Lufthansa's Miles & More program

177 posts in this topic

Yes, this sort of loyalty scheme's had its day I think, and not only airlines.    I'm not surprised it will be linked to price, more closely, that's for sure.   I was always surprised it so often seemed not to be.    I'm only a passive recipient of them (i.e. when they come with a business trip) and I just donate them, see them as part of my giving.  Easier to keep my flight choices separate.

 

What Lufthansa is getting better at imho is individual offers and flexibility.   I don't mind paying a small supplement for business or whatever, from time to time, if they send me a mail offering it.      

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5 hours ago, swimmer said:

I don't mind paying a small supplement for business

 

How much would be a small supplement for business class?  Just asking because I've never seen such a thing.
 

 

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On 24/02/2017, 21:35:21, chickenmadras said:

Hi everyone, looks like this thread has been pretty dormant for a while but just wanted to share a link to my blog article on this topic. I would concur that Lufthansa's Miles and More program is a shitty product, almost verging on a scam, compared to what their Star Alliance competitors have on offer. I hope this is useful.

 

 

If the qualifying trips to Greece are not a problem, Aegean is probably the easiest Star Alliance Gold to get for most people.

 

Amex Platinum holders / Sangri-La jade members can get Singapore Airlines Gold status if they take three qualifying flights within four months (I think they had a MAN-MUC service a few years ago which would have made this really simple, but sadly not anymore so long haul flights instead)

 

I'm two segments away from M&M FTL mostly courtesy of Brussels Airlines; what I find surprising is that it was easier to get BA Silver, which gives a lot more benefits, than it was to get M&M FTL.

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On 31.7.2018, 02:49:06, Mackle said:

 

If the qualifying trips to Greece are not a problem, Aegean is probably the easiest Star Alliance Gold to get for most people.

 

Amex Platinum holders / Sangri-La jade members can get Singapore Airlines Gold status if they take three qualifying flights within four months (I think they had a MAN-MUC service a few years ago which would have made this really simple, but sadly not anymore so long haul flights instead)

 

I'm two segments away from M&M FTL mostly courtesy of Brussels Airlines; what I find surprising is that it was easier to get BA Silver, which gives a lot more benefits, than it was to get M&M FTL.

If you live in muc or Fra it’s fine, the rest of us in Germany are fkd as only Eurowings is left unless you fly to said airports. I can only get my FTL through legs ( 30 needed, currently 29). Thus the problem that Eurowings is N O T staralliance even though it’s the Lufthansa group. As I’m usually inner Europe it’s atleast lounge access at LH airports. Still sort off sad m&m :(

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7 hours ago, Mapleleafdude said:

If you live in muc or Fra it’s fine, the rest of us in Germany are fkd as only Eurowings is left unless you fly to said airports. I can only get my FTL through legs ( 30 needed, currently 29). Thus the problem that Eurowings is N O T staralliance even though it’s the Lufthansa group. As I’m usually inner Europe it’s atleast lounge access at LH airports. Still sort off sad m&m :(

 

I'm afraid to say that Lufthansa are not bothered because simply you don't spend enough!

 

If you take 30 flights and each costs an average of 400 - 500 euros (not unrealistic for a business trip) then you will pay 6000 - 7500 Euros a year.

Compared to somebody who flies first class who pay between 5,000 - 11,000 (depending on flexibility) for a first class ticket to the USA then I'm afraid that you are just not important enough!

 

I know what you mean, I have travelled a lot in the past and when you are flying 20 - 50 or more times a year you do feel that you should earn some respect from so much loyalty, but unfortunately it doesn't work like that and it is all about the money.

 

There was an interesting article on the BusinessTraveller website last week:

https://www.businesstraveller.com/business-travel/2018/10/12/shoddy-airline-service-has-no-impact-on-profits-study-says/

 

 

It basically says that the service level of airlines does not impact profits.   So there is no reason for airlines to treat passengers well! 

 

Quote

Forbes reported October 7, 2018 that researchers found no relationship between customer satisfaction ratings and airlines’ financial performance.

