Selling a car in Germany

52 posts in this topic

Currently trying to sell a car in Germany for the first time.

About 10 minutes ago I listed my car for sale on ebay kleinanzeige. Before I had confirmation that the ad was placed, my phone started ringing, and it was some chap wanting to buy...or at least know my best price. I have now had 18 missed calls in the time it has taken me to speak with that guy, and write this (now 19 calls).

I've stated my position (twice now) as being that I will only negotiate when they get here in person and look at the vehicle. That has always been my practice in the UK, but is that unreasonable/strange in Germany?

 

For info, I'm selling a ten year old Toyota Rav 4, so nothing unusual/valuable/rare. In terms of price, I looked at mobile.de and have chosen a price that I think (just - by about €100) makes my car the best price/age/km on offer and stated that it is a VB price. That's how I have always priced cars for sale in the UK. Again, is that usual here in Germany too, or have I been unusually generous (20 missed calls, and one genuine sounding bloke from Duesseldorf)?

 

Is there anything obviously dodgy I need to avoid when selling cars this way?

From what I can see from the above thread, I need to:

1) prepare a kaufvertrag

2) see the buyer's ID and driving licence

3) agree that any test drive is on his insurance (is that really usual? I've never done that in the UK)

4) get the cash/hand over the car's papers on signing the contract

5) remove the plates

6) deregister the car with a) the authorities and b ) my insurance company.

7) hand over the keys

8) ...spend more time on mobile.de looking for a T5/Vito.

 

Sound about right?

Sorry if this sounds a bit rushed, but (perhaps naively) I wasn't expecting such a frantic response to the car add, and need to make sure I don't make any school boy errors.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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All those calls you're getting are resellers, they've got their phones rigged to automatically call as soon as an ad like yours is posted.  So, like you said, virtually instantaneous.  Also super, super annoying.  Don't bother with any of those guys, they will ask you to hold the car for them, or offer a ridiculously low price, or spin some nonesense about buying a car for their dear old mom or some BS like that.

 

Only sell in person, only negotiate in person, don't hold the car for any one, and take cash only.  Once you demand those things, the resellers will back off quick enough, and you should be able to get through to the people who are seriously interested.

 

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I have been given the advice: make sure you exclude "Gewährleistung".

The ADAC offer sales contracts (must say I have not yet looked for myself).

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Thanks @kapokanadensis. Yes, all bar one of the folk I have spoken to yesterday is definitely a re-seller. To confirm your point about them spinning me a line, I simply stated to one of them that I assume they were buying trade or export, and he started to give me some blag about wanting the car for his own family! I'm sure they'd be delighted if he turned up in a 10 year old Toyota that has had my kids and dog running wild in it.

@HEM I excluded the guarantee and right of return on the ebay advert, but will make sure that point is also clear on the sales contract. Thanks.

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37 minutes ago, dstanners said:

Currently trying to sell a car in Germany for the first time.

 

It would have made more sense if you had asked your questions first ... ;)

 

All these calls are from (foreign) dealers who want to resell the car to Eastern Europe, the Middle East or Africa - and they are very persistent and penetrating. None of them will want to pay the price you have in mind. A disposable email address would have made more sense. Nevertheless a few remarks:

 

Quote

1) prepare a sales contract

 

Take a standard sales contract, like the one provided by ADAC.

 

Quote

3) agree that any test drive is on his insurance (is that really usual? I've never done that in the UK)

 

In Germany (unlike in the UK) it is not the drivers who are insured, but the vehicles.

 

Quote

5) remove the plates

 

Only works if the buyer comes with a transporter - and which private buyer has a car transporter/trailer? In addition, the vehicle must disappear immediately from the public space without a license plate and may only be parked on private property. 

 

Quote

8) ...spend more time on mobile.de looking for a T5/Vito.

 

It's worth reconsidering, given the threat of driving bans. 

 

 

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@HEM That's perfect. Not only does that link give me the kaufvertrag I need, the first page even includes a checklist (for the seller AND buyer).

All I need in one link. Sorry I can't give more than one reputation point.

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Deregister (Zulassung) the car yourself.

Don't let the buyer convince you that they'll do it 'soon'.

 

It's a bit more inconvenient, but protects you if they have a crash with your name still on the official paperwork. 

