Difficulties of starting an Ausbildung

30 posts in this topic

Hello there!

 

My family and I are going to move to Deutschland within three months because my mother needs to make it up with her family (my grandparents are German, indeed) and especially with her mother, who lately fell ill.

 

The fact is, that I do not speak German.

I am trying to learn it on my own, though. And I am going to learn it better once I will be in Germany.

 

I will be done with studies right this schoolyear and I would like to start an Ausbildung over there because I would not like to go on with university.

 

That gives birth to my question.

Once I learnt German (I am going to learn it for at least one year), how hard is it to start an Ausbildung?

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I think that it's not very hard, but I haven't done (or tried to do) one, so I wouldn't know from experience. It depends a lot on what do you want to do the Ausbildung of, and in which city are you going to be looking for it.

 

Have you chosen a general topic of studies? Would you like something similar to what you were studying in university?

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Oh good grief, how in the name of blazes do you want to do a traineeship with no language skills?

 

You need to learn proper German. And then some. Depending on what field you're going into, you will need specialised Language skills. You are going to school after all and will have to pass exams. No company in their right mind will take on someone who doesn't know the language.

 

So start learning it properly and I do mean properly, in a school, with intensive courses, etc etc

 

Edit, ok, your profile says you're English. You sure about that? Your English isn't even that good. And if you were born in 1992, that makes you nearly 22 years of age - what have you been doing so far? You can't still be in normal school, can you?

 

You're too old for a traineeship - that's for school leavers, not for people in their mid-20s. You need to do your homework now or else you will go under faster than the Titanic

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You need some company to sign you up as an apprentice if you want to do an ausbildung. You have to decide what you want to learn and then apply for jobs. Recently they signed up two apprentices where I work. One of them had been working for the company as a manpower worker and had proven himself to be reliable and a good worker. The other had spend a week or two on a school internship and had shown to be interested and eager to learn. In some cases, a company may sign you up right away. In other cases, they may offer you to do a 1-2 week internship and see how you work and let you see if you are still interested.

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And I am going to learn it better once I will be in Germany.

 

Once I learnt German

 

with that english?

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Well, you definitely lack of politeness.

There is no need to 'denigrate' someone else who's, instead of you, asking a question POLITELY.

You can correct me. It would gladden me.

 

That said, I am English, but did not spend my childhood in England, so I did not grow up being 'natively' in touch with English.

My mother got married with an Italian and moved to Italia without caring about raising me with a perfect knowledge of her native language.

It's a pity, I know, but I can't help it. It's not my fault.

 

Nobody87, thank you for your post.

Given that cookery in general is my passion, I would like to start a cook/pastry-maker/baker Ausbildung.

I am going to look for it in Düsseldorf because there it is where we will move to.

I was a student in Linguistics & Languages and obviously I would not mind doing Ausbildungs that have something to do with languages either.

 

Camlough, that's my will, indeed.

I can perfectly understand I need to learn German first, that's what exactly what I wrote.

It's obvious that in Germany I would be learning it properly, attending language schools and so on.

Replying to your question, I have been attending university until now, but unluckily it did not work out well for me.

What am I supposed to do, then? I am 21, not 30 nor 50.

Learning German all year round, I won't be older than 23. Can't I start to work? Can't I get even the worst job ever? Bah.

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Given that cookery in general is my passion, I would like to start a cook/pastry-maker/baker Ausbildung.

 

I hope you realise that these are among the hardest apprenticeships, in terms of working hours and conditions, that you can choose to do. As a baker/pastry maker you will generally need to be in work by 4/5 am, as a cook you may well not get home until then. Im sure it can be very rewarding, but be aware its a hard slog to get there.

 

 

I can perfectly understand I need to learn German first, that's what exactly what I wrote.

 

Im going to massively contradict camlough and say as long as you have the basics down, the fastest and easiest way to get fluent is total immersion in something like an apprenticeship or university course. It means you have to do the language work in parallel to your other studies, but it gets you there faster than any amount of VHS or Goethe-institute courses.

