PHP developer salary

51 posts in this topic

Hi,

 

I've been working as a freelancer for a Hnnover based company for the past 7 years, doing typo3 / php development, server administration, a.s.o.

We are in talks to get me relocated to Hannover and work as a full time employee. I was offered 2500€ per mo brute, and the company will not support my relocation with any costs.

 

Is this a fair salary considering my experience with them?

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Is this a fair salary considering my experience with them?

 

No.

 

Are you sure that with 7 years experience they are only offering you 2500€/month gross (brutto)?

 

Is it a position that requires a degree? Recent graduates receive more.

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I'd say it isn't. What type of PHP development did you do? Proper Software Development, e.g. using a solid framework like ZEND? Or mostly maintenance of a CMS? Do you have a degree in a related area?

 

2500 EUR "Brutto" sounds too low, given the experience. Common salaries for junior software developers, i.e. with vocational training are around 30-40k pa. With a degree it's likely to be 40k+. If they have seven years of good experience with you, the least they could do is offer 1-2k for relocation and 3000-3500 per month.

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Yeah, I am sure. The offer was made/discussed verbally. We even went over the taxes and talked about how much i would get as a net salary (~1700 euro).

 

The job itself doesn't require a degree but I did graduated a computer/science college 3 years ago.

 

How much should I expect though?

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If you are good, you should be getting minimum 4K per month. Especially after 7yrs, that's a long time to be programming. Even in Berlin you could swing that w/o much difficulty. (I've never investigated working in Hannover but assuming it's got a higher COL and better opportunity though perhaps that's not true as there's a relatively healthy demand in Berlin for developers (why not come to Berlin? :D))

 

Do you only do PHP Typo or do you do JS and front-end as well? Design? If you're limited to Typo then disregard my above statement, but even so it sounds low.

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I'd say it isn't. What type of PHP development did you do? Proper Software Development, e.g. using a solid framework like ZEND? Or mostly maintenance of a CMS? Do you have

As web developer I worked with Zend for 2 projects, did cms template implementations, cms maintenance and extension programming (typo3/extbase).

As sysadmin I did usual LAMP stuff, configured nginx for caching server, loadbalancing, mysql replication (master/master, master/slave), virtual mail server setup plus administration script (100% in house, zend).

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I've never investigated working in Hannover but assuming it's got a higher COL and better opportunity

I lived in Hannover for 5 months and I hated it. It is small, ugly, and provincial (granted this was also 10 years ago).

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Do you only do PHP Typo or do you do JS and front-end as well? Design?

JS/CSS development is a regular work for me. Usually I get a few png screens with the designs and specifications and i have to implement them in the cms.

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OK so then you are well-rounded, experienced developer expert in typo, zend, and server administration. You can definitely be asking for 4K+ per month.

 

Have you sent your CV to other companies?

 

And how's your german?

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I hate to say it, but women tend to get much lower offers, even in IT. I've seen it too many times for it to be just a coincidence. A good friend of mine in Frankfurt, with several years of experience, told me what she was making and I was shocked. I knew for a fact that a male colleague of hers, straight out of uni, was making more than she was.

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I haven't lived in Germany for a while... But I'm fairly sure there is now way, that 2500 gross will come out as 1700 after taxes. It's more likely to be around 1400 or less.

 

Okay, the way you describe your experience and responsibilities, you should aim for 3800+ per month, at least. Everything else would be severly underpaid. I know a few experienced PHP guys (5-10 years) without a Uni degree, who now earn around 55k pa.

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I hate to say it, but women tend to get much lower offers, even in IT. I've seen it too many times for it to be just a coincidence. A good friend of mine in Frankfurt, with several years of experience, told me what she was making and I was shocked. I knew for a fact that a male colleague of hers, straight out of uni, was making more than she was.

 

Women AND Eastern European in her case.

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Have you sent your CV to other companies?

 

And how's your german?

No I haven't sent my CV to any other companies, but I am considering it now...

 

Yes, my german is non-existent. It wasn't required in my time @current company, but I'm aware of how that would be an impediment.

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I hate to say it, but women tend to get much lower offers, even in IT. I've seen it too many times for it to be just a coincidence. A good friend of mine in Frankfurt, with several years of experience, told me what she was making and I was shocked. I knew for a fact that a male colleague of hers, straight out of uni, was making more than she was.

 

Just out of curiosity is that also because she didnt argue and push for raises? Me and another colleague had such issues and we argued with management for ages (it took months) but finally got salary corrections, still below what market rate was but it took a long slog to get it. Subsequently 2 others left and I am on my way out too and the company is much more accomodating and regretful.

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I can't say what her (as well as that of all of the other female collegues, whose salary I was aware of) negotiation skills are like, but oddly, I've only been shocked at a male colleague's salary once, and his was low due to lack of a degree, so at least somewhat founded.

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Just out of curiosity is that also because she didnt argue and push for raises?

This is their 1st offer.

 

I am disappointed in it, but since I am not familiar with german wages I wanted to see how good my assessment was.

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Well, now you know :)

 

I hate salary negotiations, but it's a necessary evil. I see women getting screwed over there so many times, just because they are more likely to seek a compromise. When I negotiated my wage for a new contract in the same organisation, I quizzed a few colleagues with similar expierence/degrees. I then asked for the same pay, without disclosing any names. They'll find it hard to argue in this case. But I do understand, it's not always that simple

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OK, I was also suprised by the salary points of some of my staff without degrees. Technician level since they were worth many times more than the new engineers we took on. I would have happily traded them.

 

Sorry I dont know anything about IT salary levels, but I spoke to alot of people and looked on random sites like glassdoor (non-us one) and afew others for my negotiations and it was a loooooooong fight for me. At the end of the day, depends if your happy with it or not. Your not stuck with it, as you can push for a raise later or even just change jobs easily especially within the probezeit.

 

Or you can ask for benefits in kind, e.g more time off, things like that.

 

In general, I would say its always better to put in a counter offer instead of just accepting the first offer. As long as it is not ridiculous and you push your key strenghts. The worse that can happen, they say no.

 

Good luck and hope you get a good offer.

 

Oh I forgot, they should also definitely offer some relocation if your moving cities, just to cover costs and 1 or 2 days off for moving.

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In general, I would say its always better to put in a counter offer instead of just accepting the first offer. As long as it is not ridiculous and you push your key strenghts. The worse that can happen, they say no.

I would agree, if the salary were in the general ballpark. If their offer is less than half of what you're expecting, then there really isn't a point.

 

At one interview, my expectations were about 15% more than they offered and I negotiated and we came to an agreement. At another interview, the guy interviewing me (my would-be boss) said, "I don't even make that much!". There was no point in continuing the conversation at that point.

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Another golden rule: If a company pays considerable less than usual market salaries, it's likely the work atmosphere is going to be shit, too.

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