Brexit: The fallout

17,591 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, cb6dba said:

Yep, any politician that knew the goal was to come out of the customs union and knew the risks that would bring to NI is complicit. Any that lied to just get the whole thing done, also complicit. 

As brexit wasn't defined, we could also argue that no one knew exactly what they were voting for. This issue alone proves that, or did anyone vote for a border between the north and south?

 

 

Isn`t the biggest party in NI the DUP (in terms of Westminster seats) and didn`t they campaign for Brexit?

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7 minutes ago, RenegadeFurther said:

Isn`t the biggest party in NI the DUP (in terms of Westminster seats) and didn`t they campaign for Brexit?

Yes crazily enough. However, they did not have an overall majority, and the other parties with MPs at the time of the vote all campaigned to remain (including the Ulster Unionists).

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Brexit really is fucking mess..

 

Client ordered a skyQ system in January...   It's sat in customs until this week when it was finally delivered...

 

In the meantime, new system was sent via different courier and it was delivered in 3 weeks

 

 

So, Anyone up for a new SkyQ system?    :lol:

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In a nutshell, I think the N. Ireland 'problem'  is due to there being a Hard Brexit i.e. coming out of the Single Market and the customs union.  If the UK had stayed in both, as was suggested by various Brexiteers in the Referendum, then all the issues about where to have the border between the 2 customs regimes would not have arisen. If the UK is out of both, then there has to be a border somewhere. 

 

Whatever you think of Boris and his pals, they are not stupid, so they must have taken a calculated risk. Boris' big priority was to Get Brexit Done. That's what got him his majority. Why the DUP went along with the NI arrangements is a mystery to me. Can only assume Boris or his pals convinced them it would work out fine. Its being unnecessarily provocative to talk about Brexit voters having blood on their hands. The NI issue was just not very high on their agenda, and they probably thought it was all part of 'project fear', such is how the Brexit media manipulated the debate.  

 

No doubt the Government will end up blaming the EU for the current situation (they have nowhere else to go), but ultimately there are only 2 ways the fundamental problem can be solved.  Either the Republic leaves the EU (which some Brexiteers are cheeky enough to suggest), or the UK re-negotiates to stay in the Single Market and customs union, similar to Switzerland or Norway. The latter would be entirely consistent with the Referendum result, although Brexiteers are probably not honest enough to admit it. 

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, theGman said:

Yes, exactly! Brexit as we, the voters and the campaigners mostly understood it was for not coming out of the single market or customs union, NI wasn't, in principle, at risk. This all come afterwards. There was an inherent risk, because Brexit wasn't officially defined and nobody knew for sure what it would end up but, I would argue that, at the time, those risks to Ireland were seen and understood to be small.

It was arrogance that people thought  the problems to Ireland were small.

People knew if we withdrew from the customs union that a border would be needed,yet people once again believed the UK was special and would be exempt from any sort of border.

Basically many of the hard Brexiteers believed the EU would come crawling on their knees to the UK.

 

4 hours ago, theGman said:

Now we know that the ERG types were lying through their teeth and they wanted are harder Brexit all along.

Sorry but it was known all along that a hard Brexit was wanted by the people behind the Brexit vote.

 

Blood on their hands is harsh but the responsibility for the problems lies with everyone that voted for Brexit.

I also believe that many of them don´t care anyway and would still vote exactly the same way now and the problems wouldn´t even make them think twice.

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Keleth said:

 

Blood on their hands is harsh but the responsibility for the problems lies with everyone that voted for Brexit.

I also believe that many of them don´t care anyway and would still vote exactly the same way now and the problems wouldn´t even make them think twice.

 

 

When you go to vote, do you remember every single point in the manifesto of the party you are going to vote for?

 

A deal could have been made which stopped certain freedom of movement and allowed access to the internal EU markets but the EU made it very clear freedom of movement was not up for debate.

 

The UK had its red lines but so did the EU. 

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39 minutes ago, RenegadeFurther said:

 

When you go to vote, do you remember every single point in the manifesto of the party you are going to vote for?

 

A deal could have been made which stopped certain freedom of movement and allowed access to the internal EU markets but the EU made it very clear freedom of movement was not up for debate.

 

The UK had its red lines but so did the EU. 

 

Yes, the Single Market is about free movement of people as it is about freeing up the movement of goods, services and capital.  The idea is people move to where the jobs are, so its a genuine market.  I still don't see what the problem with it is. If the worry is that migrants are a burden on the state, there are rules to prevent people just turning up and signing on for benefits.  

