krusty the clown said:

We are married. What kind of lawyer should I look for. 

 

12 minutes ago, Erdmann said:

Checking online sources, your wife is not breaking any law by moving elsewhere, even though both of you may have taken up the Sorgerecht for the kid.

You need a rechtsanwalt if you really want to fight this out.

 

Sorry, my bad. You both are still together.

Then take up counselling or do something every normal couple does - talk it out.

 

Lawyer is last resort. Don't scare her with lawyers from the start.

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1 hour ago, Krusty the clown said:

We are married. What kind of lawyer should I look for. 

 

A divorce lawyer.

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4 hours ago, Krusty the clown said:

Hi. I am British, my wife is German and we live just outside Berlin. Unfortunately, she's threatening to leave me and take the kids with her and relocate back to the middle of nowhere in Saxony to be near her parents. I really hope we can work things out but if we separate, then is she just allowed move anywhere she wants within Germany? That would be a 3 and a half hour one way drive and it's not like I could pop around to pick them up on a friday and drop them back home so easily on a Sunday evening. 

 

Does anyone have any information on such a scenario? Any useful information would be greatly appreciated.

 

Get yourself a lawyer.  Once you have the custody issues clarified, I think it depends very much on the courts whether and how far they let her move with the kids (if she ends up getting custody).  I know of a case where a single mom wanted to move with her kids 300 km away because she wanted to be near her parents as well as she could get a job whereas she was living on benefits in the current town.  The father of one of her children put in a complaint and said that he would not be able to exercise his visitation rights of a couple of hours of supervised visits every 2 weeks if she moved that far away.  The courts agreed with him and told her that she can move no further than 100 km away.  

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8 hours ago, AlexTr said:

A divorce lawyer.

In German: Fachanwalt für Familienrecht

You might want to consider going for mediation together with your wife rather than turning to a lawyer in the first place.

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6 hours ago, LeonG said:

 The father of one of her children put in a complaint and said that he would not be able to exercise his visitation rights of a couple of hours of supervised visits every 2 weeks if she moved that far away.  The courts agreed with him and told her that she can move no further than 100 km away.  

I heard of a case where the court thought otherwise. One parent in Berlin and the other in Gemünden am Main (about 600 km apart) seemed doable to the judge. I guess it depends on the circumstances of the individual case rather than some standard rule.

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1 hour ago, jeba said:

I heard of a case where the court thought otherwise. One parent in Berlin and the other in Gemünden am Main (about 600 km apart) seemed doable to the judge. I guess it depends on the circumstances of the individual case rather than some standard rule.

 

Yes, like I said, it depends very much on the courts / judges.  There are no specific rules.

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Why do you only want the kids at the weekend (i.e. why are you by default assuming she should have the kids more than you)

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She's threatening to leave and take his kids with her and people are telling him not to get a lawyer yet because it might upset her?

 

I have known couples who have to meet halfway to collect/deliver kids when there is some distance

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It can also depend on the kids, on their ages (and which parent is then regarded as the "Hauptbezugsperson" - more usually the mother if the children are pre-school age) and whether they're at school etc. Keep calm, maintain communication channels as far as possible and don't do anything rash. Good luck!

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Can anyone recommend to him somewhere specific to go for the possible mediation, and give an idea of costs - does a family centre of any kind do it cheaper etc? - working it out must surely be the first priority.

 

OP, from reading threads on this subject on TT over a few years, there does seem to be a massive imbalance between the outcome for the German parent and the foreigner. With that in mind, I would find a divorce lawyer or other source of information and ask about your rights and best outcomes for the family as a whole, so that if things do suddenly get ugly you are not clueless and vulnerable, but I think I would not tell her about it unless/until it became necessary, since that will obviously up the anti. Maybe do a search on here and read some of the other people's experiences for yourself.

 

Would your job allow you to relocate at all? If you could work in a place nearer her family home then maybe a lot of the tension you currently have would be lessened anyway, and it would show that you are prepared to make a big change for the sake of her happiness. Obviously we don't know what the issues are and that might be a crap idea...

 

Good luck, I hope you can work it out.

 

  

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Go to a lawyer to get information on your rights and to get an idea of what could happen and how it could pan out.

Your wife does not have to know about this, the lawyer is not going to call her up.

 

Having said that, the lawyer may ask for information such as joint sorgerecht etc, you suddenly asking her if you have that may tip her off. However if you do nothing you ma ynot be able to see your kids.

 

Further thoughts, would you be willing to move with them (is a persona choice, I would not be willing to move to where my gf is from - had that discussion, answer was no).

Is she leaving you or the area (as in, no longer wants to be with you or just hates Berlin/area and wants to head back home), why?

 

You my also need to look in to why, maybe you know, maybe you don't (maybe I missed it on the thread).

 

First step, lawyer.

 

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So the good news in Germany is that you both have equal say over what is best for the kids, regardless of who the kids live with unless one parent takes the other to court to file for the full sorgerecht.  It's not like America where the parent who spends the most time with the kids gets to make all of the decisions for the kids.

 

You can't stop her from moving out and from moving wherever she wants to go, but you can fight whether the kids join her or not.  In America, you can often prevent the children from leaving the state (especially permanently), but I don't know if it's the same in Germany.  I do know you can prevent the children from leaving the country though, so this might be a bad thing for you.. I'm going through a divorce and it's still up for debate whether I can take my kids to America even for 3 weeks on vacation.

 

I'd agree with others advice.. get a lawyer to get information.  It might cost a couple hundred euros to meet with one to understand your rights, but then you could have a plan in place for if anything actually started happening.  You don't need to tell her because it would probably just cause more problems, but you should be prepared and protect yourself.

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