Posted 2 Nov 2016 Hello everybody, Yes! I know a couple threads were opend on the subject (I have searched TT and have read every single post before I have posted this) but I have a few questions focused on "big" renovation costs for an old house. The property in question: A detached house, 150sqm, 4 rooms, 2 floors and a keller, 60-70 years old. I have heard that replacing the complete wiring in the house should be around 10-15k euro, I have heard that replacing the complete plumbing will be another 10-15k euro, I have heard that replacing all of the floors (mainly parquet, minus the kitchen and bathroom) will be another 10-15k euro for quality material and work, complete painting a whole house should be around 5-10k euro depends on the size and work required. Heating system is around 25-35k euro to replace etc.. For those of you that did a renovation in recent years or know someone who did: Does all of those values are (approx.) correct ? too much? too less? One thing that nobody could answer was replacing a roof (in case it's leaking or very old and I want to completely refurbish the roof), how much approx is such job ? 10k ? 30k ? I am not looking for precise numbers (I know it's impossible to give) but a range.. Any information will be very much appreciated, Thanks in advance! 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 According to THIS website, you'll be looking around the 12 - 15k € mark for replacing your roof... obviously depends on the roof area, materials and the company you use (probably your location plays a role too). Incidentally, the same website has great approximate cost calculations for all of the things you've asked about. 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 With so little info given, then its hard to say what costs are involved.. It could even be that the property is a listed building and you cant do what you like to it.. Info please!! Links, Pictures etc etc.. 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 15 minutes ago, SpiderPig said: With so little info given, then its hard to say what costs are involved.. It could even be that the property is a listed building and you cant do what you like to it.. Info please!! Links, Pictures etc etc.. sorry, I have tried to write the "technical" info in my original post: A detached house, 150sqm, 4 rooms, 2 floors and a keller, 60-70 years old. Location: It is located in a town about an hour from Cologne. (the makler would not disclose the actual address before I sign the papers) I was not looking for 1:1 estimates because I know it's impossible, more like to get an idea if the estimates I've heard are anywhere from the truth. Thanks in advance 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 1 minute ago, dannys said: Location: It is located in a town about an hour from Cologne. (the makler would not disclose the actual address before I sign the papers) WTF??? Is this a lottery or a house purchase? 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 12 minutes ago, toBnruG said: WTF??? Is this a lottery or a house purchase? Lottery? sorry if I don't understand your humor.. A makler who does not have exclusivity on a specific property - usually advertise it with partial address, and will only give you the full address once you sign a contract that says that in case you end up buying the property, he gets his commission. dirty, but they do it 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 No.. He has seen the property on Immoscout.. ( I assume) If its sold through a Makler, then the Makler will only give the town... and the full adress once they have signed an agreement at a "Pub car park meet-up" Its just to cover the Maklers back etc! BTW... an hr from Köln could be in the wanky westerwald or a much nicer area towards AAchen... 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 So you're expected to buy a house sight unseen, no surveys, nothing? Personally I'd walk away without being able to view it, but that's just me. Ahh OK, I cross-posted. So you have to agree that if you buy it you do so from him and he gets his commission. So long as there's no commitment to buy at this stage then I'd say it's OK. 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 No... He is expected to sign a form that gives the makler his rights to his commission should you buy the house! No, not cross posted... I am on Moderator pre-view as I am a naughty boy!! 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 Of course "signing the contract" does not mean here you will necessarily end-up buying the house. Signing means that IF you end-up buying the house, the Makler can force you to pay him, so he feels safe and he will give you the address. I think you should not be afraid to "sign", you are not committing yourself to buy it after all... 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 Other interesting question would be adding a layer of insulation (either outside or inside). Outside it changes the exterior looking of the house (which could be a good thing, if the house is not so pretty from the outside), you probaly need permission from the Bauamt, is more expensive, but no hassle inside. Inside cheaper, no need for permission, reduces the indoor space, some hassle for the inhabitant. 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 i'm guessing such a contract is so that you don't use a different Makler in the end for that particular house sale. Our house is similar to yours in dimensions so i hope this helps: We paid about 20K for a new roof. The heating system costs seem a bit high but i am truly ignorant in what that estimate might be including. Radiators, oil tanks and a Bruderus? Or do you also have to retrofit it in (i.e. with the firewalls, etc.) Floor estimates for us, and I apologize for being really unspecified, were about 1000 euros per room (think a standard sized living room that could fit a couch, bookshelf and tv unit). That results in about 4-6K for our entire upstairs for ripping up cork and laying down a nice hard wood (we did not do this, but got a lot of estimates to see if we could budget it in this year - it will happen next year instead). Repainted the entire house was 3000K, that included some plaster and some tapete repair and ceilings. Our painter was not an official painting company but a general handyman from Poland (it was above the table, but he wasn't a "licensed" zimmerman or anything like that). If you have any more questions, feel free to ask. We haven't done too much this year as its our first year with the house, but its a continual work in progress. 