Do I need a visa as non-EU citizen w/German residence permit to travel to the UK

104 posts in this topic

21 minutes ago, snowingagain said:

 

 

No, you can't legally enter Ireland (or the UK) if you are travelling alone (unless you are joining your wife who is already there, under certain circumstances).

ttirish.jpg

??????

Your face 

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32 minutes ago, Oluwaseun said:

??????

Your face 

 

Well, not far off after a late night I suppose.  Longer hair though!  

 

 

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18 hours ago, snowingagain said:

 

Well, not far off after a late night I suppose.  Longer hair though!  

 

 

Thanks

 

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To head back on topic it's worth noting that in discussions like this EU or non-EU is not the main deciding point when it comes to passports / border control. What defines whether passports are checked is whether the countries are members of Schengen or not. Once in the Schengen area you're free to travel within that area no matter what your nationality. You just need to show your passports / visas when entering or leaving the area as a whole.

 

EU border crossing, as in entering or leaving the EU defines whether you'll be subject to Customs controls.

 

All EU countries except Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Romania, Ireland & UK are Schengen members, of these 6 exemptions the first four are set to join, Ireland & UK have opted to stay out.

In addition, Iceland, Lichtenstein, Norway & Sweden are not EU members but are Schengen members so they also offer freedom of movement.

 

Obviously post Brexit things will change as the UK will no longer be EU and I doubt they'll suddenly decide to join Schengen and allow freedom of movement.

 

I know all this as my new job demanded I learn it and pass exams on the subject, but if you don't want to take my word then try Mr. Wiki

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1 hour ago, Malt-Teaser said:

In addition, Iceland, Lichtenstein, Norway & Sweden are not EU members but are Schengen members so they also offer freedom of movement.

Sweden are in the EU. I think you probably meant to write Switzerland here.

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17 hours ago, Malt-Teaser said:

All EU countries except Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Romania, Ireland & UK are Schengen members, of these 6 exemptions the first four are set to join, Ireland & UK have opted to stay out.

 

However Croatia and Romania let you in if you have either a Schengen or a "D" long term permit.  (read: If you live in the Schengen area).

 

Bulgaria and Cyprus probably too by now.

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17 hours ago, Malt-Teaser said:

To head back on topic it's worth noting that in discussions like this EU or non-EU is not the main deciding point when it comes to passports / border control. What defines whether passports are checked is whether the countries are members of Schengen or not. Once in the Schengen area you're free to travel within that area no matter what your nationality. You just need to show your passports / visas when entering or leaving the area as a whole.

 

EU border crossing, as in entering or leaving the EU defines whether you'll be subject to Customs controls.

 

All EU countries except Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Romania, Ireland & UK are Schengen members, of these 6 exemptions the first four are set to join, Ireland & UK have opted to stay out.

In addition, Iceland, Lichtenstein, Norway & Sweden are not EU members but are Schengen members so they also offer freedom of movement.

 

Obviously post Brexit things will change as the UK will no longer be EU and I doubt they'll suddenly decide to join Schengen and allow freedom of movement.

 

I know all this as my new job demanded I learn it and pass exams on the subject, but if you don't want to take my word then try Mr. Wiki

 

 

All that is fine and legal

 

However, trying  to get from Austria to Germany at the moment, ( Kufstein and near Salzburg ), has lengthy lines of traffic, where in practice you maybe asked to show your passport or ID - so much for the freedom of movement in Schengen area !!!

 

Also, if want to take an airplane flight within the Schengen area, you can still be asked to show your ID/passport as proof of identity.

 

In practice freedom of movement within the Schengen area has limitations.

