Americans being deported

Are deportations on the rise?   77 votes

  1. 1. Are deportations on the rise?


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Over the past few weeks I have come across more and more unfair deportation cases in the media.

These nice people are getting perniciously booted out for small mistakes and oversights.

It seems to me that this is happening more frequently and these cases demonstrate how unfair the process can be.

However, my better half claims that Germans get unfairly kicked out more often in the U.S. then the other way around.

 

American to be deported [stuttgarter-zeitung.de]

 

American in Duisburg Faces Deportation [derwesten.de]

 

 

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Why do you think it's happening more frequently? Hasn't it always been like this? :unsure:

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This raises something I was thinking about recently, how do the various world's governments decide on immigration policies? In a lot of countries it seems arbitrary at best, discriminatory at worst.

 

Shouldn't citizens of certain countries, (the UK and the US for example) be given certain privileges and passes when applying for residency in Germany? Ok, the latter is not really relevant because the UK is already an EU member which exemplifies its citizens from most living/working restrictions, but for historical reasons, shouldn't US citizens be given more lenient treatment?

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This raises something I was thinking about recently, how do the various world's governments decide on immigration policies? In a lot of countries it seems arbitrary at best, discriminatory at worst.

 

There are many factors: politics, demographics, economics, etc.

 

 

Shouldn't citizens of certain countries, (the UK and the US for example) should be given certain privileges and passes when applying for residency in Germany?

 

Actually Americans (as well as citizens of a few other countries) do have special privileges in Germany. For example, Americans can enter Germany without a permit and then apply to change their status here within 90 days of arrival. Can Germans do the same in America?

 

 

but for historical reasons, shouldn't US citizens be given more lenient treatment?

 

Why?

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Im not sure what you mean by unfair. My understanding is that most countries, especially the US have an extreme low tolerance of illegal immigration, which like it or not includes people who overstay visas or fail to complete correct paperwork.

 

I have no doubt that if I (a brit) were to go to the US and found myself without correct up to date papers that things would go very wrong very quick. All foreigners in all countries know this and should work hard to ensure they are always within the rules.

 

It sounds to me like these are people who could have easily had correct paperwork, and it is sad that in these specific cases they did not. But the fault is really with them, not enforcement of the rules.

 

I know plenty of americans that I have met in Berlin who have tried desperately to get work or become students so that they can stay legally. I cannot honestly say that many who have left would have done so if it were not for the threat of draconian measures for people who "forget". So in a way I understand why the authorities feel the need to be strict.

 

FWIW it is also true for people that are not american, many Indians I know have to be very careful.

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A NZ friend of mine had some immigration problems with the US

 

She studied in the US for 1 year some time ago, however she didn't receive her student visa until after she was already in the country. She should have left and then reentered to activate it, but didn't know to do this, which meant she was there illegally after 90 days.

 

So a few years ago, she went to the US for a wedding and was refused entry and sent back to Germany, banned from reentering for 5 years and stripped of her visa waiver rights for life.

 

All for what was essentially a technicality.

 

They didn't show her any leniency or compassion and treated her as a criminal - and she even had the correct visa in her passport...

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Actually Americans (as well as citizens of a few other countries) do have special privileges in Germany. For example, Americans can enter Germany without a permit and then apply to change their status here within 90 days of arrival. Can Germans do the same in America?

 

Yes they can- I did it myself for a spouse who entered via Visa Waiver (unmarried when she entered, BTW).

 

What goes on in the US for people with immigration problems or who are there illegally is a straw man as regards the treatment of US citizens in Germany, and I wouldn't hold us up as a Vorbild. I wouldn't be surprised if it's actually harder to immigrate to Canada than the US given Canada's emphasis on skilled immigration.

 

If the above posts are any indication, there is a perception that the US is a lot tougher on people who are there illegally than is often the reality. For a non-criminal who is found to be in the US illegally, it used to be the case that they were released on their own recognizance and told to appear at some future date in front of an immigration judge to be ordered deported, and I would be surprised if that were no longer the case. You can imagine just how few people actually showed up to their deportation hearing.

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And this morning I realized my visa expired last week. Might be three of us booted...

 

Sucks for you dude, good luck. I hate going to the Audlander office. I purposely do not go until I get a few letters then show up acting surprised. Chances are I will get a particular dude so thats why I do it. It pisses him off, and it meets my "passive agressive" quota for the week. He tells me that my german is horrible through his thick bavarian accent, and I usually respond your's too.

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Yes they can- I did it myself for a spouse who entered via Visa Waiver (unmarried when she entered, BTW).

 

What about single workers? An American citizen with no other qualifications other than being a native English speaker can receive a freelance permit to teach English in Germany. If they can manage to keep their heads above water with it for three years, they get full access to the German labour market and after another two years can apply for an NE (if they play their cards right). What opportunities are there for foreigners who arrive in the States without any qualifications other than their language skills? Do they have any chance at a green card?

 

 

I wouldn't be surprised if it's actually harder to immigrate to Canada than the US given Canada's emphasis on skilled immigration.

 

I'm not so sure, it depends on the category we are considering.