 

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8 hours ago, Mapleleafdude said:

If you live in muc or Fra it’s fine, the rest of us in Germany are fkd as only Eurowings is left unless you fly to said airports. I can only get my FTL through legs ( 30 needed, currently 29). Thus the problem that Eurowings is N O T staralliance even though it’s the Lufthansa group.

Its a bit like with Condor (with whom LH often exchange pilots): when it suits them Eurowings are part of Lufthansa & when it suits them they are not.

 

Eurowings have also removed the service between Hamburg & Manchester (at one time operated twice daily except at weekend by LH Cityline).

Thus there is only Ryanair or the late night Easyjet service - neither of which are particularly palatable.

 

22 minutes ago, dj_jay_smith said:

but unfortunately it doesn't work like that and it is all about the money.

Miles & More should be renamed to Euros and Less...

Some time ago there was a mail from them that in future the "miles" awarded would be dependent on the price paid for the ticket rather than the distance.

 

Also - if anyone has a LH/M&M credit card (which I have to avoid my miles from expiring) they will have noticed that with the recent "new software" that they get less miles.

Previously they would sum all Euros spent within the time period (approximately one month), divide by two & round down to the whole Euro to yield the number of new "miles".

Now they do this for each purchase.

So where previously you "lost" max. one mile per month you now lose up to (almost) one per purchase.  It all adds up of course.

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3 hours ago, HEM said:

Some time ago there was a mail from them that in future the "miles" awarded would be dependent on the price paid for the ticket rather than the distance.

 

I believe a lot of airlines are doing this now. I don't know how they get away with still calling them mileage programs.

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On ‎14‎/‎10‎/‎2018‎ ‎23‎:‎39‎:‎34, Mapleleafdude said:

If you live in muc or Fra it’s fine, the rest of us in Germany are fkd as only Eurowings is left unless you fly to said airports. I can only get my FTL through legs ( 30 needed, currently 29). Thus the problem that Eurowings is N O T staralliance even though it’s the Lufthansa group. As I’m usually inner Europe it’s atleast lounge access at LH airports. Still sort off sad m&m :(

 

I think I see what you are saying; EW are a Miles and More partner so 30 segments will get you FTL, but with your nice shiny silver FTL card you won't have access to Star Alliance partner lounges because you are flying with EW?

 

I *think* that if you are flying a certain type of EW ticket, you will at least be allowed in to Miles and More / Lufthansa Group lounges (so Austrian / Brussels / Suisse / etc.) but of course that's dependant on there being one in the airport you are flying from.

 

If it is just lounges that you want, remember that some charge/credit cards come with either Priority Pass or Dragon Pass membership.

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On ‎15‎/‎10‎/‎2018‎ ‎07‎:‎59‎:‎31, HEM said:

Also - if anyone has a LH/M&M credit card (which I have to avoid my miles from expiring) they will have noticed that with the recent "new software" that they get less miles.

Previously they would sum all Euros spent within the time period (approximately one month), divide by two & round down to the whole Euro to yield the number of new "miles".

Now they do this for each purchase.

So where previously you "lost" max. one mile per month you now lose up to (almost) one per purchase.  It all adds up of course.

 

In Belgium there is a Miles and More Amex which gives 1.5 M&M points per Euro spent. 

 

The DE M&M MasterCard on the other hand is 0.5 M&M points per Euro spent - why do the Belgians get offered a better deal when Lufthansa are based here?!?! 

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On 17.10.2018, 01:25:56, Mackle said:

 

I think I see what you are saying; EW are a Miles and More partner so 30 segments will get you FTL, but with your nice shiny silver FTL card you won't have access to Star Alliance partner lounges because you are flying with EW?

 

I *think* that if you are flying a certain type of EW ticket, you will at least be allowed in to Miles and More / Lufthansa Group lounges (so Austrian / Brussels / Suisse / etc.) but of course that's dependant on there being one in the airport you are flying from.

 

If it is just lounges that you want, remember that some charge/credit cards come with either Priority Pass or Dragon Pass membership.