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 2 hours ago, dannys said: A makler who does not have exclusivity on a specific property - usually advertise it with partial address, and will only give you the full address once you sign a contract that says that in case you end up buying the property, he gets his commission. dirty, but they do it My mistake, sorry. Where I live I've never seen a property on offer from more than one agent... must be done differently where you are. BTW: I am yet to discover a property online which shows outside photos and for which I have NOT been able to find on google maps. The 3D feature is especially useful for this! Take 10 minutes to have a search (use south-facing windows, shape of driveway, nearby trees etc. as points of reference) to find the location. Nothing beats going to look for yourself (and the look on the Makler's face when you tell them the address). *edit: or if you PM me a link to the advert I might just spend some of my free time to find it for you... best not to post on the forum in case somebody steals the purchase from you! 2 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 2 Nov 2016 Correct me if I'm wrong, but properties are generally listed ARE under only one agent (as appointed by the seller). The advertising is done by the selling makler, but a potential buyer can also hire a makler to represent them from their end (which does help when it comes to negotiations, but not always). If a buyer doesn't have a Makler, they generally contact the selling/advertising one to show them the property and that Makler then represents both the seller and the buyer (not great for negotiations but ultimately it falls down to the clients decisions). Since they are taking the time to communicate with that potential buyer and show them the property, they want to make sure they aren't wasting their time so they have the potential buyer sign on, so that they become the agent for both the seller and buyer (which is better for them). In the case that the buyer already has their own agent, then the fees can be split, but it varies. You have to be careful as a buyer when it comes to signing contracts with a Makler - i.e. make sure that contract is just to show you THAT house and its not an exclusivity contract for ANY property you want to buy. (as always, I'm open to any corrections here, but this is as I understand it with our own experiences in buying and selling) 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 3 Nov 2016 16 hours ago, Joanie said: but a potential buyer can also hire a makler to represent them from their end Never heard of this here in Germany 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 3 Nov 2016 16 hours ago, toBnruG said: BTW: I am yet to discover a property online which shows outside photos and for which I have NOT been able to find on google maps. Is it not the case that very often Maklers have a clause with the vendor saying that if the buyer contact them directly and therefore can technically avoid paying their fee, then the vendor himself must pay such fee? If so, then of course contacting the vendor directly does not help, the vendor will simply tell you to speak with the Makler... Am I right? 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 3 Nov 2016 A friend of mine had a roof done a few years ago and said it cost him 17k and he got a quote recently for another house he owns for something like 25k. It depends on the type of roof too though. He has these red clay slates that are very common here. 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 3 Nov 2016 At this time it might be a good idea to wait a couple of years for Tesla's solar roofs (not to confuse with solar panels on top of your roof), but they might take long time before they are in the market. 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 3 Nov 2016 We nearly bought a house 4 years ago and although it wasn't an old house in need of complete renovation as the one you are looking at, we were dubious about some aspects of the build quality. Although I believe it isn't necessary to get a surveyor's report in order to get a mortgage as it is in the UK, we chose to engage a surveyor for our peace of mind. I rang our local Gemeinde to ask for their recommendations. I can't recall the German term for a building surveyor just now ...is it Gutachter? They put me in touch with 2 local architects who were authority approved. It cost us around 500€ though saved us a fortune if we had bought a house that was firstly vastly overpriced in his opinion and secondly, he gave us repair and replacement estimates for various aspects of the house structure. Since then, house prices have escalated and the asking price of a unique property can't be compared with others... just depends on what it's worth to you. We too found it quite easy to identify a property with only a partial address. Or, we'd make a viewing appointment and cancel if the address didn't suit. We never signed Makler documents though again, I think it's not so unusual these days and you're likely to sign before a viewing appointment is ever made . If you were to turn up at a property then it would be the sellers responsibility to direct you to the Makler in accordance to their contractual agreement. We ended up buying a house that we heard was for sale via a neighbor. The seller had only signed her Makler agreement hours before. So he had little sales work for the commission we had to pay him. In fairness to him (the Makler) he was one of the old boy network and did help us through the buying process and charged less than the normal 5.95%. Short answer to your original question...get a Gutachter to help you assess likely renovation costs. 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Posted 3 Nov 2016 23 hours ago, SpiderPig said: If its sold through a Makler, then the Makler will only give the town... and the full adress once they have signed an agreement at a "Pub car park meet-up" Its just to cover the Maklers back etc! What if a third person contact the Makler about the house, and then pass the address on to someonelse... 0 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