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21 minutes ago, RenegadeFurther said:

Another question, wasn`t it the EU`s decision to put a border across the Irish Sea?

 

How would it be possible for the EU to do that?

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gammon.jpg.e9a9ceefd2ffc0be3b03f35816327

UKIP’s Mayoral candidate is called Peter Gammons and people can’t quite believe it’s not satire.

 

Gammons, who is described on the UKIP website as an “internationally respected motivational speaker and an award-winning and best-selling author”, was selected as the party’s candidate in November last year.

 

But he was trending on Twitter again today as the candidates gear up for the election later this year, with users besides themselves over the fact that a pejorative term for a right-wing politician has become a reality.

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On 4/15/2021, 4:47:14, RenegadeFurther said:

When you go to vote, do you remember every single point in the manifesto of the party you are going to vote for?

See the big difference when you vote in a GE or local election you have the chance in 4 or 5 years to maybe vote for the other party and hopefully change what happened the last time.

However the Brexit vote was not like this as it was a one and done vote so in this respect yes people should have thought of all the consequences.

On 4/15/2021, 4:47:14, RenegadeFurther said:

A deal could have been made which stopped certain freedom of movement and allowed access to the internal EU markets but the EU made it very clear freedom of movement was not up for debate.

 

The UK had its red lines but so did the EU. 

Ah you´re one of the it´s all the EUs fault people.

You expected the EU to give access to its markets but also to close off FoM.

The usual arrogant they need us more than we need them argument you see coming from pro Brexit people.

You may say well the EU could see the trouble it would lead to in NI but there again so could the UK and it´s their country ffs so they should be a lot more worried and make more concessions than the EU.

Would you accept open markets in exchange for FoM ?

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On 4/15/2021, 7:29:38, RenegadeFurther said:

Another question, wasn`t it the EU`s decision to put a border across the Irish Sea?

So you´d be happy to see borderless countries including the UK ?

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9 hours ago, Keleth said:

So you´d be happy to see borderless countries including the UK ?

 

I am not going to have a debate with you until you get help with your anger management issues.

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I often Google Brexit to check the latest news. Imagine my surprise when today I saw an article in the Daily Express that sounded remarkably similar to something I remember happening a good while back.

 

It was no coincidence because the Express simply recycled the entire story from 4 years ago to fire up their idiot readership, knowing that most of them have the memories of goldfish:

 

"Mr Jensen had spoken to the media after his initial speech in June 2017 and continued his onslaught"

 

The above line was towards the end of the piece. Express Readers can't read that far down in one sitting so they know they can hide the facts down there all safe and sound.

 

https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/1425258/brexit-news-eu-trade-deal-denmark-uk-small-nation-fishing-quotas-british-waters

 

You have to have some neck to report a story that's 4 years old as if it's current affairs. It's pure propaganda. 

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21 hours ago, RenegadeFurther said:

 

I am not going to have a debate with you until you get help with your anger management issues.

You won´t because you can´t,you´re an empty vessel who spouts "facts" they have read in the Express or Mail.But really doesn`t have a clue on what they´re actually speaking about but slavishly follows their opinion even if it is an opinion formed by total bullshit.

 

I mean look at this...

 

On 4/15/2021, 4:47:14, RenegadeFurther said:

A deal could have been made which stopped certain freedom of movement and allowed access to the internal EU markets but the EU made it very clear freedom of movement was not up for debate.

Nothing about what would have been involved but merely a statement trying to dump the blame on the EU.

 

Then this...

On 4/15/2021, 7:29:38, RenegadeFurther said:

Another question, wasn`t it the EU`s decision to put a border across the Irish Sea?

I mean ffs you´re trying to argue it is the EUs fault yet you don´t even know the basic facts behind it.

 

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2 hours ago, Keleth said:

You won´t because you can´t,you´re an empty vessel who spouts "facts" they have read in the Express or Mail.But really doesn`t have a clue on what they´re actually speaking about but slavishly follows their opinion even if it is an opinion formed by total bullshit.

 

I mean look at this...

 

Nothing about what would have been involved but merely a statement trying to dump the blame on the EU.

 

Then this...

I mean ffs you´re trying to argue it is the EUs fault yet you don´t even know the basic facts behind it.

 

 

There you go again, ranting and raving like some nutcase.

 

Who am I to stop you.

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Circling back on this.   Pound seems to be climbing against the Euro.   

 

When can i go into vulture mode on British assets, @murphaph ?   I was promised disaster capitalism opportunities.   🤡

 

 

Screenshot 2021-04-20 at 14.52.36.png

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