Truck-driven terror attack at Berlin Christmas market

499 posts in this topic

7 hours ago, catjones said:

 

You certainly stirred my soul with your impassioned speech.  Words are cheap.  What, exactly is the part you're playing in defeating this enemy?  Enlist in the army?  Join the police?  Spy on your neighbor?  Run for government office?  Or, as a french bean, wilt in despair?

During the 70's and 80's Britain had to deal with weekly bombings and shootings by the IRA. Everyone became security conscious, suspicious packages were reported and dealt with. The British government brought in internment to try and control the violence, it wasn't the best policy but it was something. As for spying on neighbours, grow up. That happens all the time and with the islamists that is what is needed. How many times have we heard of the Police getting a tip off from an asylum seeker or a neighbour. Emlisting in the army won't actually help because we are not fighting a conventional enemy. Armies are only really good in conventional conflicts. The best defence is vigilnce and not allowing asylum seekers into the country in the first place, we can do the first but it's too late for the second.

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Yes - you are the only one.

 

There is nothing funny about mass murder.
Terrorists won't stop to check your nationality before killing.

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3 minutes ago, PeterN said:

Yes - you are the only one.

 

There is nothing funny about mass murder.
Terrorists won't stop to check your nationality before killing.

 

Come off it. I am not laughing at mass murder and you know that. 

 

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29 minutes ago, NathanInGermany said:

Am I the only one laughing my arse off at these immigrants complaining about immigrants? 

 

 

A bit like the amount of immigrants in the UK that voted for Brexit out of fear of ..... immigration.

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15 minutes ago, NathanInGermany said:

 

Come off it. I am not laughing at mass murder and you know that. 

 

Eh ... no, it doesn't look like that.

Your post just hooped ALL immigrants into one big indiscriminate mass and insinuated that any of us could be a terrorist.

 

How you failed to see that we discuss a certain kind here is a mystery for me, Nathan.

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41 minutes ago, French bean said:

During the 70's and 80's Britain had to deal with weekly bombings and shootings by the IRA. Everyone became security conscious, suspicious packages were reported and dealt with. The British government brought in internment to try and control the violence, it wasn't the best policy but it was something. As for spying on neighbours, grow up. That happens all the time and with the islamists that is what is needed. How many times have we heard of the Police getting a tip off from an asylum seeker or a neighbour. Emlisting in the army won't actually help because we are not fighting a conventional enemy. Armies are only really good in conventional conflicts. The best defence is vigilnce and not allowing asylum seekers into the country in the first place, we can do the first but it's too late for the second.

I'm Irish , it doesn't make me any more qualified but internment was a huge recruiting tool for the IRA. Scoop up lots of innocent catholic northern people, deprive them of their freedom and mix them in with a good sprinkling of active IRA members and you have one hell of a mess. You did say it wasn't the best policy, o.k. 
What really helped was containment, using  a lot of low level and high level informants and intelligence to find out who the people are and often was the case, they knew when a lot of operations were going down. I always give the British army/politicions a lot of credit for not using a much heavier hand in dealing with Northern Ireland and dragging the south into a wider conflict in the north. I'm not painting them as innocent darlings and i'm from deep south Ireland but the north never slipped into a Mosul or Aleppo. Things like one Island rugby team are a big help in bringing two communities toegther, wish it was the same for soccer. Education and job opportunities help to keep people grounded and reasonably happy. take that away , marganilise people and communities, label them and you are planting the seeds of divisioin, exploitation  and so on. Yes we should be viligant but carefult with that fishing net. 

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padjo, although I agree that human intelligence is priceless in these matters, there's a huge difference here between an indigenous population, as was the case in Northern Ireland, and migrants whose identities are unknown, most of whom are not genuine asylum seekers, or have already been rejected for asylum, and that's even before taking the political context of NI and its history into account. There has to be some form of control, especially since it is no secret that there are terrorists and both violent and petty criminals among the migrants. This is why I have suggested having asylum requests processed in nearby safe countries in their regions rather than giving terrorists and criminals free rein to roam around at will and collect benefits under multiple identities. This solution protects genuine asylum seekers, who would then be flown to the country providing them asylum, and eliminates the problems that result from a lack of compliance on the part of rejected asylum seekers/illegal entrants and the countries unwilling to take back their citizens who are in Germany illegally yet are still willing to take development aid paid for by the taxpayers. 

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Conquistador, by and large i agree with you. Gathering intelligene in Northern Irelad was by no means easy (not that you imply it was) and was a long evolving learning process, everybody knew everybody, your name and accent gave you away. yes race and language makes it even harder but the game is the same, find people who will give up good information for money/beleif/you got something on them, use electronic survellience as so on. We definately need something akin to that. I bet the British were the best in the world at it at the time. I wouldn't be against the Israeli's being far ahead now.  Use that to target faster deportations and you have faith restored in the system and also more goodwill towards impoverished and people arriving from devestation.  I think Germany took in 1 million people this year or last . Ireland took in much less proportionately, same for most other eu contries
http://www.thejournal.ie/ireland-asylum-refugee-status-compared-to-rest-of-world-2310580-Sep2015/  shame on them. they could have spread the burden. 

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12 minutes ago, padjo said:

 Gathering intelligene in Northern Irelad was by no means easy (not that you imply it was) and was a long evolving learning process, everybody knew everybody, your name and accent gave you away. yes race and language makes it even harder but the game is the same, find people who will give up good information for money/beleif/you got something on them, use electronic survellience as so on. We definately need something akin to that. I bet the British were the best in the world at it at the time. I wouldn't be against the Israeli's being far ahead now. 