 

 

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Temporary suspension of Schengen:

 

https://ec.europa.eu/home-affairs/what-we-do/policies/borders-and-visas/schengen/reintroduction-border-control_en

 

Current Temporarily Reintroduced Border Controls

  • Temporarily reintroduced border controls in the context of foreseeable events:

    • France (27 January 2017 – 15 July 2017)
      persistent terrorist threat
  • Temporarily reintroduced border controls in the context of Recommendation of the Council of 11 May 2017:

    • Germany (11  May 2017 – 11 November 2017)
      land border with Austria
    • Austria (11  May 2017 – 11 November 2017)
      land border with Slovenia and with Hungary
    • Denmark (11  May 2017 – 11 November 2017)
      Danish ports with ferry connections to Germany and the Danish-German land border
    • Sweden (11  May 2017 – 11 November 2017) 
      Swedish harbours in the Police Region South and West and the Öresund bridge
    • Norway (11  May 2017 – 11 November 2017) 
      Norwegian ports with ferry connections to Denmark, Germany and Sweden
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3 minutes ago, kaffeemitmilch said:

Yes, you can with your residence permit that states you are an EU family member. Print out this page: http://www.inis.gov.ie/en/INIS/Pages/visa-eu-family-residence-card

 

Um, from the link you linked

 

Freedom of Movement

Your EU/EEA or Swiss family member has rights under EU treaties that may allow you to accompany or join them in Ireland without a visa.

But he wants to go alone.  And wife staying in Germany.

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5 hours ago, Krieg said:

 

However Croatia and Romania let you in if you have either a Schengen or a "D" long term permit.  (read: If you live in the Schengen area).

 

Bulgaria and Cyprus probably too by now.

 

But certainly not if coming the other way as you have to go through immigration / passport control so it isn't a general rule or acceptance yet.

Those four are indeed committed to joining Schengen, but no date set yet as far as I know.

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Romania and Croatia let you in if you live in Schengen. I know what I am talking about.

Maybe next time I go there I will tell them they should not let me in because someone in TT has a new job in which he was trained in immigration rules and they are doing it wrong.

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11 minutes ago, Krieg said:

Romania and Croatia let you in if you live in Schengen. I know what I am talking about.

Maybe next time I go there I will tell them they should not let me in because someone in TT has a new job in which he was trained in immigration rules and they are doing it wrong.

 

Are you though Nigerian?  If you are from EU, Switzerland, US, Australia, Canada or NZ you don't need a visa either.   

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19 hours ago, snowingagain said:

 

Um, from the link you linked

 

Freedom of Movement

Your EU/EEA or Swiss family member has rights under EU treaties that may allow you to accompany or join them in Ireland without a visa.

But he wants to go alone.  And wife staying in Germany.

 

Hah, I missed that. Now that I think about it, you're right that most of these rights are connected to accompanying or joining an EU family member.

 

27 minutes ago, Krieg said:

Romania and Croatia let you in if you live in Schengen. I know what I am talking about.

Maybe next time I go there I will tell them they should not let me in because someone in TT has a new job in which he was trained in immigration rules and they are doing it wrong.

 

I agree. These countries have no opt-out like the UK and Ireland, so are generally required to follow Schengen rules even though border controls exist as standard, as opposed to being ad-hoc and temporary.

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29 minutes ago, snowingagain said:

 

Are you though Nigerian?  If you are from EU, Switzerland, US, Australia, Canada or NZ you don't need a visa either.   

 

I am a citizen of a non-EU country.

 

 

7 minutes ago, kaffeemitmilch said:

I agree. These countries have no opt-out like the UK and Ireland, so are generally required to follow Schengen rules even though border controls exist as standard, as opposed to being ad-hoc and temporary.

 

Croatia and Romania have not fully implemented Schengen yet, but they already have implemented some steps towards it.  Like I said already, if you are a non-EU living in the Schengen area you do not need a visa to go there anymore for short visits.

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6 hours ago, Krieg said:

Croatia and Romania have not fully implemented Schengen yet, but they already have implemented some steps towards it.  Like I said already, if you are a non-EU living in the Schengen area you do not need a visa to go there anymore for short visits.

 

I know, and I agreed with what you wrote.

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Sorry CafeConLeche, something went wrong with the quote system. I've been only clearing up the mistakes from the auto-proclamed expert.

And actually those countries took already more steps towards Schengen, I only mentioned the one that affects non-EUs living in the Schengen area, but tourists can as well profit from the Schengen visa if they want to go to Croatia and Romania (and probably Bulgaria and Cyprus). Tourists with a Schengen visa only have to make sure they have at least a 2-entry visa to Schengen or better multiple entries, that's the only requirement they ask, and the reason is simple. They will welcome the tourists with the Schengen visa but technically they are not yet in the Schengen area, so the tourist will need a valid visa to re-enter the Schengen area.

