Marriage Annulment in Germany

[ugobeka 58]

Ok its complictad but not impossible to get out of this. i trust the germans in handling such cases, especially when beating is involved. Infact beating is sometimes concidered more deadly than murder!

so the best way, is just take Cindy to the Police, they will get her to the appropriate women organisation. from my experience...they can initiate everything (Cindy is rein gelegt)and when they finish, believe me, even the police will need extra permission to know linders Address. so there is no issue of the grooms family or the guy trying to harm her.BUT be sure the love bird CINDY is totaly with you!! theres the risk of her changing her mind again telling you she still loves and misses him. oh yeah its possible to a great extent, so be careful to know where she stands.

this is a lesson to learn by parents-only at the age of 18 you are hurrying your daughter into marriage.what does she know? has she finished her school??? believe me some people should nt be allowed to deliever children!

[SJ1 2,050]

She was not forced to marry, that has already been clarified. Parents will always have opinions. Mine thought I was nuts for leaving school and moving to Germany to marry a German, they love him now. Should I not have done it because my mom said no. Parents voice opinions, adult children make their own decisions. The dad even vocalized his disapproval. WHat more do you want? She likely would have done it even if mom said no. To suggest they not be parents because the mom supported the daughters personal choice, absolute bull shit.

 

I agree make sure she is 100% on board, many people in these volatile relationships go back and forth.

[medic82 890]

Yup I don't know for sure if she is 100% ready to leave him. To clarify, they do not live together yet. I wanted to talk to the dad about this this morning, but my wife is saying no because the sister needs to do that.

[medic82 890]

Seriously though, Cindy has flipped back and forth so many times, from being done with him, to being back with him. I think it is a terrible idea for them to have even gotten married, and once they live together it is going to get worse, I wonder why I am the only one he sees it and thinks something should be done about it. It just really pisses me off. Wife thinks Cindy should decide about telling the father about the physical abuse, I mean lets face it we all have arguments with our spouses and say some nasty things at times, but I think it is a problem when it gets physical, and especially over something like her looking at someone else.

 

Gotta add though that this guy is from Eastern Turkey also, I am really not feeling this whole thing, but I guess I have to play it cautiously, If we press her too hard to leave him, she might just want him more. I belive perhaps the best option might be to give him enough rope to hang himself. "wedding date" is set for end of may. I am sure between now and then he will show himself more. When I say wedding date, I mean the day where friends and family are invited, blah blah blah his family comes to pick her up from her parents, we go to a hall, eat, drink, dance, we go home, they now go home together and consumate the marriage.

[medic82 890]

 

Actually the first thing she should do is get to a SAFE place, THEN call the police. If she calls the police while still at home, he could really harm her. Getting out of an abusive relationship can be very difficult if the women is dependant on the man.

 

She still lives at home with the parents. so she is in a safe place.

[Wheel 404]

Non-consummation isn't grounds for annulment according to this page, assuming that they married under German law. So it's divorce or they continue married.

 

Unless they got married under Turkish law, which I suppose is a possibility as they got married at the consulate, in which case the law may be different.

[Melf 16]

 

In the eyes of the German authorities are they even considered to be married?

 

No. The consulate is a playground.

[kiil 149]

I feel that this whole undertaking is fraught with risk. As stated by you Medic82, both participants are Turkish, are according to Turkish law married and it seems that the marital status has been conveyed to German authorities. So even if Cindy could find a way to get Germany to accept an annulment I seriously doubt that Turkey is going to accept it. As long as she stays here normally this should not matter; but it seems that her Turkish identity and connection are important. So the question is how far is Cindy willing to go? Now she is 19 and you mention that she was born here in Germany. According to German law she still has a few years left to her to decide that she wants to take on German citizenship — she is old enough to decide to do so now — can she even imagine that and how will her family react to that? Otherwise she is going to have to get a Turkish annulment or divorce if she wants to remarry under Turkish law.

 

Someone needs to find a lawyer or aid association who is knowledgeable in Turkish law.

 

On a side note as long as Cindy is not ready to face facts and her family members are not prepared to deal with unpleasant details as well as finding the courage to inform Cindy's father of relevant details ...

 

Well, the rest I am sure you can fill in yourself. It is Cindy's life to live.

