Public vs. private health insurance

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Another add here: if anybody ever says to you: private insurance will cost this in 30 years´ time or public insurance will cost that - ask them about their crystal ball. Nobody knows. Absolutely nobody.

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I have a crystal ball: Germany is an anti-children country, birth rate falls, life expectancy increases, so the proportion of old and sick to young and healthy people makes one be sure, that premiums will rise significantly in future. Both private and public.

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22 minutes ago, yourkeau said:

I have a crystal ball: Germany is an anti-children country, birth rate falls,

 

Your crystal ball's broken, the birth rate's been rising for five years. 

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43 minutes ago, someonesdaughter said:

 

Your crystal ball's broken, the birth rate's been rising for five years. 

I don't care about five years. The glass ist half empty. The situation would have been already bad with 2.0 rate because the life expectacy rises. Here the chance that Germany will go back to reproducing its population (2.0 rate) is zero.

 

geburten-zusammengefasste-geburtenziffer

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On 9/15/2019, 12:32:56, PandaMunich said:

The Alterrückstellung, i.e. the part of your contribution that's saved with the intent to lower your contributions when you get older in no way compensates the rise in costs because of the higher medical needs of the ageing members of that specific "pot".

Ok, so now I understand why my private top up insurance went from € 36 to € 55 per month within 5 years.

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23 hours ago, yourkeau said:

I have a crystal ball: Germany is an anti-children country, birth rate falls, life expectancy increases, so the proportion of old and sick to young and healthy people makes one be sure, that premiums will rise significantly in future. Both private and public.

At the moment, I don´t disagree with you re your last sentence! This is what I always point out to our clients! Nobody knows! I sometimes miss out on a business contract because of that. People want guarantees and i cannot offer them.

Looking back: I never expected the fall of the Soviet Union in my lifetime, as an example.

By the way, public health insurance prices are rising next January for higher earners.I am sure some private insurers will announce the same. ie higher prices.

 

I am a professional independent insurance broker and authorised advertiser. Contact me.
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2 stupid question: in a couple married where both are working and only one is private...who pays what??? Is the partner under public obliged to move private?? And eventually children?

 

 

If the rente is reached and it is taken the decision to move out and live in another country, the rente will be continued to paid, but what about the health insurance? Is it mandatory to pay and remain insured privately with the original health insurance even if not anymore resident in Germany, in order to get regularly the rente? 

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12 hours ago, karmakoma said:

2 stupid question: in a couple married where both are working and only one is private...who pays what??? Is the partner under public obliged to move private?? And eventually children?

 

 

If the rente is reached and it is taken the decision to move out and live in another country, the rente will be continued to paid, but what about the health insurance? Is it mandatory to pay and remain insured privately with the original health insurance even if not anymore resident in Germany, in order to get regularly the rente? 

 

no so stupid, trust me :-)
The German system is inherently complex and contradictory even, therefore there are no stupid questions when it comes to the German health insurance system.

 

Q1: The one with public health insurance (GKV) can, of course, stay with public health insurance. However, if the income of the spouse with private health insurance (PKV) has significantly higher income and the one with GKV is not an employee, parts of the income of the PKV-spouse will be counted towards setting the premiums/contributions into the GKV. So, if one is a stay-at-home-spouse with no real source of income, the monthly dues will not be those minimum contributions around 180 EUR p.m. but will rather climb all the way up to max. 50% of the highest public contribution. 

 

Children can later be insured in GKV, too. But at costs. I.e. the min. monthly contribution has to be paid for each child.

 

Q2: depends on where you move and what kind of health insurance you'll have there. If you move to a location with compulsory national/state health insurance, the PKV can be terminated at once. So, bascially moving to any EU-memberstate will get you out of PKV that way. If you move outside the EU, PKV can (!) be continued if you so wish (which you have to tell your PKV) but otherwise the PKV will get terminated when you deregister your residence from Germany to abroad.

 

Cheerio

 

I am a professional independent insurance broker, financial adviser, and authorised advertiser. Contact me.
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4 hours ago, Starshollow said:

 

no so stupid, trust me :-)
The German system is inherently complex and contradictory even, therefore there are no stupid questions when it comes to the German health insurance system.

 

Q1: The one with public health insurance (GKV) can, of course, stay with public health insurance. However, if the income of the spouse with private health insurance (PKV) has significantly higher income and the one with GKV is not an employee, parts of the income of the PKV-spouse will be counted towards setting the premiums/contributions into the GKV. So, if one is a stay-at-home-spouse with no real source of income, the monthly dues will not be those minimum contributions around 180 EUR p.m. but will rather climb all the way up to max. 50% of the highest public contribution. 