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2 hours ago, HH_Sailor said:

Deregister (Zulassung) the car yourself.

Don't let the buyer convince you that they'll do it 'soon'.

 

It's a bit more inconvenient, but protects you if they have a crash with your name still on the official paperwork. 

 

Also saves having to continue paying for the vehicle's insurance and KFZ-steuer!

 

2B

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Thanks @HH_Sailor and @2B_orNot2B, given the authorities are only open on weekdays, I assume that means that the sale shouldn't take place over the weekend? I saw from the ADAC guide that they recommend going with the purchaser to the registration office.

It was so much easier in the UK, when you could just tear the slip off the V5!

 

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1 hour ago, dstanners said:

given the authorities are only open on weekdays, I assume that means that the sale shouldn't take place over the weekend?

 

I've noticed over the last couple of years that a gradually increasing number of Kfz-Zulassungsstelle are opening on Saturday mornings in a move to be more 'Bürgerfreundlich' towards those of their customers who have to work all week, so you might want to check the website of your local one.

 

Prospective buyers may talk about getting red on white plates called Überführungskennzeichen but the rules on their use of changed wef 01.04.2015 so for plates needed for an Überführungsfahrt they will now issue so-called Kurzzeitkennzeichen.

 

Whoever intends to obtain Kurzzeitkennzeichen should bring their German Personalausweiss or

Passport plus a Meldebescheinigung issued within the preceding 3 months

 

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gültiger Personalausweis oder Reisepass mit aktueller Meldebescheinigung des Bürgeramtes/Meldebehörde.
Bei Vorlage des Reisepasses oder ausländischen Personalausweises und einer Meldebescheinigung, deren Ausstellungsdatum über drei Monate zurück liegt, oder bei Nichtvorlage der Meldebescheinigung ist ein gebührenpflichtiger Abruf der Meldedaten erforderlich.

 

And have a Versicherungsbestätigungsnummer (sog. eVB) available as well as the vehicle's

Original Zulassungsbescheinigung Teil I (Fahrzeugschein) 

plus proof of a valid HU either by presentation of the actual HU (TüV) pass report or by virtue of a valid stamp in the Zulassungsbescheinigung Teil I

 

If they come that well prepared you just need to take their money and drive them to the registration office and deregister it while they apply for their transit plates before driving you back home.

 

Alternatively, if you've no particular cause for suspicion, you could tell them you will need an extra security deposit of ~250 - 350 € returnable by bank transfer in exchange for the vehicle  Abmeldungsbescheinigung issued by their local vehicle registration office.

 

GL

 

2B

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So, here's an update and a recommendation for people wanting to sell cars in Germany. I sold my car about two hours ago.

I had the car advertised on mobile.de and ebay kleinanzeigen.

After a lots of calls, and one guy who was about to buy it, but had messed me around a bit, I decided to book an appointment using mobile.de's Express verkauf system. It works a lot like wirkaufdeinauto, so I was sceptical that it'd be the usual BS of "we think your car is worth 100k" only to turn up and be offered €1. However, as it costs nothing to use (unlike the €400 minimum for abracar if your car sells!), and there was a garage only 20 minutes from me, I decided to give it a go. The indicative price was about what I was asking, and the appointment was made for just an hour later. Usual bit of haggling with the seller (lots of grimacing when looking at the tyres/brakes etc), and he made an offer just a few hundred €s less than the "indicative" price. After a bit of haggling (me showing other cars on mobile.de, and all the receipts for the work I had done), we actually ended up €300 OVER the "indicative" price.

So: all in all a good result, and I can thoroughly recommend the Express verkauf on mobile.de. 

 

Typically, a minute after I'd left the garage, the guy who had been messing me around turned up at my house with the cash. It would have been €100 less than I got with the express verkauf anyway, and I'm sure he was the sort of buyer who'd have wanted to complain weeks later if the brakes were wearing out or the tyre tread was reducing. 

 

I'll miss my daily chat with a bloke in Bosnia though: he kept telling me he would get a bus from Bosnia to my house. He wasn't put off by 1) the fact that I live half way up a mountain in the middle of a national park, 2) that there wouldn't be room for a bus to fit around the roads here even if there was a bus service, and 3) my clear recommendation that he would be better off looking for a different car.

 

 

 

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