Can I refuse a Reha?

81 posts in this topic

Hello everybody, I am a new guy and I enjoy read all the posts here because I can know more about how to survive in Germany. However, I met a big problem this week, can anybody help me and give me some advice?

I am living in stuttgart. I am a simply and easy person with an Asian face and a British Nationality.

I have had an intervertebral disc with 3mm protruding for 2 years. I haven't had a surgery.
After struggling for 2 years,  I am feeling better now but I can only lift up weight of 2.5.kg with no pain.
I have a part-time job (but not a mini-job ) and my boss told me to call him after Reha if I could get back to work.

In these three days at the Reha the doctors kept saying that I had told them I could handle 5 kg, not 2.5 kg and they were sure that I had actually no pain and I could handle 10 kg.
Today is the third day. The woman who did the "MBOR Eingangsfähigkeitsprofil" with me forced me to carry the weight that I could not handle (totally 7kg). In the 30 minutes she kept said that I could do it and I were just scary. When I told her it's enough, I felt my legs numb.  She said," I'm not forced you to do so, but it's not sharp pain, right? So, keep going.."  One of the therapists was passing by and said to her," She is already doing her best!" But it helped nothing. After that her conclusion is : I can carry 7kg without any problems.
Now, I am at home. My back is painful again and my soles of feet feel numb. I feel so frustrated. Hearing the annoying loud noise from my non-stop speaking old neighbour I typed this message and I cried. It seems I have fought all the difficulties here for 3 years in vain. It seems no more good people in my world. Maybe it's not suitable for me a soft person to live in this world anymore...

 

My question is : can I simply quit the Reha without any drawback? (I'm not able to afford a lawyer.)

 

If you're reading this post and you don't have any advice but you are interested in saving a soul, please say something to me. I'm totally collapsed. 
Just let me know if there are still good humans in this world. Thank you very much T^T
 

 

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You probably can. After all a Reha isn't a prison. However, I'd call my health insurance first and check whether there would be financial repercussions (even though I doubt it) and what they suggest. Maybe you can do your Reha elsewhere or at least ask for somebody else to treat you. Even if not, simply put your foot down  and don't let yourself be pressured into doing things which cause you pain. They are there to help you, it's not as if you had to follow orders like a soldier.

From a medical perspective doing a Reha is a good thing - you'd do yourself a disfavour if you dropped out. Just continue at your own pace.

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My job used to be organising Rehas in a hospital. You can break off a Reha at any time without financial repurcussions. The insurance company will be glad they don't have to pay. ANd the Reha clinics accept cancellations at any time, as they usually have waiting lists and can easily fill vacated beds -- it's not like a hotel where you have to pay for the time you booked. At least that is my personal experience. I used to cancel patients on the very day they were supposed to start their reha.. Just try to get the right treatment if you do break off -- your health is important. Still, discuss it with the clinic and the health insurance in advance just to be sure,

The hospital or doctor that applied for the Reha should have noticed that you are not yet "rehafähig". To be rehafähig you must be "vollbelastbar", ie you can manage certain weights, can care for yourself, etc.

You can probably do the Reha later.

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You have already starterd the Reha treatment so it isn’t about refusing a Reha it is about breaking off the treatment which is a different thing altogether. You said you  are now at home. Are you doing a sort of ambulant Reha where you are picked up in the morning and brought home in the evening?

 

I  went to a Reha after having an operation and in the second week I was told I had to go to the fitness room. I didn't feel at all well but went along with it. When I returned to Stuttgart, I told my Doctor about this and he was very annoyed and said I should not have done these sorts of excercises.  

 

You should not be in pain after attending a Reha. Make an appointment with your Doctor as soon as possible and tell him sbout your pain and the things you are expected to do at the Reha. It may be possible to continue the therapy at another Reha. 

 

I hope you will soon be feeling better. 

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10 minutes ago, arunadasi said:

. To be rehafähig you must be "vollbelastbar", ie you can manage certain weights, can care for yourself, etc.

" Vollbelastbar" is asking too much for being rehafähig. If you were you wouldn't need a Reba anymore as this is the final goal. But nevertheless asking for a second opinion whether you are indeed rehafähig seems like a good idea ( and I think you are entitled to it).

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29 minutes ago, jeba said:

You probably can. After all a Reha isn't a prison. However, I'd call my health insurance first and check whether there would be financial repercussions (even though I doubt it) and what they suggest. Maybe you can do your Reha elsewhere or at least ask for somebody else to treat you. Even if not, simply put your foot down  and don't let yourself be pressured into doing things which cause you pain. They are there to help you, it's not as if you had to follow orders like a soldier.

From a medical perspective doing a Reha is a good thing - you'd do yourself a disfavour if you dropped out. Just continue at your own pace.

29 minutes ago, jeba said:

Thank you very much to let me know this TT

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Thank you very much, jeba, runadasi and White Rose of Yorkshire.
Thank you very much for all the advice which are really important to me.

And the most importantly, thank you very much for treating a strange like me so good... TT
I will try to contact my insurance and doctor tomorrow.

 

Btw, tomorrow there is an arrangement in Reha called "Vorstellung beim Chefarzt". Is it useful to tell him about it or it is better for me  to go to my doctor and insurance company first?

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29 minutes ago, White Rose of Yorkshire said:

You have already starterd the Reha treatment so it isn’t about refusing a Reha it is about breaking off the treatment which is a different thing altogether. You said you  are now at home. Are you doing a sort of ambulant Reha where you are picked up in the morning and brought home in the evening?

 

I  went to a Reha after having an operation and in the second week I was told I had to go to the fitness room. I didn't feel at all well but went along with it. When I returned to Stuttgart, I told my Doctor about this and he was very annoyed and said I should not have done these sorts of excercises.  

