Truck-driven terror attack at Berlin Christmas market

499 posts in this topic

So what's the alternatives?

There was no open door policy prior to 9/11, no open door policy prior to 7/7, no open door policy prior to Paris yet terrorist attacks occurred so I wonder what the solution is to appease everyone.

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3 hours ago, bennetn said:

So what's the alternatives?

There was no open door policy prior to 9/11, no open door policy prior to 7/7, no open door policy prior to Paris yet terrorist attacks occurred so I wonder what the solution is to appease everyone.

 

Paris did have the open door policy.  But the alternative is that our governments do better at sharing information, that we have better communication between EU countries. And they also need to have better identity checks. We all hear "Oh we can't we can't" But why, in less then a day , has all this information about this guy come to light but they didn't have it before. Maybe if you "lost your papers" you need to stay in a facility until they can get some.

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2 hours ago, bennetn said:

So what's the alternatives?

There was no open door policy prior to 9/11, no open door policy prior to 7/7, no open door policy prior to Paris yet terrorist attacks occurred so I wonder what the solution is to appease everyone.

 

What you don`t do is stand at hbf`s blowing soap bubbles at random people.

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9 hours ago, RenegadeFurther said:

Do you offer anything to any debate other than name calling?

There is nothing even beginning to resemble a discussion, much less a debate, with the person you addressed, and she certainly isn't the arbiter of anything (despite appointing herself one in her alternate universe). For her, anything less than pure worship of the migrants as deities makes one a raging Nazi. Extremists like that emote, and usually rather crudely, rather than debating. Such people generally don't actually have any contact with the migrants, and they certainly won't admit that most of the migrants have not been honest about their identities, many are registered under multiple names, and that few are actually highly skilled people who will save Germany's public pension system (as if they care about some elderly Germans instead of their own extended families). The people who should be getting asylum im Germany are the ones who were actually persecuted, and in the Middle East, that's going to disproportionately be Christians or Kurds. 

 

Christmas markets are an integral part of German culture, and their targeting is just the latest indication that the Islamists want to destroy normal life and cultural expression. 

 

I agree wholeheartedly with program director that it's utterly ridiculuous that the current suspect has been able to roam freely in Germany for so long, even when he was known to the police and security services to be at least a potential terrorist and had been rejected for asylum. Add to that the fact that he served four years in jail in Italy prior to coming to Germany, and our politicians have a lot to answer for, especially when you consider the huge law enforcement resources that they have assigned to suppress criticism of the utterly failed open borders policy of Merkel's. Why in the world wasn't someone who served a four year jail sentence deported from Italy? 

 

 

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11 minutes ago, Conquistador said:

I agree wholeheartedly with program director that it's utterly ridiculuous that the current suspect has been able to roam freely in Germany for so long, even when he was known to the police and security services to be at least a potential terrorist and had been rejected for asylum. Add to that the fact that he served four years in jail in Italy prior to coming to Germany, and our politicians have a lot to answer for, especially when you consider the huge law enforcement resources that they have assigned to suppress criticism of the utterly failed open borders policy of Merkel's. Why in the world wasn't someone who served a four year jail sentence deported from Italy? 

 

 

The worst thing that he is not the only one. There is a system with asylum abuse which noone seems to want to deal with.

Their only answer is name-calling and, LOL!, negging. But then again, these people never appear to have any constructive suggestions, just slogans.

 

PS. Just wonder, how much resources the law enforcement put into chasing those who refuse to pay TV license... Didnt people go to jail for that? hmmmm...:unsure:

 

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7 hours ago, RenegadeFurther said:

Do you offer anything to any debate other than name calling?

actually it was jeremy doing the name calling.  i merely confirmed it.  pls work on the reading comprehension.

in a TT world of trolls and radical extremists (like yourself), i wouldn't sully the word "debate" to define your frothing rants. 

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28 minutes ago, catjones said:

in a TT world of trolls and radical extremists (like yourself), i wouldn't sully the word "debate" to define your frothing rants. 

 

What make you think I am that ?