I remember in the 80's being told that the intelligence services could even say what sofa a suspect had bought and where, this was before IT, barcodes and electronic purchasing, I think after the London bombings the UK security forces recognised a lack of intelligence gathering amongst minority groups in Britain and went on a recruitment drive to recruit more muslims and other minorities. We won't know for sure if this has worked but the UK seems to be pretty succesful at taking out suspects before they do something. The old saying still applies, terrorists only have to be succesful once whereas the police have to be succesful everytime to prevent an attack. Trouble is it takes time to build up that level of intelligence gathering and with the refugees coming from so many different countries and being mobile it will make the task even harder. Conquistador has the right idea but unfortunately it's too late for that and there will be very few countries willing to set up processing centres to protect Europe.

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Guys,

This was a nice article on how British Intelligence learned the lessons from London Bombings. Earlier all of them used to work in Silos and they changed the whole process. This was not done overnight, but this is something which is required in Europe. All countries Intelligence should work in a coordinated way to remove these bastards.

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-36803542

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Dashcam shows truck speed into Berlin Christmas Market

 

The video, obtained exclusively by Reuters, was taken by a taxi driver who was waiting for customers just outside the Christmas market at the Kaiser Wilhelm memorial church.

In the video, the truck is seen speeding from left to right into Breitscheidplatz, where the Christmas market is at the foot of the church. People come running out from the direction of the market shortly after the truck speeds into the square.

 

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Another piece of human garbage is gone.  (No thanks to the German Police or Merkel)

 

Berlin Attack Suspect Shot Dead

The man suspected of the truck attack on a Christmas market in Berlin has been killed in a shootout in Milan, Italy’s top security official said. 12 minutes ago (New York Times)

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1 hour ago, VickyMunich said:

Guys,

This was a nice article on how British Intelligence learned the lessons from London Bombings. Earlier all of them used to work in Silos and they changed the whole process. This was not done overnight, but this is something which is required in Europe. All countries Intelligence should work in a coordinated way to remove these bastards.

 

http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-36803542

Yep, one cannot deny they are doing a good job. London is #1 target in Europe, plus there large risk groups residing there.

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4 hours ago, klubbnika said:

Eh ... no, it doesn't look like that.

Your post just hooped ALL immigrants into one big indiscriminate mass and insinuated that any of us could be a terrorist.

 

That is what people here are doing. The majority of attackers are from the EU. There is nothing that immigration control can do about it. Saying that we need to implement policies that will harm 10000s of people is completely uncalled for.  In Berlin a crazy guy stole a truck. It isn't exactly a well organised military coup. Anyone with a tourist visa could do this. 

 

You are right that terrorists tend to come from Arabic speaking countries,  rather than English speaking ones,  and this is used to discriminate against them as being potential terrorists. Luckily for people on this board Germans don't tend to think of the harm our nations have done to Germany. UK - half of us (not just 0.0001% as is case with terrorist) harmed Germany by voting against the EU. The economic repercussions for Germany and the rest of the EU will be significant.The US - responsible for mass surveillance of every communication in Germany with no consequence whatsoever.  Maybe we should be the ones that should be blocked for entering? The lack of empathy from one group of immigrants for another is absolutely astounding.  Can't people get it that generally if you move to a country with your family it is for a better life and has nothing to do with wanting to wipe out the local populace and establish your own laws.  Come on - they are us!!!!! 

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1 minute ago, NathanInGermany said:

 

.  Can't people get it that generally if you move to a country with your family it is for a better life and has nothing to do with wanting to wipe out the local populace and establish your own laws.  Come on - they are us!!!!! 

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Rise in Shariah law,

Rise in attacks on women.

Refusal by some to intergrate and accept German laws and culture.

Rise of ghettos and no go areas for the Police

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Just now, NathanInGermany said:

Saying that we need to implement policies that will harm 10000s of people is completely uncalled for.

How is it going to harm 10000 of people, in your opinion? Can it harm them more than the war they flee from?

 

1 minute ago, NathanInGermany said:

You are right that terrorists tend to come from Arabic speaking countries,

I didnt say terrorists tend to come from Arab-speaking countries.

I said that the terrorists mostly have the following characteritics:

 

- male

- "underaged" - 35

- originates from a Muslim country, (incl 2nd generaiton).

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5 minutes ago, klubbnika said:

How is it going to harm 10000 of people, in your opinion? Can it harm them more than the war they flee from?

 

 

No it we cant harm them more than the war they flee from. So what? The harm is not helping those that are fleeing from such horrors. We have a humanitarian responsibility to help and denying that by making immigration policies (largely ineffective ones I might add) based only on them being Muslim is absolutely disgusting. 

 

From my point of view I would rather Germany helps the massive amount of people fleeing from Syria and other war torn countries and 9 Germans die than refusing to help them at all. 

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18 minutes ago, NathanInGermany said:

 

 The lack of empathy from one group of immigrants for another is absolutely astounding. 

 

Nathan go back and read from over a year ago...No one has a problem with real refugees. As for the rest yes it is common for immigrants to not be please when other immigrants break the law to arrive in the county only to be given special treatment after we have all jumped through all the hoops. What most people have a problem with is the way in which the government has handled the situation. So you are all for open immigration? No more passports for anyone? Just wondering.

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