 

It's obvious that in Germany I would be learning it properly, attending language schools and so on.

Replying to your question, I have been attending university until now, but unluckily it did not work out well for me.

What am I supposed to do, then? I am 21,

 

 

Learning German all year round, I won't be older than 23. Can't I start to work? Can't I get even the worst job ever? Bah.

Its important that you realise that an "Ausbildung" in Germany is done at 17/18 and if you have already done a university course you will be considerably older than your fellow apprentices. I really wouldn't wait until 23 - at 21 you will be pushing the age boundary. Get started ASAP. Your biggest problem (after the language) will be convincing anyone to even take you on at that age. In that case doing a fairly unpopular job like baker would possibly work to your advantage.

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I hope you realise that these are among the hardest apprenticeships, in terms of working hours and conditions, that you can choose to do. As a baker/pastry maker you will generally need to be in work by 4/5 am, as a cook you may well not get home until then. Im sure it can be very rewarding, but be aware its a hard slog to get there.

 

Many bakers start even earlier as they have to deliver by 6 am when the bakeries open. I have heard as early as 1-2 am.

 

A cook also works long hours and gets little pay. I have been hanging out with the guys at the restaurant that recently opened downstairs where I live and that is what they say. As a cook, you'd also have an option though to get a job in a canteen or a hospital. Totally different hours compared to a restaurant.

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You're too old for a traineeship - that's for school leavers, not for people in their mid-20s. You need to do your homework now or else you will go under faster than the Titanic

I teach at a vocational school (Gewerbliche Schule) at which trainees do academic coursework one or two days a week alongside their training. While 17/18 (even 16) is the normal age to start an Ausbildung, it's not uncommon at all for trainees to be in their early 20s. I even have a handful who are in their early to mid-30s. So I don't think it's too late for you, but you should get going sooner rather than later.

 

Language-wise, I would agree with pog451 that once you have the basics down, language immersion in an apprenticeship would be the best way to learn German.

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I'm about to complete my Ausbildung, which I began when I was 23. I have classmates ranging in ages 17-56. Older Azubis are nothing unusual, and many of them are there as Umschüler sponsored by the Agentur für Arbeit and there are also a number who are there to change professions of their own accord.

 

That said, without speaking German, it wouldn't be easy. While an Ausbildung doesn't require University level work obviously, you still have to have the ability to communicate, understand, and write fluently enough to be able to take part in school work and exams. (This completely aside from the fact that at work you will need to communicate with your coworkers.)

 

I have had problems at times despite speaking German quite well. It's true, you would gain a lot of language skills from the Ausbildung itself, as have I - however I can't imagine what it would have been like starting from nothing. You really need to have a quite decent level to start with I'd think. Of course I am doing my Ausbildung in an area to which business correspondence and communication, in German, are of the essence. I don't know what is required of bakers or cooks. You would at least have to find a very patient company to take you on and help you learn.

 

Two more tiny anecdotes: I knew a guy that began his Ausbildung at the same time as me, also a native English speaker but knowing absolutely no German. He lasted 2 months. But it simply didn't make any sense for him to sit at school and understand nothing - the teachers are not there to and don't have time to teach German as well as their subject, and without some basic instruction you aren't just going to start understanding what is being lectured on.

 

I also presently have a classmate who is not a native German speaker. She does speak German, but not terribly well. OK, decent we can say. She gets through but just barely, and with significant effort on her part. She always prepares for lessons in the evenings that we will have the next day, making sure to read all texts and looking up all the words she doesn't understand and just generally making herself familiar with vocabulary used to discuss that particular topic, so that she is able to participate in class. And in the end, she will pass, I'm sure. But I see how hard it is for her to juggle work, school and keeping up in German, and I wonder how it would be possible to go in and be successful on no German.