 

You should not be in pain after attending a Reha. Make an appointment with your Doctor as soon as possible and tell him sbout your pain and the things you are expected to do at the Reha. It may be possible to continue the therapy at another Reha. 

 

I hope you will soon be feeling better. 

Yes, I am doing an ambulant Reha. On the 1st day  the doctor blamed me why I had not done a surgery and kept taking money from insurance and social benefits (SGB III) as well. He said I could not say," Nach dem Unfall" because there was no accident having happened to me. It really hurt because I must be the 1st person who didn't want this to happen...

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Definitely talk to your insurance company and also to a doctor you feel you can trust - not all of them are so insensitive, but doctors here simply do not have the same kind of bedside manner as those in Britain.

Much of it is simply down to cultural difference, but some are just animals, who seem to like seeing people suffer!

 

I know it's easy to say, but try not to let this get you down - life really will pick up again once you are feeling better!

 

If you would care to mention which part of Germany you are in, maybe you could find a freindly TTer in your region to chat with, and let off some steam...(just a thought, and not meaning to pry, y'know?)

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10 minutes ago, IML said:

On the 1st day  the doctor blamed me why I had not done a surgery and kept taking money from insurance and social benefits (SGB III) as well. He said I could not say," Nach dem Unfall" because there was no accident having happened to me.

 

You need a new doctor. Was this your Hausarzt or a doc at the Reha?

 

With your pain, you need to consult a neurosurgeon (I don't let orthopods mess with my spine) to ask for treatment which doesn't mean surgery. A good one will refer you to a good Krankengymnastic that won't force you to do things that you can't.

 

You are simply getting lousy treatment and you need to find some new doctors. Did your boss choose your doctor or reha?

 

Do let us know where you are.

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47 minutes ago, jeba said:

" Vollbelastbar" is asking too much for being rehafähig. If you were you wouldn't need a Reba anymore as this is the final goal. But nevertheless asking for a second opinion whether you are indeed rehafähig seems like a good idea ( and I think you are entitled to it).

 

The Rehas I did were for endoprosthetics -- knee and hip replacements -- and for those you do have to be vollbelastbar. It might be different for other treatments but generally all treatment has to be finished and it's just a matter of getting back to full function. I've no experience for this poster's diagnosis.

God it seems like ages ago even though it's just two weeks! 

 

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@ Arunadasi - I believe the joint has to be "vollbelastbar" and not the person, which makes a huge difference!

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8 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

 

You need a new doctor. Was this your Hausarzt or a doc at the Reha?

 

With your pain, you need to consult a neurosurgeon (I don't let orthopods mess with my spine) to ask for treatment which doesn't mean surgery. A good one will refer you to a good Krankengymnastic that won't force you to do things that you can't.

 

You are simply getting lousy treatment and you need to find some new doctors. Did your boss choose your doctor or reha?

 

Do let us know where you are.

This is the doctor at the Reha T^T and the Reha is chosen by the Rentenversichung T^T 

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If you are in Munich, I can PM you some suggestions that will be covered by your public insurance.

 

When is the last time you had an MRT of your spine?

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31 minutes ago, IML said:

 the doctor blamed me why I had not done a surgery and kept taking money from insurance and social benefits (SGB III) as well. He said I could not say," Nach dem Unfall" because there was no accident having happened to me. It really hurt because I must be the 1st person who didn't want this to happen...

Well, if there was no accident what´s wrong with him stating that you can´t say "after the accident"? Also, when you say he "blamed" you it seems likely that he didn´t regard his remark as blaming you but merely asking. I smell cultural differences. It seems to me that when applying a German yardstick you´re very sensitive.

But be that as it may. Don´t rely on medical advice by strangers who don´t know anything about your case and aren´t medical professionals anyway. Tell the Chefarzt you feel the exercises you did were too much and caused pain / numbness and see what his reaction is. If you then feel you can´t trust him you can still see someone else.

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I can only speak from my point of view. Last year when I had a heart attack I was really low on confidence and felt how could this happen to me. I wanted to be locked up from the world. I went to rehab and they put me on a bike . So I started cycling like a 85 year old. The instructer said you call this cycling. The instructer told me to stop taking the piss and cycle properly. A year on from a heart attack I realise that the major battle was not with my heart but was with my mind. I don't know you or your history but I would find out where your battle lies.

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Apples and oranges, RF, although your experience is very important and can help many in different circumstances.

 

The tricky thing with chronic and serious back pain is finding the right doctors and treatment for each individual case. Even if one is sent to Krankengymnastic, if the therapist there doesn't ask to see one's pictures (xrays, CRT, MRT), I consider them unqualified. Whether before or after surgery. Either that or they start slowly and ask a lot of questions and actually listen.

 

 

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6 minutes ago, fraufruit said:

if the therapist there doesn't ask to see one's pictures (xrays, CRT, MRT), I consider them unqualified

That doesn't mean he is unqualified though. Krankengymnasts don't usually get to see xrays etc. of outdoor patients. I had a thoracic discus prolapse (which is rare) myself and my Krankengymnast diagnosed it without any MRI or whatever. Just with his hands.

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8 minutes ago, RenegadeFurther said:

Where would you have him collapse? At home with no help or with medical advice at a rehab. 

 

If you are asking me re RF, Hell no. Himself also went straight to a 3 wk. rehab after his heart attack. They exercised moderately and learned how to eat properly. There was also counseling for all of their emotions as RF alluded to. Huge life change.

 

Going to rehab for chronic back pain isn't so life threatening and one shouldn't be bullied or tortured while there.

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