 

I admit that I don’t know the American system, but my sister who has a Bachelors of Commerce, CPA, CIA, and over 8 years experience wanted to put her green card application in last year while she was Director of Finance for a small subsidiary in the States. The process would have taken about two years and during this time if she had changed jobs (even within the same company) she would have had to start the process all over again. I will probably have my NE for Germany much sooner than she’ll receive a green card (and although I have a Masters, I have to admit that I don’t have the industry experience she does).

 

With the respect to the Canadian system, it is possible for skilled workers in positions that are considered in demand to immigrate (I’m not convinced that the government is any good at actually correctly determining what is in demand, but that is a separate story). It is therefore possible for chefs to easily immigrate without a degree.

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It sounds to me like these are people who could have easily had correct paperwork, and it is sad that in these specific cases they did not. But the fault is really with them, not enforcement of the rules.

 

Indeed. They couldn't be bothered to go the effort that many, many immigrants do in order to build a (legal) life in Germany. I'm sure many of that other group would happily not have bothered either.

 

They took a chance and accepted a risk they could have avoided and it did not go their way. As they might have expected. Such is life.

 

But, yes of course, citizens of our nations should be granted certain privileges. Just citizens of other nations (poorer ones with mainly brown-skined citizens) who should jolly well not be allowed to do what we should get as a birthright.

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What about single workers? An American citizen with no other qualifications other than being a native English speaker can receive a freelance permit to teach English in Germany. If they can manage to keep their heads above water with it for three years, they get full access to the German labour market and after another two years can apply for an NE (if they play their cards right). What opportunities are there for foreigners who arrive in the States without any qualifications other than their language skills? Do they have any chance at a green card?

 

I'm not so sure, it depends on the category we are considering.

 

I admit that I don’t know the American system, but my sister who has a Bachelors of Commerce, CPA, CIA, and over 8 years experience wanted to put her green card application in last year while she was Director of Finance for a small subsidiary in the States. The process would have taken about two years and during this time if she had changed jobs (even within the same company) she would have had to start the process all over again. I will probably have my NE for Germany much sooner than she’ll receive a green card (and although I have a Masters, I have to admit that I don’t have the industry experience she does).

 

With the respect to the Canadian system, it is possible for skilled workers in positions that are considered in demand to immigrate (I’m not convinced that the government is any good at actually correctly determining what is in demand, but that is a separate story). It is therefore possible for chefs to easily immigrate without a degree.

 

Monolinguals who don't speak English or don't speak much English (the equivalent of the US citizens you are referring to), and don't have other skills almost certainly aren't going to get an occupational green card, although it should be mentioned that a significant number of occupational green cards do not go to highly skilled people. They would end up doing unskilled work illegally, which probably is easier to do than here in Germany and, they would have a shot at a green card if they married a US citizen or legal resident.

 

I wasn't aware that getting permission to work for any employer was possible for single freelance English teachers short of marriage, but it should be mentioned that their situation isn't usually comparable to that of language teachers in the US- we expect our language teachers to have teaching credentials as well as language skills in English and at least one other language. My mother got an initial job and later permanent residency in the US because she could teach multiple languages. Germany apparently views teaching English to adult learners in Germany as just requiring being a native speaker, which isn't the case in the US, hence it's an apples-to-oranges comparison.

 

As for your sister's situation, that's how long it usually takes for anyone to get a permanent green card, which presumably is what she wanted. What does she have now- an employer based one?

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you don't have to spange, dude, you can sell your art. LA hipsters are probably dying for "authentic" Latino art, even if said Latino is really a Chicano. p.s. the more homeless the Latino the more "authentic" the art. FYI.

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However, they would have a shot at a green card if they married a US citizen or legal resident.

 

Marriage doesn't count. Pretty much all countries will (eventually) issue a permit to the spouse of a citizen and very often also to the spouse of a long-term resident; it is usually just a matter of time. I'm referring to immigration opportunities for workers, not family reunification.

 

 

I wasn't aware that getting permission to work for any employer was possible for single freelance English teachers short of marriage

 

You obviously haven't read the Zuwanderungsgesetz. ;) After three years of continuous legal residence in Germany (only half the time on a study permit to a maximum of two years) it is possible to apply for "Beschäftigung erlaubt", which grants the holder the right to work for any employer (§9 BeschVerV).

 

 

Germany apparently views teaching English as just requiring being a native speaker, which isn't the case in the US, hence it's apples-to-oranges.

 

Which is actually my point. The bar in Germany is actually quite low for native English speakers from OECD countries. An unskilled American citizen has a shot of receiving full access to the labour market 3 years after arrival and permanent residence after 5 years. A comparably unskilled foreigner has no chance in the States (and admittedly also not in Canada).

 

 

As for your sister's situation, that's how long it usually takes for anyone to get a permanent green card, which presumably is what she wanted. What does she have now- an employer based one?

 

She had an employer based permit and was supposed to activate her H1B1, but she quit her job a few months ago and is spending the summer vacationing in Asia. Her plan is to look for a new job when she gets back to New York, but I honestly have no idea what'll happen with her visa situation (and she can look up the laws on her own, German and Canadian immigration law is enough for me :) ).

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