[brookeb 1]

I have to say it is very irresponsible for you and your wife to know that he has hit her and not only call the police but let her parents know! She can not do it herself as I am sure she is scared and very emotional at this time. She obviously is way to young and naive and you MUST tell her parents and go to the police you are putting her in Danger and as family you have to look out for her and do whats the best for her. Please keep us updated. I can see you care and you want to tell her parents and the authorities but you too are letting fear take hold, you know whats right now just do it!

[MrNosey 5,326]

Cindy's mother is stupid for pushing her daughter into a clearly doomed marriage - Cindy's father needs to slap some sense into his wife with the back of his hand.

It seems Cindy is also taking after her mother and needs a serious slapping to wake her up. It is obvious she needs to stay away from this guy and from her mother and beg her father to help her get out of the huge mess she (with the encouragement of her own stupid mother) got herself into by being stupid, stupid, stupid.

[pappnase 2,571]

@Mr Nosey, If you are serious then you make me sick.

if you are 'only joking' about slapping people in a thread about abusive relationships you are just being a dick.

I really hope for your sake you never find yourself in a state where your partner is abusing you it just doesn't have a funny side.

[RainyDays 2,453]

The situation seems really messed up. It would have been best if the marriage was ended (by divorce or annulment) as quietly as possible and without one party losing face. The physical and verbal abuse by Paul however shouldn't be swept under the carpet, it would send out the wrong signal to him. But a police report is the opposite of backing out quietly out of this mess. In any case, I also think that it would only be fair towards Cindy's parents to inform them about how much the "problems" have escalated. Cindy probably isn't willing to tell the whole truth because that would mean admitting that the marriage project was a big mistake, so someone else has to put the parents in the picture.

 

Here's some more info about the legal side: Kanzlei Yildiz. Again, it seems that Turkish law is applicable; these matters are part of international private law:

 

 

Bei gleicher Staatsangehörigkeit gilt das gemeinsame Heimatrecht (Art.17 EGBGB). Bei einem türkischen Ehepaar gilt für die Scheidung türkisches Recht (Art. 17 Abs. l Satz l, 14 EGBGB).

 

 

In Deutschland lebende türkisch-türkische Paare haben die Wahl, ob sie sich in der Türkei oder in Deutschland scheiden lassen. Dabei müssen deutsche Gerichte allerdings türkisches Recht anwenden.

 

Only if one partner acquires German citizenship, even after marriage, German divorce law could become relevant.

 

 

Das gilt nicht unbedingt für den Fall, dass einer der beiden Partner nach der Eheschließung Deutscher geworden ist.

I reiterate the suggestion brought forward by others to contact either a Frauenhaus – they should be able to point you to other services or specialised lawyers – or any other help organisation for family conflicts (they should be listed on your city's homepage under "Familie", "Soziales" or "Beratung").

 

Here's another help website: Sibel - Papatya

[tom_a 459]

 

Cindy is my sister in-law ... I wanted to talk to the dad about this this morning, but my wife is saying no because the sister needs to do that.

 

You are family, her parents are apparently loving and supportive, she is being physically abused, and she is obviously rather immature. Based on this, it's certainly fully appropriate to tell her parents everything you know. It's not meddling, it's being a responsible and caring member of the family. Police is maybe another matter, but telling her own parents is a no-brainer surely.

[MrNosey 5,326]

 

@Mr Nosey, If you are serious then you make me sick.

if you are 'only joking' about slapping people in a thread about abusive relationships you are just being a dick.

I really hope for your sake you never find yourself in a state where your partner is abusing you it just doesn't have a funny side.

 

You don't think his slapping has helped her? Clearly it has. Slapping her probably released the adrenaline she so badly needed in her brain. If he had slapped her earlier in their relationship she'd have woken up earlier to the fact that he is an asshole and never have even got married to him. Then she would have not been as deep in the crap as she is now. Getting slapped across the face isn't very nice but at least she has finally woken up to him -a little later than ideal- but still not so late that she had finally shacked up with him, got pregnant and felt obliged to stay with him -'cause he can't help it' or some other lame excuse for his behaviour or because of culture- only to finally end up being murdered in an 'honour killing' or at the very least suffering years of abuse and misery.

When love walks in the door sense jumps out the window - at least with some people. It sounds like this girl has had a lucky break.