 

If you are going to accuse me of that surely you must have some evidence to back it up.

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1 hour ago, klubbnika said:

The worst thing that he is not the only one. There is a system with asylum abuse which noone seems to want to deal with.

 

There are 549 Islamist Gefährder known to the BKA. About half are in Germany. 80 are in jail, but for how long, before they are let loose on the streets?

 

Quote

 

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1 hour ago, bramble said:

 

There are 549 Islamist Gefährder known to the BKA. About half are in Germany. 80 are in jail, but for how long, before they are let loose on the streets?

 

 

549?

 

7000 in Germany are on the list, according to the Daily Mail:

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4057824/Germany-7-000-terror-suspects-large-finding-impossible-monitor-former-UK-intelligence-chief-says.html

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Excellent points, French bean, absolutely accurate.

 

Just like in France, the security services are overstretched here in Germany. Rather than a few obligatory words from Merkel when scores of people are killed and wounded, I'd rather see some action taken to deport anyone who is so dangerous that they are being monitored, especially when they are a rejected asylum seeker or are otherwise here illegally. 

 

EDIT: It apparently takes 20 trained personnel to monitor a suspected terrorist around the clock, and costs a whole lot of money that I'd rather see spent on pensioners whose pensions are insufficient and on educating people. The best prevention is to keep the IS types out of Schengen and get them out of your country if they aren't a citizen. 

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2 minutes ago, Conquistador said:

Just like in France, the security services are overstretched here in Germany. Rather than a few obligatory words from Merkel when scores of people are killed and wounded, I'd rather see some action taken to deport anyone who is so dangerous that they are being monitored.

The problem apparently is that it is not so easy to deport them because the countries of their origin refuse to cooperate.

Apparently, Amri has Jemeni citizenship even though hs has been born and raised in Tunisia and all his family llive there.

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Why should Tunisia take back their citizens ? Tunisia is doing what all other countries are doing, finding ways to extract money from the EU.

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16 minutes ago, programdirector said:

 

The whole we can't deport them thing is something we are all fed for years. They could find a solution if they wanted. (They being government officials) All of a sudden his papers came through. Again hold then until they get papers. If you are a true refugee you would be ok with that (I would) if you are not then maybe you will think twice about coming. And I don't mean you have to hold them in some inhumane way, but they shouldn't be allowed to have free movement when they have no identity. Especially when they have already been refused asylum.

Amri could easily have been deported to Italy. They have a EU-wide dact DB and surely saw he applied for asylum in Italy (where he, btw, lied that he was underaged even though he was 19). Why they didnt do it is a mystery.

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12 minutes ago, klubbnika said:

Why they didnt do it is a mystery.

 

Because Germany scrapped the Dublin agreement. 

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1 minute ago, RenegadeFurther said:

 

Because Germany scrapped the Dublin agreement. 

Ok. But wasn't it only valid for first time asylum applicants without conviction?

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Good article from the  National Review Germany's No Go Zones

 

to quote

 

Tuesday’s atrocity highlights an aspect of the refugee crisis to which I have been trying to draw attention for over a year: The main threat posed by the West’s mass acceptance of immigrant populations from sharia cultures is not that some percentage of the migrants will be trained terrorists. It is that a much larger percentage of these populations is stubbornly resistant to assimilation. They are thus fortifying sharia enclaves throughout Europe. That is what fuels the jihad. It would be foolish to think it couldn’t happen here, too.

Read more at: http://www.nationalreview.com/article/443268/germany-islamist-enclaves-europe-jihad-terrorism-problem-growing

 

 

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4 hours ago, French bean said:

This is akin to being in a total war footing in that every member of the country and every part of the economy plays a part in defeating the enemy.

 

You certainly stirred my soul with your impassioned speech.  Words are cheap.  What, exactly is the part you're playing in defeating this enemy?  Enlist in the army?  Join the police?  Spy on your neighbor?  Run for government office?  Or, as a french bean, wilt in despair?

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I second program director's separating out from the general population proposal. Would at least reduce incentive to migrate here without a visa unless a real refugee.  

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