Accused of torrenting copyrighted material

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Anyone at least try to see any movie on-line, stream on-line?

Like this you can see what movie you like and is not called download.

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Just curious... Has anyone received a letter when downloading from a file host such as rapidshare/mediafire/etc? Or is this only happening to people who upload to file hosts and use bittorrent (as it uploads too) ?

 

 

 

It is only happening to people who upload as far as I'm aware..

 

I also thought the same but yesterday a colleague sent me a link to a site that says that people who use rapidshare are also getting a warning letter!?!

 

http://www.rechtsanwaltskanzlei-urheberrecht.de/news/Abmahnung_Rapidshare_Download

 

Unfortunately my German knowledge is not very good to fully understand it. I guess it's a lawyer's site so the article seems to be more like an advertisement/promotion of his services than a real threat for people who use rapidshare or other file hosts.

 

Could someone with a better German knowledge than me confirm that?

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That looks like pure Google-bait to me. Never heard of anyone getting nastygrams for downloading from one of these hosters. And it wouldn't make much sense either.

 

The one thing that makes these P2P Abmahnungen attractive to law firms is that when you're uploading (distributing) copyrighted files, they get to calculate their fees based on the potential future damage of your actions, which is usually in the five figure range. That's not the case when you simply download something.

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Just wondering if anyone here has ever been prosecuted for downloading any tv-series? I read somewhere on this forum that downloading series would somehow be okay? I find this statement a bit weird, especially if the series in question has been released on DVD.

 

Sadly, I've had a couple of letters. I'm sure my initial post is buried somewhere in this thread. I've since become rather well versed on the topic of these injunction letters and the P2P laws.

 

Nobody has been sued yet, but yeah, they are sending out letters for television now, too. Copywrite laws are clear, but they can't get damages from downloaders, so it's not cost effective for them to sue you for the "value" of what you "took".

 

It has nothing to do with Google, it has to do with the cooperation of your ISP (Telekom, Alice, etc). There is a law that says if they are asked within 3 days of the event, they must give your information to the requesting company. There is plenty of 3rd party software which tracks the hash file activity - Google doesn't even enter it. The request letters to the ISP can be generated automatically, and you are caught.

 

The best thing to do is not to react and contact a lawyer. The statue of limitations is 3 years, and the law is such that chasing your for the money is more costly than hoping you panic and throw money at the problem to make it go away, which I'm sure a lot of people do.

 

The thing with the Ünterlassungserklärung sent from the law firm is that it's written badly and opens you up to a law suit in the future, even if you pay what they are asking. It states that you admit doing it (guilt), and universally promise never to share any files, or any kind, ever, and that even if you pay them now, they can sue you later if they feel like it.

 

A lawyer representing you will rewrite it so you do not admit guilt, and only agree not to share that one specific file they are after you about, and closes the loophole to sue you at a later date even if you pay them now. Your lawyer might ask you if you want to offer a settlement or not, and if you ask which is better, they will always suggest "not" - in part because you can always offer later should you need to.

 

This service will typically run you 150-250€. The lawyers representing you are doing thousands of these letters, it's rather routine for them at this point. Most any Media IT-Recht can do it.

 

I found mine by searching Google for the name of the firm which sent the injunction - IT lawyers have blogs which talk about specific letters which are currently being sent out, which is clever marketing if you ask me. Please don't ask me to recommend (I'm not here often enough to respond), these guys are a dime a dozen, just pick one and go with it. This isn't a case where you need an especially tricky lawyer, you just need one who will rewrite the Ünterlassungserklärung and send a letter telling them how wrong they are about the money they are asking for. It's a routine reply to an injunction, and the secretary probably does it.

 

For the guy above who thinks he doesn't have time to explore possibilities... there aren't many options to explore, but certainly, contacting a lawyer is the first step. It can all be done via email, and as soon as you "agree" to hire your lawyer, they fax a letter saying you have legal representation and that he (the lawyer) needs more time. Deadline resolved. If you have a scanner and email - 4 emails later, you can rest (relatively) easy until the statue of limitations passes. Everything can be completed by "post" just as easily, and originals have to be sent via post anyway, so you're only saving a few days time by scanning/faxing, and because you<'ve hired a lawyer, you have time.

