Accused of torrenting copyrighted material

3,143 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, siltsunrise said:

At least a good guy got a chunk of it,

 

He probably gets several chunks a day. He is part of a cottage industry that gets rich off of the uninformed.

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Uninformed or chancing it?  I guess the uninformed might think you can get something for free. I don't really have any compassion for those who think everything is just   there for them, on the net or elsewhere. 

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7 hours ago, snowingagain said:

I have this vision that Frommer have related companies that offer deals on how to deal with Frommer.  

Yer seems like they`re running some sort of racket.What better way to get your money than to also have some sort of influence on the lawyer that`s trying to stop you getting your money.

4 hours ago, Elljay said:

Uninformed or chancing it? 

I think there`s a few that really don`t realise it is illegal however I think most of them are probably just chancing it.

Who would honestly believe there is nothing illegal about downloading a film and watching it for free on the same day or sometimes even before it is released  in the cinema

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11 hours ago, fraufruit said:

 

He probably gets several chunks a day. He is part of a cottage industry that gets rich off of the uninformed and chancers.

 

Fixed it.

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So the other day I received a letter claiming I was downloading/uploading the Joker on 4th of Feb. 5 in the morning for 23 seconds (Yeah I know, what a claim eh, who wouldn't download/upload a movie 3 hours before work!?)

Don't get me wrong, I do pirate but its never movies/songs. I have never, ever watched the Joker aside from the nice trailer. I went to my appdata/local/qbit and checked for filehash there and the one they sent me with the letter isn't there (I was just making sure if I have downloaded it but haven't watched and forgot about it, but confirmed myself that I have not)

Fine is 900 bucks. Should I fight it or try to settle?

 

Its waldorf by the way, for those curious

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I guess you were sleeping right ?

 

Therefore, you you would not be using any data, therefore login to your router and look if route had any large amounts of data going through it at that time - if not they may have made a mistake. formalize it by asking your ISP was any data down loaded at that time, if they say no ( get a letter ) - then write to waldorf say you denie it and should then the letter which shows nothing was downloaded at that time

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Thats a good one, but I doubt it'll help. I don't turn off PC most of the time, tho I never leave any torrenting programs running and Waldorf claims I have downloaded/seeded just for 23 seconds. So thats not really a huge amount of data. I already checked for logs if anyone else logged in (I live alone) but the router doesn't keep as data for more than 2-3 days...

I guess I'll check in with Vodafone and see if they can provide any info on data usage for the past month, its a start.

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On 22/02/2020, 16:24:40, Maldah said:

Fine is 900 bucks. Should I fight it or try to settle?

Its waldorf by the way, for those curious

What happened next? :unsure:

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On 6/20/2020, 4:37:17, lunaCH said:

What happened next? :unsure:

I had a similar experience. They send threatening letters, always offering you a way out if you sign their paper. NEVER EVER SIGN THE PAPER. This went on for an year or more, then I got an yellow letter from the Court and I replied at once denying all charges and send it by registered post.

 

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I rent a flat out with internet provided. My tenant allegedly torrented copyright material for a few minutes. WF sent me the threatening letters but I explained that I considered myself neither a Täter nor a Störer according to the law and after a bit of to and fro they confirmed in writing that they did not consider me liable. I threatened them with court if they did not confirm it within 2 weeks. The same argument works for a WG or family situation. As long as someone else could have plausibly committed the act you are able to get out of it. 

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3 hours ago, pappnase said:

@murphaph Did you have to pass on details of your tenants in order to 'pass the buck' or did you have a way around that?

 

Shouldn't it be up to the sender of the threatening letters to find this out for themselves?

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You do have to name the other person or people that could plausibly have done the deed. You can't just say a person unknown must have done it. But one person is enough and that person can point the finger back at you and that's a legal dead end for WF. In my case I spoke with my tenant first and he admitted it but I never told WF that. My tenant was never pursued by them AFAIK. I believe these things are as good as unenforceable unless the person lives alone. I'd say you could just make the other party up and they'd have to accept that to be honest. You just have to stand your ground.

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In theory even the internet connection itself could be in someone else's name and that person may not even exist. As long as the bills are being paid, it's fairly easily to set up a line.

The companies sending these letters could well come to a dead end.

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Just now, yesterday said:

they can ask for the name of the person paying the bills, and take it from their

 They may not even have it. 

Even if they do, I don't know if the internet company is obliged to pass on that information.

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normally, they have your IP address, they ask the IP provider for that IP address who the owner is, the IP provider has to by law tell the asking lawyer - that's why @murphaph, got the bill. As he was paying the bill for the internet in the flat he rents out. Of course murphaph, just explained he was not living there, and forwarded the problem to his tenant

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6 minutes ago, yesterday said:

normally, they have your IP address, they ask the IP provider for that IP address who the owner is, the IP provider has to by law tell the asking lawyer - that's why @murphaph, got the bill. As he was paying the bill for the internet in the flat he rents out. Of course murphaph, just explained he was not living there, and forwarded the problem to his tenant

This much was already clear. Though Murphaph may not have been legally obliged to pass on any information other than saying that he did not live at that address, but was the merely the person who set up the line. Passing on the name might not be legally right.

 

Separately it is also possible to have an internet line in the name of a person who does not exist. This was the point. As long as that name is on the letterbox to receive the bills to pay the connection, there wouldn't be an issue. The bills may even come by email, so there would be no name needed on the letterbox at all. 

The internet company would pass on the name of the inexistent person to the company who wants to send the threatening letter and it as this point that they may come to a dead end. ;)

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2 minutes ago, lunaCH said:

This much was already clear. Though Murphaph may not have been obliged to pass on

 

If murphaph, had not said it was for his rented flat and some one else was living there, then he would be held responsible for the download.

2 minutes ago, lunaCH said:

any information other than saying that he did not live at that address, but was the merely the person who set up the line. 

 

Separately it is also possible to have an internet line in the name of a person who does not exist. This was the point. As long as that name is on the letterbox to receive the bills to pay the connection, there wouldn't be an issue. The bills may even come by email, so there would be no name needed on the letterbox at all. 

The internet company would pass on the name of the inexistent person to the company who wants to send the threatening letter and it as this point that they may come to a dead end. ;)

 

When you take an internet connection, you have to give your name and address, also you normally give then  a bank account to pay for the internet connection

 

All of this information can be used to track you down

 

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8 minutes ago, yesterday said:

If murphaph, had not said it was for his rented flat and some one else was living there, then he would be held responsible for the download.

I don't doubt that. But I'm unsure of the obligation to give a name. 

 

8 minutes ago, yesterday said:

When you take an internet connection, you have to give your name and address, also you normally give then  a bank account to pay for the internet connection

All of this information can be used to track you down

You don't always have to give a bank account. Anonymous payments are possible. ;) 

 

The address is obvious. But if you give a name of a non-existent person then the threatening letter is going to that non-existent person. That was the point. 

I do appreciate that it is highly unlikely anyone would set it up this way just so that they can use torrents. I was merely pointing out that it is possible. And some people would certainly go to such lengths to cover their tracks if they are doing other illegal stuff online. ;) 

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