[pappnase 2,571]

 

You don't think his slapping has helped her?

 

Nope, I really don't.

 

medic82 and "Cindy" have a really tricky situation here, and talk about hitting her isn't going to help anyone.

 

I can't ever conceive of a time when hitting a person is the best or even the right course of action.

 

If you really believe that more violence is a good way to resolve this, then I stand by my original post and I continue to hope no-one ever teaches you how wrong you are by using your own methods against you.

 

I suggest we stop this discussion now though since it has nothing to do with Medic's question and you and I arguing really won't help Cindy.

[medic82 890]

Ok, so Today, had a long chat with the dad. Talked about Cindy's situation, and asked him what is happening. Cindy has complained to her father also about not being happy in the relationship. Paul was asked to come over on Friday to explain his side of the story. As expected he denied ever being verbally abusive to her and yelling at her in public. Cindy's dad told me that paul had a rather condesending tone to his voice when speaking, and he just did not appreciate the behavior.

 

Cindy did not tell her dad about the physical abuse. Her dad told her on saturday that she needs to make a choice, he won't keep her away from someone she loves, but he thinks that Paul is completely wrong for her. Cindy then said she would like to end the relationship. So today when I spoke to the dad I also added my opinion and told him that Annulment or Divorce is the best thing, and that as parents they need to support their daughter, but also there are times when they have to step in and protect her. I told them to make sure they do not allow her to go back on her decision.

 

The father never wanted to marriage to happen anyway, he had warned Cindy that the Paul and her together were just not good together. They both want to be the cowboy. Father is contacting a Turkish divorce lawyer tomorrow and getting this issue resolved. he says it's ok that Cindy will have a a divorce, but it's better than waiting a year or two and then getting a divorce. The mom is also now saying that they should not be together, because paul will just end up killing cindy at some point in their marriage.

 

So end story as it is now, is that They will start divorce or annulment proceedings ASAP, keep Cindy away from any unnecessary contact with Paul, cancel all that had been bought for the new apartment that they were going to move into, and pray that Cindy has learned an important lesson.

 

I did not mention the physical abuse, because the relationship is over. If there was any chance that this relationship might spark back up, then I would definitely mention it. Cindy might get mad at me or my wife, but I would rather that, than a dead Cindy down the line.

 

Now we just gotta figure out how best we can help Cindy deal with the upcoming depression that she is bound to go through. Been in her room all weekend with the shades down, just watching TV, at least she does talk, she just doees not feel like going out of the house.

[medic82 890]

Omg Cindy has flipped again, and now has flipped yet again. She says tomorrow she will go herself and get the divorce underway. I am slowly letting her know that she needs to inform the police about the abuse. Even if just to have it on file.

[SJ1 2,050]

You cannot help those who are unwilling to help themselves.

[medic82 890]

well I can definitely try to help her though. So had a long talk with her, just basically explained to her that I understand that she does love the guy, but love is not going to solve everything in their relationship. Her father has now taken a hands off approach to this issue, and has said he is not in support of the marriage,but if she wants to do it, then she can do it on her own, he will not be part of it.

 

I asked her if she thought he would start beating her often if they were living together. She answered with an embarassed yes. Then I asked her if she can live with that and accept that. She said no. Told her well why are we even having this discussion. I told her that if this was going to really work, she would not even be going back and forth on this issue, all that is happening now is things are getting delayed.

 

In her defense though, whenever she is away from him and does not pick up his calls, she is pretty consistent about not wanting to be with him. It's just the moment he gets to her head, then she starts getting confused. She says she will go tomorrow and try to start the divorce proceedings. Thing is though this girl is only 19, has no freaking clue where to start

[Guest]

I think that Cindy should start to live in the 21st century, and remember that she lives in a civilized, modern, secular country...not in some backward province of the Middle-East (yes, Turkey doesn't belong to Europe, and will never be...sorry, but the door of the EU is shut for them, and should always remain so...). The rest should come naturally...

 

If she and her family are not willing to live by the customs of the 21st century, and of a civilized, modern, secular country like Germany, where abusing of women is considered an offense and not "a right of the husband"...she, her psycho boyfriend/husband, and all her family can take the next plane to Turkey...and live there happily the rest of their lives, by the customs of the middle-ages.