How to get a court payment order (Mahnbescheid)

92 posts in this topic

Please can I ask for some honest advice (meaning, am I wasting my time, energy and of course money) with regard to my chasing money owed.

 

I received Title on the money owed that was submitted to the Courts plus a small amount for Legal fees? but obviously, by time we had him evicted, money owed for rent, bills,had increased and when I questioned my Lawyer as to the remainder owed he told me I would have to file for a Manbescheid but to wait until the Water bill had been received at the end of this month.

 

My questions are, if anyone would be kind enough to advise, the following:

 

1.  How do you check on line if someone is insolvent?  I understand there is an on-line way to do this?

 

Also, if he has filed for Bankruptcy, are his debts to me wiped out?  If so, why do you receive a 30 year Title from the court?

 

2.  Secondly, if I find out he has not filed for Bankruptcy and I apply for a Manbescheid and if I receive it, do I take both the Manbescheid and the Title Document to the Bailiff or am I really just not being realistic and just causing myself further stress and more money?  Basically, am I better to do one at a time, only one?  What, if any, would be my best plan of action.

 

Last year was the most stressful year I have ever had and whilst I would love to simply put all this behind and put it down to bad experience, I am also so angry that he is just walking away from this.  It caused us great financial worries, that together with family illness and Brexit...boy what a year!   Any advice would be much appreciated. 

 

Thank you.

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2 hours ago, RubyRose said:

1.  How do you check on line if someone is insolvent?  

I understand there is an on-line way to do this?

 

Search for the individual by name in the Privat Insolvenzbekanntmachungen register and, in case they also operate a business, in the Bekanntmachungen Gewerbliche (or HandelsGessellschaftliche?) Insolvenze here-> Justizportal - Insolvenzbekanntmachungen

 

Quote

Also, if he has filed for Bankruptcy, are his debts to me wiped out?  

 

Not automatically, however... if he has filed then you should immediately notify the appointed Insolvenzverwalter of any claim for debt you have in order for it to be be recognized as such, otherwise you may be ineligible to receive even a % of his assets or earnings towards settlement of your claim during the next 5 years.

 

If your claim is accepted in time by the Verwalter you should then be notified of any settlement plan offer made by the debtor('s legal advisor) - to which all creditors must agree or the Verwalter may have to resort to sharing out whatever monies they can encourage the debtor to submit (which may depend to some degree on the willingness or ability of the debtor to cooperate voluntarily - i.e. go to work).

 

Quote

If so, why do you receive a 30 year Title from the court?

 

That statute of limitation preceded by about 125 years the existence of any German law encompassing private bankruptcy, which was only established around 2001/2 AFAIR.

 

It may still be possible to enforce that Title after a bankruptcy has been discharged and the debtor has earned, acquired or inherited funds at some future time.

 

For definitive legal advice you should consult a 'Fachanwalt für Insolvenzrecht'. Albeit I have some experience I also have received various conflicting opinions to similar questions from several Rechtsanwälte who were not specialized in that specific field.

 

2 hours ago, RubyRose said:

2.  Secondly, if I find out he has not filed for Bankruptcy and I apply for a Manbescheid and if I receive it, do I take both the Manbescheid and the Title Document to the Bailiff or am I really just not being realistic and just causing myself further stress and more money?  Basically, am I better to do one at a time, only one?  What, if any, would be my best plan of action.

 

Yes. I don't really follow the point of your second question. Contact the court appointed Gerichtsvollzieher for the district (PLZ) of Frankfurt in which your debtor is located and ask them for their advice. You can find a list which can be filtered by Strassenverzeichniss (street addresses) under the webpages of the Frankfurt am Main (or Hoechst, Offenbach, etc.) Amtsgericht.

 

Directory of Places and Courts in Germany: Courts & Public Prosecutors finder (in English)

 

Good luck, and don't forget to post your results for the benefit of future readers with similar problems.

 

2B

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8 minutes ago, 2B_orNot2B said:

 

Search for the individual by name in the Privat Insolvenzbekanntmachungen register and, in case they also operate a small business, in the Beknnatmachungregister for Gewerbliche or Gessellschaftliche Insolvenze here-> Justizportal - Insolvenzbekanntmachungen

 

 

Not automatically, however... if he has filed then you should immediately notify the appointed Insolvenzverwalter of any claim for debt you have in order for it to be be recognized as such otherwise you may be ineligible to receive even a % of his assets or earnings towards settlement of your claim during the next 5 years.