I only do it for the LH lounge access (no access to staralliance Partner lounges is correct) which covers my needs for most airports in D-A-CH and CDG. Priority isn’t an issue as I try to be the last person on the plane and priority security is usually useless. Oh and I get a second piece of cabin baggage free which I don’t even usually use but sometimes it’s handy. 

 

Just looked and maybe I’ll switch to united miles in January and maybe with a mileage run or two get gold there ;) for the next two years. 

 

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22 hours ago, Mapleleafdude said:

I only do it for the LH lounge access (no access to staralliance Partner lounges is correct) which covers my needs for most airports in D-A-CH and CDG. Priority isn’t an issue as I try to be the last person on the plane and priority security is usually useless. Oh and I get a second piece of cabin baggage free which I don’t even usually use but sometimes it’s handy. 

 

Just looked and maybe I’ll switch to united miles in January and maybe with a mileage run or two get gold there ;) for the next two years. 

 

 

 

Some of the non-airline owned lounges are pretty good - in LHR T5 I tend to use the Plaza Premium instead of the BA ones (especially at breakfast time because BA's omelette rolls are not very appealing), and the new Prime Class lounge in FRA T2 is much better than the JAL one that BA passengers are directed to use.

 

 

If you can meet the pre-reqs, United might not be a bad shout. I think lots of European-based flyers find Aegean and Turkish the easiest to get Star Alliance Gold with.

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A colleague of mine said that you cannot use miles obtained from company flights to purchase private flights, due to tax reasons. Is this true?

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Somewhere on our intranet there are t&c from our HR. These say we should use any points gained to reduce the next company flight costs.

 

Colleagues however, say they they don't have a company card- they have privately applied for the m&m card. So the company doesn't 'know'.

 

I imagine that the miles obtained from a flight paid for by the company are in fact subject to a tiny Geldwertvorteil. You can use privately but need to declare on the annual return. 

 

I've never had that many :(

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1 hour ago, MikeMelga said:

A colleague of mine said that you cannot use miles obtained from company flights to purchase private flights, due to tax reasons. Is this true?

 

You can use them but the Finanzamt are craking down and taxing the hell out of people using their business-earned miles for private stuff. Not only flights but also goods bought in our Lufthansa WorldShops.

For example a customer came into the shop a few weeks ago, I checked the miles on the card and there were about 1.5 million. They bought something not so expensive and I asked if they wanted to pay with their Miles. The answer took me back "No, I don't use the miles for anything, I just let them expire as I can't be bothered arguing with the Finanzamt about what's for business and what's for private use".

 

Edit:

Also if you use Miles to 'pay' for a flight then you still have to pay the airport taxes. I've spoken to a couple of people who used them for flights to USA & Canada and still had to pay around €900 in 'taxes'.

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9 minutes ago, HH_Sailor said:

Somewhere on our intranet there are t&c from our HR. These say we should use any points gained to reduce the next company flight costs.

Or upgrade class, I guess...

9 minutes ago, HH_Sailor said:

I imagine that the miles obtained from a flight paid for by the company are in fact subject to a tiny Geldwertvorteil. You can use privately but need to declare on the annual return. 

Ok, I will discuss with my tax accountant.

 

9 minutes ago, HH_Sailor said:

 

I've never had that many :(

Got lucky, booked an emergency flight on Black Friday and got a ton of miles to add to my balance. Currently enough for 2 flights to Portugal or 2 upgrades for Asia flights.

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10 minutes ago, Malt-Teaser said:

For example a customer came into the shop a few weeks ago, I checked the miles on the card and there were about 1.5 million. They bought something not so expensive and I asked if they wanted to pay with their Miles. The answer took me back "No, I don't use the miles for anything, I just let them expire as I can't be bothered arguing with the Finanzamt about what's for business and what's for private use".

This doesn't make sense, as you can use them to upgrade the flights. The only exception is if you always fly first class.

 

 

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I had no idea that the Finanzamt is interested in one's personal travel, what one pays for a plane ticket and how.

 

I have heard that some companies now have contracts with certain airlines where the company accrues the points for other business travel.

 

Himself used all of his points privately throughout his career. Plane tickets, hotels, etc. for us.

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