 

Children can later be insured in GKV, too. But at costs. I.e. the min. monthly contribution has to be paid for each child.

 

Q2: depends on where you move and what kind of health insurance you'll have there. If you move to a location with compulsory national/state health insurance, the PKV can be terminated at once. So, bascially moving to any EU-memberstate will get you out of PKV that way. If you move outside the EU, PKV can (!) be continued if you so wish (which you have to tell your PKV) but otherwise the PKV will get terminated when you deregister your residence from Germany to abroad.

 

Cheerio

 

I am a professional independent insurance broker, financial adviser, and authorised advertiser. Contact me.

Thank you for the very clear answers!!!

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Another small doubt came into my mind: currently as employee half of the health insurance has been paid by the company...but once the pension comes? Is it all up to the person???

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No, as long as you:

  1. will get a German public pension paid out by the Deutsche Rentenversicherung (DRV) and
  2. will have spent at least 90% of the second half of your worklife in an EU public health insurance,

you will only pay half, like before, since DRV will take over from your employer and give you a subsidy of the other half of your health insurance, but only on your DRV public pension.

 

If you will also have another pension when you retire, e.g. a company pension (Betriebsrente), you will have to pay the whole public health&nursing insurance contribution out of your own pocket on that other pension, there is no subsidy on any pension except on the DRV public pension.

 

As a pensioner, you will always have to pay the entire Pflegeversicherung (nursing insurance), which at the moment is 3.05% (3.3% if you didn't have a child) out of your own pocket, there is no subsidy for it.

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On 25/9/2019, 23:43:55, PandaMunich said:

No, as long as you:

  1. will get a German public pension paid out by the Deutsche Rentenversicherung (DRV) and
  2. will have spent at least 90% of the second half of your worklife in an EU public health insurance,

you will only pay half, like before, since DRV will take over from your employer and give you a subsidy of the other half of your health insurance, but only on your DRV public pension.

 

If you will also have another pension when you retire, e.g. a company pension (Betriebsrente), you will have to pay the whole public health&nursing insurance contribution out of your own pocket on that other pension, there is no subsidy on any pension except on the DRV public pension.

 

As a pensioner, you will always have to pay the entire Pflegeversicherung (nursing insurance), which at the moment is 3.05% (3.3% if you didn't have a child) out of your own pocket, there is no subsidy for it.

Sorry...maybe I am stupid but is a bit unclear: currently I am employed full time in a private company. They are paying me also and internal pension funds (benefit of the company). Let imagine that tomorrow I go in pension:

 

Hypothesis 1) I receive the rente and the private fund pension and I am still in private kkv: do I pay the entire monthly amount, which now is split between me and the company??   

 

Hypothesis 2) I get the pension and then I decide to move in Spain or Italy: am I still obliged to pay the private kkv even if I am definitely moving in a country where there is the public health insurance?

 

 

 

 

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1. Yes.

2. No, but you would have to pay it during the cancellation period of your private health insurance contract.

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23 hours ago, PandaMunich said:

1. Yes.

2. No, but you would have to pay it during the cancellation period of your private health insurance contract.

 

So let eimagine that the integration pensione brings 2/300 euro more...in the end the entire monthly payment will be entirely up to me? No support from social? 0 euro? 

 

Where is it written the cancellation period???

If you move out another country how can be possible still to be.obloged to pay????

 

I have some extra question: are there private kkv where is possible to block a maximal cap to pay once in pension??? 

 

 

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1 hour ago, karmakoma said:

 

So let eimagine that the integration pensione brings 2/300 euro more...in the end the entire monthly payment will be entirely up to me? No support from social? 0 euro? 

 

Where is it written the cancellation period???

If you move out another country how can be possible still to be.obloged to pay???

 

I have some extra question: are there private kkv where is possible to block a maximal cap to pay once in pension??? 

 

You need to talk to an insurance specialist.  Even if you do get the right answers to your questions, you clearly have non standard requirements and you would be better served by someone who has time and knowledge to understand and help with the details.

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12 hours ago, zwiebelfisch said:

 

You need to talk to an insurance specialist.  Even if you do get the right answers to your questions, you clearly have non standard requirements and you would be better served by someone who has time and knowledge to understand and help with the details.