And the other change they implemented already towards Schengen is that since 2014 or 2015 they recognize the "access to Schengen with no visa required" status, so all non-EUs that do not require visa to entre Schengen can go to those countries as well. And then they have been amending their rules to accept as well every country who received no-visa-required status post 2015 (about 20+ countries).

So, while technically they have not fully implemented the Schengen agreement yet, they are very close. At least in terms of traveling around.

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<<Somewhat related: Query on whether I need a transit visa for the UK while travelling through to another country>>

 

Hi, 

My question(s) here are not directly related to the post, but they are related in my opinion hence posting it here. Apologies if you all disagree. Also since this is the closest topic related to my situation that was current. So here goes:

 

I hold an Indian passport and an NE for Germany and will be travelling to India with my family (Indian citizens holding regular residence permits, not NE, valid through to next couple of years) on BA from Frankfurt to Delhi (and back in a few weeks) via Heathrow (same terminal same day transit).

The extremely helpful UK gov website (https://www.gov.uk/check-uk-visa/y/india/transit/somewhere_else/no) states we need what is referred to as a DATV to transit through the same terminal (unless we are exempt). Thankfully the exemption list is the most unambiguous piece of text I have ever read!! If you go through the list, the first point (a new one added since 2014) states that someone with a 'visa' issued by the US is exempt (even if you are not travelling to or from there). 

We all incidentally also have US B1/B2 visas valid at least until Oct 2018.

 

So my query is more out of my daftness than the UK government's absolutely flawless visa policy, it is:

What constitutes a 'a common format residence permit issued by an European Economic Area (EEA) country or Switzerland'? - do my NE and my family's residence permits (stamped in the passport) qualify? 

Which 'visas' issued by USA qualify? 

 

But most importantly, anyone from a third world country with an RP/NE from Germany who can share their recent experience of transiting through the UK would be enormously helpful.

 

I did write to the embassy, and they were extremely prompt in sending me the automated message that basically said 'we can't be bothered by visa issues, there are more important things to take care of. Contact the UKVI (whatever that is).'

Oh and the BA call centre was also very helpful in pointing me to the IATA website, which is 'unambiguous' to the next level. They have conveniently omitted the US visa clause from there!

 

In dire straits! Looking for some help... Thanks in anticipation

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On 7/23/2017, 3:32:23, Malt-Teaser said:

To head back on topic it's worth noting that in discussions like this EU or non-EU is not the main deciding point when it comes to passports / border control. What defines whether passports are checked is whether the countries are members of Schengen or not. Once in the Schengen area you're free to travel within that area no matter what your nationality. You just need to show your passports / visas when entering or leaving the area as a whole.

 

EU border crossing, as in entering or leaving the EU defines whether you'll be subject to Customs controls.

 

All EU countries except Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Romania, Ireland & UK are Schengen members, of these 6 exemptions the first four are set to join, Ireland & UK have opted to stay out.

In addition, Iceland, Lichtenstein, Norway & Sweden are not EU members but are Schengen members so they also offer freedom of movement.

 

Obviously post Brexit things will change as the UK will no longer be EU and I doubt they'll suddenly decide to join Schengen and allow freedom of movement.

 

I know all this as my new job demanded I learn it and pass exams on the subject, but if you don't want to take my word then try Mr. Wiki

 

All fine and good, but I was denied boarding at the gate with Austrian Air on a flight from Germany to Austria because I didn't have my passport with me (although I had copies of it and my aufenthaltstiteln (Niederlassungserlaubnis) for Germany and Hungary with me.  This was incredible, since I had been on five other flights that week without any problem.  More incredible because I was on a business class fare and I thought airlines like to keep business class passengers. I ended up getting a temporary ID from the German police that I never used since I booked another flight with Eurowings and they didn't ask to see my ID.

Would definitely recommend flying an airline other than Austrian Air.

 

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