 

There are an immense amount of posts in German P2P forums about not having a knee-jerk reaction, and simply contacting a lawyer to respond properly to the injunction. The general consensus is that it's too expensive for the clients of these firms to chase you down. These clients (media companies) are counting on panic to generate payment from injunction recipients - without ever planning to actually sue.

 

However, if you fail to respond to an injunction in time, which is totally avoidable, that one is on you.

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If I download torrents in a internet Cafe, then what happens? Can the cafe owner get into trouble if it is tracked?

 

I would like to download stuff, but not at the cost of getting the poor fellow in trouble.

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Hello,

 

Has anyone received a letter NIMROD Rechtsanwälte? For a video game download (Stronghold 3)? Husband PURCHASED this a while ago. We have several gamer friends who come over and play online games with my husband. We're an Apple family, so all our d/l's are legit and paid for. However, I know we're still at fault for giving our info to our friends to get on our wi-fi. Wondering if anyone has went to the on base Law Center and what their reactions were and what happened? I'm going tomorrow in regards to this letter.

 

I'm pretty freaked out and haven't slept much and I just wanna know what happens! Nothing ever seems to come to a conclusion and I don't feel comfortable just ignoring it. Did you pay a reduced fine? Sign a cease and desist? Please, biting my nails over here trying to find an answer or something to put me at ease for the rest of the day! Thanks in advance!

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Hi Guys i have received a letter from waldorf frommer, with a fine of 956 eur for downloading a movie, i have contacted several lawyers and they are asking 300 eur in order to write a letter and solve this case, the funny thing that at the time and hour of this download i was at my work and nobody at my place , i really dont know what to do, some friends told me just to leave it and dont reply, some say to pay the fine and some say to go to a lawyer. can someone please advice? i also got this letter (attached below) from a colleague can someone please let me know if i could send it to them? this letter have the value as from the ones sent from a lawyer?

 

Einwurf Einschreiben

Vorab per Fax oder E-Mail: 02586 09865 0 oder Abmahnanwalt@abmahner.net

Rechtsanwälte Musterpartnergesellschaft

Mustermannstraße 12

09090 Musterstadt

 

Unterlassungs- und Verpflichtungserklärung

 

Hiermit verpflichte ich,

 

Herr/Frau ______________________________,

(Vorname / Nachname)

 

______________________________________,

(Straße)

 

___________, __________________________,

(PLZ) (Wohnort)

 

______________________________________,

(Aktenzeichen aus der Abmahnung)

 

- nachfolgend “Unterlassungsschuldner“ genannt - mich ohne Anerkennung einer rechtlichen Verpflichtung dazu und ohne Präjudiz für die Sach- und Rechtslage, gleichwohl rechtsverbindlich, gegenüber der Firma

 

Musterrechteinhaber GmbH & Co. KG, Musterstraße 2-3, 51000 Musterberg,

 

- nachfolgend “Unterlassungsgläubigerin“ genannt - dazu, es bei Meidung einer für jeden Fall der Zuwiderhandlung von der Unterlassungsgläubigerin festzusetzende angemessene, im Streitfall durch das zuständige Amts- oder Landgericht zu überprüfende Vertragsstrafe, zu unterlassen,

<Konkrete Bezeichnung, z. B. die geschützte Tonaufnahme/Musikwerk;

das geschützte Musikalbum; das geschützte Filmwerk; das geschützte PC-Game usw.>,

“<Name der Tonaufnahme; Albums; Filmwerk; PC-Game usw.>“,

 

ganz oder Teile daraus öffentlich zugänglich zu machen bzw. öffentlich zugänglich machen zu lassen, insbesondere über so genannte Tauschbörsen im Internet zum elektronischen Abruf bereitzuhalten. Diese Unterlassungsverpflichtung umfasst damit auch die Ermöglichung der Zugänglichmachung über einen dem Unterlassungsschuldner gehörenden WLAN Internetanschluss durch Dritte. Letzteres, indem der Internetanschluss nicht hinreichend gesichert wird, namentlich, indem der WLAN-Anschluss nicht mindestens mittels der Verschlüsselungsmethode WEP geschützt und/oder der WLAN-Router nicht mit einem persönlichen, ausreichend langen und sicheren Passwort versehen wird.