 

What are standard requirements sorry?? Now I am even more lost than before...

 

By the way here I need example of calculation otherwise we speak about (as we said in Italy) "Fried air" lol..

 

P.S. I have written to my private insurer to ask how it works with pension quote. Let see if they are clear in answering.

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1 hour ago, karmakoma said:

 

 

P.S. I have written to my private insurer to ask how it works with pension quote. Let see if they are clear in answering.

 

Now that is your wisest decision!

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6 hours ago, karmakoma said:

What are standard requirements sorry?? Now I am even more lost than before...

 

So for most people there actually isnt much choice, they have to get "public" insurance (AOK, TK, etc). 

 

Most of the people interested in private insurance are looking either to minimise payments, or work out how costs change with children etc.

 

Your questions:

 

20 hours ago, karmakoma said:

Where is it written the cancellation period???

 

I dont know if it varies by KK, but for TK its listed here, Id expect most are similar but clearly you need to check the contract: https://www.krankenkassen.de/krankenkasse-wechseln/kuendigung/fristen/

 

20 hours ago, karmakoma said:

If you move out another country how can be possible still to be.obloged to pay???

 

If you sign a contract for a gym or mobile phone and then leave the country you still have to pay to the end of the notice period, right?  Same with health insurance or most other things.

 

20 hours ago, karmakoma said:

are there private kkv where is possible to block a maximal cap to pay once in pension??? 

 

This is what I meant by non standard requirements. As far as I know the answer is no, you pay a kind of risk premium which the KK works out, I dont think they will promise you a set value for the future but you should talk to a professional.

 

 

Not to mention, you are already here and already have insurance (private, if I understand you correctly).  That means some options are not available to you, changing insurance isnt as simple as it perhaps should be.

 

 

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On 6/10/2019, 18:57:15, zwiebelfisch said:

 

So for most people there actually isnt much choice, they have to get "public" insurance (AOK, TK, etc). 

 

Most of the people interested in private insurance are looking either to minimise payments, or work out how costs change with children etc.

 

Your questions:

 

 

I dont know if it varies by KK, but for TK its listed here, Id expect most are similar but clearly you need to check the contract: https://www.krankenkassen.de/krankenkasse-wechseln/kuendigung/fristen/

 

 

If you sign a contract for a gym or mobile phone and then leave the country you still have to pay to the end of the notice period, right?  Same with health insurance or most other things.

 

 

This is what I meant by non standard requirements. As far as I know the answer is no, you pay a kind of risk premium which the KK works out, I dont think they will promise you a set value for the future but you should talk to a professional.

 

 

Not to mention, you are already here and already have insurance (private, if I understand you correctly).  That means some options are not available to you, changing insurance isnt as simple as it perhaps should be.

 

 

Yes I am privata and for now is good ...I am just projecting what will be in 27 years...I am 39 and under private.

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Health insurance. No income but privately insured wifes income used to calculate my insurance rate

 

Greetings. Before I post my query, I think, having just read the previous posts on this thread that Starshollow provided an answer on 25th September 2019, which I believe applies to my case in the main. It does seem somewhat incredulous (not Starshollows explanation but the way the system operates in such an instance)  Am I making a correct comparison between the two cases?

 

Here is my post:

 

How does my wifes income affect my health insurance rate?
 
A few years ago I was luck enough to get onto public insurance with AOK as a freelance English teacher
 
SInce then my German wife (we married the end of 2019)  has qualified as a state highschool teacher and works full time but has opted for private health insurance.
 
Our two young children are insured through me.
 
Until recently I have been paying a modest 201 euro total for Krank... and Pfleig... combined.
Over the last two years my income being decreasing tellingly. 2020 was only about 6000 pre tax profit and this year is 0 income so far (and will stay like this for the rest of this year most probably). On AOKs latest income assessment form I had stated I am now a hausmann as I am the primary carer during the week. I also applied having spoken to an AOK representative for the minimum rate.
 
Today I received a letter which states that my rate has now increased to 333 euro total per month. The reason being that even though i have no income because of Corona, this is based on my wifes income (about 4000 gross) and the fact that she is on private insurance.
 
The bit about not qualifying for family cover because she is private I understand, but the (apparently) high updated rate based on her income I am surprised by. I am trying to figure out the rational and\or the calculated rate and to reach clarity about is it the combined income that is used to calculate the insurance rate.
 
Thank you for your time

 

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