 

If your claim is accepted in time by the Verwalter you should then be notified of any settlement plan offer made by the debtor('s legal advisor) - to which all creditors must agree or the Verwalter may have to resort to sharing out whatever monies they can encourage the debtor to submit (which may depend to some degree on the willingness of the debtor to cooperate voluntarily).

 

 

That statute of limitation preceded, by about 125 years, the existence of any German law encompassing private bankruptcy - which was only established around 2001/2 AFAIR. It may still be possible to enforce that Title after a bankruptcy has been discharged and the debtor has earned, aquired or inherited funds at some future time.

 

For definitive legal advice you should consult a 'Fachanwalt für Insolvenzrecht'. Albeit I have some experience I also have received various conflicting opinions to similar questions from several Rechtsanwälte who were not specialized in that specific field.

 

 

Yes. I don't really follow the point of your second question. Contact the court appointed Gerichtsvollzieher for the district (PLZ) of Frankfurt in which your debtor is located and ask them for their advice. You can find a list whih can be filtered by Strassenverzeichniss (street addresses) under the webpages of the Frankfurt am Main (, or Hoechst, Offenbach, etc.) Amtsgericht.

 

Directory of Places and Courts in Germany: Courts & Public Prosecutors finder (in English)

 

Good luck, and don't forget to post your results for the benefit of future readers with similar problems.

 

2B

Many thanks for your reply.  

 

I think I am also really trying to have validated my desire to proceed further with trying to claw back some money.  I am sad to read that often it is simply just not worth chasing and it is often suggested to simply put this horrible episode down to one of life horrible experiences.

 

It really has been very hard trying to navigate my way through the German Legal system and I have been lucky enough to have some great German friends and also read many links on Toytown which have been a fantastic source of help.  Sadly, my Lawyer, not so but that is a complete other story!

 

I will certainly post any further results.  Thanks again.

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Hi folks, sorry for the necro-bump on this thread.

 

I need to send my now-former employer a Mahnbescheid because he hasn't paid my last salary (May 2019, and I frankly can't write 2500 Eur net off), and I wanted to know if I will also need his home address for the form. If so, that's a bit of a problem because I don't know his home address at all, just the business address where I used to work.


Also: are there fees associated with getting a bailiff to help recover the money?

 

Thanks!

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16 minutes ago, Continuity said:

I need to send my now-former employer a Mahnbescheid because he hasn't paid my last salary (May 2019, and I frankly can't write 2500 Eur net off), and I wanted to know if I will also need his home address for the form. If so, that's a bit of a problem because I don't know his home address at all, just the business address where I used to work.

You have a work contract, don't you? The name  and address of the contractual party that is responsible and obliged to correctly pay you is certainly specified there...

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2 hours ago, franklan said:

You have a work contract, don't you? The name  and address of the contractual party that is responsible and obliged to correctly pay you is certainly specified there...

 

Correct, their business address.

 

But, the form to fill in also asks for the home address of the representatives of the company (in this case, the two owners, the ones who signed my employment contract), and this is information I don't have. So, can I simply use their business address instead?

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A guy i worked with before in muinich owes me 3000 euros which i loaned to him (bank transfer) to buy furniture for his apartment . I moved onto another city and emailed and rang hims several times to try and get my money back but no replies/anser. I don't know his current address but he probably lives in Augsburg. I'd say it'll be a major pain in the ass to get the money back off him but i want to try. 
can anyone advise a good lawyer who will take this one and not cost too much . 10% of the 3000 for example sounds reasonable ? am probably dreaming . thanks 

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8 hours ago, fraufruit said:

Do you have a signed contract?

 

No go if you don't.


Maybe if the reference in the transfer is “loan” that’d be good enough, but to be honest I am not sure. 

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12 hours ago, padjo said:


can anyone advise a good lawyer who will take this one and not cost too much . 10% of the 3000 for example sounds reasonable ? am probably dreaming . thanks 

 

Lawyers fees are regulated by law in Germany - the statutory fee constitutes a minimum fee in matters involving legal proceedings, such as law suits, administrative proceedings and the like. On one hand, this allows German lawyers to negotiate hourly-rate-based fees or even a lump-sum payment in the litigation context but at the same time it prohibits such fee agreement from handling the case for less than the statutory fee. Introduction in English by a Munich lawyer.

 

In other words: Yes you are dreaming. 

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Thanks for the replies . I think i referenced that it was a loan in the bank transfer. i didn't specify a due date for repayment , but it's certainly not 10years or infinite. 
I'll probably go down the mahnbescheid route. I simply don't want the bugger to get away with it without doing the best i can. i'm not rich or poor, it's not about the money, it's about not letting someone shaft me and think they can get away with it so easy, especially after i put myself out for him

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