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The Orlando Massacre

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You were drawing the comparison to availability of tools with which to kill people in those countries. You made it relevant.

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2 minutes ago, MadAxeMurderer said:

It might be terrorism. It might be hate. It might even be both, and it could just be inexplicable insanity. 

As opposed to terrorism, or gay hate which is explicable (but not justifiable) insanity.

 

Another form of insanity is trying to argue that the USA's ridiculously lax gun laws are not the root cause of the very high death by gun rate in the USA. If he had been a security guard in Europe he would not have been allowed to take his gun home with him. 

 

And I would much prefer to see two men kissing without making noise than people playing music from their phones on trains. Everybody has a trigger over some behaviour they hate. Lucky most won't act on it, and in most countries the few that might act can't because by the time they find a gun the trigger situation is over:

You should be more tolerant to other people opinions instead of jumping to name-callings.

I am trying to make a point here that things are not that black and white as you want them to be. Obviously I am wasting my time....

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1 hour ago, AlexTr said:

 

" The incident is being investigated as an act of terrorism. Mir Seddique, Mateen's father, told NBC News, "this has nothing to do with religion." Seddique said his son got angry when he saw two men kissing in Miami a couple of months ago and thinks that may be related to the shooting. "

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/orlando-nightclub-massacre/orlando-nightclub-shooting-emergency-services-respond-reports-gunman-n590446

This article on the NBC Website reports that there was a 911 call by the mass murder in which he pledged allegiance to IS: What motivated nightclub shooter?

 

The article also quotes the shooter's father as saying he is in shock, which is just one of many reasons why we can't necessarily take his claim at face value. It's simply not normal to kill dozens of people simply because one is offended by seeing two people of the same gender kissing each other.

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1 minute ago, SA_Drone said:

You were drawing the comparison to availability of tools with which to kill people in those countries. You made it relevant.

Yes, but what is your comment about superpowers about? Can you please explain?

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That you cannot compare Bangladesh and Pakistan to countries like the United States. Just as you can't compare Bangladesh (a country with an average yearly per capita income of $3500) to anywhere in Europe.

 

I assumed it was pretty self-explanatory.

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12 minutes ago, Conquistador said:

This article on the NBC Website reports that there was a 911 call by the mass murder in which he pledged allegiance to IS: What motivated nightclub shooter?

 

The article also quotes the shooter's father as saying he is in shock, which is just one of many reasons why we can't necessarily take his claim at face value. It's simply not normal to kill dozens of people simply because one is offended by seeing two people of the same gender kissing each other.

 

God bothering ninnies of all stripes like to kill LGBT people. I don't care which god you (generic "you") bother daily with your whining, you are probably a danger to me or other people who don't bother with your imaginary sky friend.

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My guess is he was a closet homosexual.  How many times have we seen those who are actually gay, and unable to come out for religious, cultural or family reasons...get outted for acting on their "sinful" impulses (of note...I do NOT think it sinful or anything but a normal variant of human sexuality).

 

It is too weird that he was so "bothered" by seeing two men kissing two months ago that even his father states it as a reason...and that he targered a gay club. 

 

 

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17 minutes ago, klubbnika said:

You should be more tolerant to other people opinions instead of jumping to name-callings.

I am trying to make a point here that things are not that black and white as you want them to be. Obviously I am wasting my time...

Name calling. Well I never, how dare you accuse me of name calling when I didn't.

Me. I'm mister tolerance. Except in the areas where I'm not tolerant like noise, bad food for vegetarians, sexism, and stupidity.

But at least you got one thing right: You are indeed wasting your time. 

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10 minutes ago, SA_Drone said:

That you cannot compare Bangladesh and Pakistan to countries like the United States. Just as you can't compare Bangladesh (a country with an average yearly per capita income of $3500) to anywhere in Europe.

 

I assumed it was pretty self-explanatory.

I am still not clear here. Are you saying that relative poverty has something to do with the mass-killings? And that they are more excusable if a poor person committed them? Or what do you mean exactly.

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18 minutes ago, Conquistador said:

This article on the NBC Website reports that there was a 911 call by the mass murder in which he pledged allegiance to IS: What motivated nightclub shooter?

 

The article also quotes the shooter's father as saying he is in shock, which is just one of many reasons why we can't necessarily take his claim at face value. It's simply not normal to kill dozens of people simply because one is offended by seeing two people of the same gender kissing each other.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if it is discovered he spent some time in Saudi Arabia, like some others of his ilk.

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14 minutes ago, MadAxeMurderer said:

Name calling. Well I never, how dare you accuse me of name calling when I didn't.

Me. I'm mister tolerance. Except in the areas where I'm not tolerant like noise, bad food for vegetarians, sexism, and stupidity.

But at least you got one thing right: You are indeed wasting your time. 

Apologies if I misunderstood, but it sounded like you were calling me insane for not totally agreeing with your standpoint.

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17 minutes ago, Conquistador said:

What's your solution?

 

More surveilance of the risk-groups and individuals?

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Apology accepted. I did indeed imply you're insane because you deny USA gun laws are the root cause of the high rate of gun violence in the USA. And your suggestion that the massacre might have been avoided if he'd been under more intense surveillance.

 

But that's not name calling. It's posting sense.

 

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5 minutes ago, MadAxeMurderer said:

Apology accepted. I did indeed imply you're insane because you deny USA gun laws are the root cause of the high rate of gun violence in the USA. And your suggestion that the massacre might have been avoided if he'd been under more intense surveillance.

 

But that's not name calling. It's posting sense.

 

Let's agree to disagree. :)

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1. Easy access to legal guns results in easy access to illegal guns. What is easier for a 14 year old in Germany, to buy beer or weed? The same principle applies to guns.

2. I'm not a weaponsexual and not a supporter of weaponsexuality but they are right: if you ban/restrict guns right now in the US, only criminals will profit from it, not normal people. It's too late, there are more guns in this country than in any other country outside warzones.

3. High level of aggression is the problem here. Believe it or not, but Trump influenced this guy. No wonder that this took place in Trump stronghold Florida. The guy suddenly realised that he is the enemy of all Americans as preached by Trumpists, so he decided to do his jihad. In more tolerant societies this doesn't happen. And lack or availability of weapons is not the reason, why.

 

I don't have answers to conclude what should be done. But definitely not further restrictions of freedoms. There are not many left.

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@Mad Axe Murderer (nice nick btw ;), do you prefer killing people with axes? *joke* )

 

Just to clarify my position, I am for a severe restriction of the right to obtain fire arms and I agree that the gun laws in the US in many cases contribute to violent crimes, but it is only one of many factors, in my opinion.

 

I hate guns, I even object to producing weapon toys for children! It's horrible and immoral.

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3 minutes ago, yourkeau said:

1. Easy access to legal guns results in easy access to illegal guns. What is easier for a 14 year old in Germany, to buy beer or weed? The same principle applies to guns.

 

Can you elaborate this please? If someone is determied to get a gun, there always be a black market for that. The terrorists in France even ordered it online, if I remember correctly.

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