 

Ort, den Datum

 

_________________________________

(rechtsverbindliche Unterschrift)

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It's all covered earlier in this thread. I sent a modified cease-and-desist order, and received a 'reminder' that I hadn't actually paid them (Waldorf-Frommer) the 1800 euros they had requested.

 

You can ignore the 'reminder', but don't ignore the first letter. Follow the advice laid out in this thread concerning how to modify the cease and desist order (Unterlassungserklärung). Then send it to them.

 

That's all based on my own experience. Maybe others have had this method backfire. I really doubt anyone has been taken to court, though.

 

Good luck with it.

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Also, I think you should forget about that letter template your friend sent you. As far as I know, in Germany it's not a legally valid argument (to argue that your wi-fi connection is not secure).

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That's not what the letter says, milf. It promises not to distribute the named works (without admitting that you done this in the past) and explicitly states that this includes making sure that your WiFi is secured reasonably well to keep others from using your internet connections to distribute it.

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ah ok. Apologies. I translated it too recklessly.

 

On second glance, it looks like the version I sent to Waldorf-Frommer. This was September 2011, and (as yet) there have been zero repercussions.

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Hi there,

 

Maybe it has already been discussed in this topic, but it is so large now that we hope you guys don't matter if we aks it again:

 

We are 3 foreign student doing or internships in Berlin. We got a letter from both Waldorf Frommer & Rasch accusing us of filesharing. We didn't share any files but after reading a few messages here we found out that if you have the music on your computer it can be accessed by someone else and can get shared on the internet via your IP adress. We didn't download any music here in Berlin, let alone share it. Last week we got from both the firms a second letter since we ignored the first one. It had almost the same content as the first one and looked like it served as a reminder.

 

We contacted some lawyers but they all asked a minimum of 300 euros. We will all be leaving mid June to our home countries so we will only be staying here for another month. That is also the reason why we really don't feel like paying a lawyer. We feel like it is really unfair and you have to pay or the the one who accuses you, or to the one who is "helping" you while the last one probably already has a letter ready and just needs to fill in the blanks. We are all girls and we don't have a great understanding of how it all works so we hope that you guys can give us some advice. Thanks!

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Do downloaders of pc games get those kind of letters to? from file-hoster sites not torrent. What ISP users usually get those kind of letters?

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These letters are about uploading, not downloading. Going after people for downloading from file hosters is very difficult (if not impossible) because you would need access to the hosters' log files (that they aren't required to keep). It wouldn't make financial sense either, because the amount in dispute based on which the legal fees are calculated would be limited to the price of one copy.

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Looks like I just received a letter from Sasse & Partner alleging download of an episode of Walking Dead Season 2 on my IP address. They want 800 euros. I'm really surprised they are targeting people for TV shows now, especially shows that aren't even available in this country. Really feels like insanity at some point.

 

I've read through most of this thread and still had a couple of questions... Upfront I should probably say my German is only so-so.

 

1) I've seen a few templates in this thread for modifying a UE, but I assume unless the template matches the one I received from Sasse & Partner, then it would be a bad idea to attempt modifying it on my own? Does anyone have one perhaps and can pm me?

 

2) I've seen a few names in this thread for lawyers, but a lot of them are in regards to situations from a year ago or so. Is there any newer suggestions? If so could you please pm me the contact info?

 

3) I'm still not sure on the criteria for what you pay for if you get a lawyer... you pay for his fees of course but when do/don't you settle at that point with the requesting law firm? Just don't pay them to start and see what happens? That's pretty scary.

 

The best part is I just received this letter, and they've given me one week to respond.

 

I will call law offices start of next week, but it would be good to have a clearer overview before I do that. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

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You better see any tv show or movie on-line.

Like that you will see only a stream on-line, without any sharing or downloading any file.

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Last week we got from both the firms a second letter since we ignored the first one.

 

Just to say, again, for the umpteenth time in big flashing letters - DO NOT IGNORE LETTERS DEMANDING MONEY IN GERMANY - even if you think the demand is without any merit.

 

As a general rule always, always, always do some research first - simply putting the sender's name and the letter text into Google is probably enough. The classic Nigerian scams you can safely ignore obviously but almost everything else deserves a response, especially if it arrives recorded delivery. If in doubt then it is safest to respond as missing a legally enforceable deadline can mean you must pay up and you have very little further to argue about.

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