 

I'm not saying it's not worth a shot. Just be aware that it will be a lot more work for you than it would be for the average Azubi, if you have to keep up with German on the side. If you have that kind of work-ethic and self-discipline then go for it.

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Don't let some of these people with their negative attitudes and rude comments bother you. We get this on TT all the time.

 

My German wife lived in the US for 17 years and then decided 4 years ago to come back to Germany to do an Ausbildung as an Atzt Assistenen (Doctors assistant). She was 40 years old at the time and wasn't the oldest one in the school. She enjoyed being around the younger girls and still keeps in touch with them. So don't let age stop you - you can always find something.

 

But you really have to learn German well - probably at the C1 level. Berufsschule isn't easy - about one third of my wifes classmates didn't pass the final exam the first time around. And working 3 days a week and going to school for 2 days isn't easy. Just make sure you get a position with an employer that will treat you as a student who is there to learn and not a cleaning woman.

 

While you spend a year or two learning German, look around at potential employers, talk to them and their employees and see who wants Azubis. Get a feel for working in Germany - conditions are different than in Britian or the US. And check out the schools you may go to to see how the students like them and where there are older students. Good Luck!!

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Zee, thank you for that link! :)

 

Pog, I know what I am talking about. I know I can't disagree with you.

My mother herself is a cook and my Italian grandmother is a bakers' & pizza-makers' daughter, so I grew up baking, pizza-making, cooking... eating... whatever. Ahahah!

I perfectly know how hard are these professions, but I also know how rewarding it all is. At least, I like it. :)

 

I am not going to tell you why I could not learn my grandmother's parents' profession nor I can do/learn my mother's here, in the sinking or already sunken Italia.

I don't want to bore you. It's a different matter. I tried to break through the Italian working world, though.

 

Uhm...

OK, then. Germans do it at their 17-18s.

I wish, but my German does not allow me to start as soon as possible.

To achieve an adequate German level, just to be able to do an Ausbildung, how long should I be attending German classes for?

What level?

 

Milsa & JCK, thank you very much for your posts!

They make me think I would not be that hopeless.

 

I just read your post, Garyh, and I heartily thank you for having posted it.

I am obviously not going to deceive myself, but that definitely makes me feel, as I wrote above, more hopeless at it.

 

Anyway, thank you guys for your posts!

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Why do you want to come from England and become a Pizzabaeckerin in Germany? It's considered a very badly paid and socially "low class" job. Warning: this sounds cynical but it's hard to deny that german society is strongly classist. I don't know exactly where in Italy you reside, but objectively speaking you may be better off as pizza-baker in Italy (at least where I come from) compared to the same job in Germany. Yes, you usually have to know someone, true...

 

If you want to come to Germany for family-related reasons, which are completely understandable, I would suggest you to aim for a different career. Mind you that I am just trying to *warn* you, ofc if you become the owner of a nice restaurant you can build a nice life for you and your family :)

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I will be done with studies right this schoolyear and I would like to start an Ausbildung over there because I would not like to go on with university.

 

You might want to gather some pieces of information about the German educational system. There is quite a range of options between an Ausbildung and going to University (e.g. Fachschule, Fachoberschule, duales Studium, Fachhochschule). Getting an appointment with the local Schullaufbahnberatungsstelle and ask for clarification might be a good thing for you.

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Ciao, FDG, e grazie per aver postato! :)

 

That's a popular mindset even in Italia, so I didn't fall from the sky, reading what you sketched out.

Why not aiming for a different career? Who knows? But I like cooking and I would like my passion(s) to become my job.

Anyway, who cares about what people say or think?

Those whose heads work that way look to my odd eyes irremediably slow-witted, so I really don't.

 

Thank you again for your post!

 

Jeba, yours is a great advise. Thousand thanks!

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Hi,

 

Sorry to try and revive an old topic. I just wanted to know how much I can expect to earn per month on an Ausbildung (hopefully business, but I'd settle for baking as I often bake using recipes in German)?

 

I have B2+ German by the way.

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